You are confusing “realistic” and “historically accurate”.
Maybe a bit, but many of the concepts still holds.
Tank parts randomly getting destroyed, tanks randomly catching on fire, your tank randomly blowing up is realistic (and historically accurate).
Late war german armor breaking apart, germany rarely giving APCR to troops, germany having fuel shortages, soviet welding breaking apart, and so on. There are more such realistic things that could be added that would make the game unplayable.
EDIT:
Low level crew abandoning tank if it gets hit? Surely it would be a great addition!
Oh, one realistic thing would be nice: Aircraft taking 30-60+ minutes to replenish with fuel and ammo, and days or weeks to repair! That would be actually a great thing!
Don’t forget no radios or FPE on early Russian tanks.
So historically speaking they should have no chat. ^^
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That would be fun lol.
Still the same old story and discussion with players who don’t even play in the GRB?
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Yep…straying into the RB section and attacking WT players for being WT players.
Yet TO advocates wonder why they’re not taken very seriously…TO has suffered terribly at the hands of its own supposed supporters.
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No they do however take part in ground battles.
If they wouldn’t be able to attack ground targets they would be mostly useless in a war.
I mean it’s called “ground attack aircraft” for a reason. Those aircraft are designed to attack targets on the ground and take part in ground offensives. Hell helicopters are almost exclusively designed for that.
What you describe is called accuracy or authenticity not realism.
I wasn’t advocating for historical MM. I was using examples to show that aircraft do belong in ground battles. Since all great ground battles had them.even battles defining ground warfare had planes taking part.
That was the entire point, that even battles that are known as tank battles not just as Ground battles actually had a similar number of planes in them as tanks. Kursk is the(!) tank battle in history and it still had almost as many planes on the german side as tanks on the german side. A tank(!) battle.
I don’t know how you misunderstood this.
You are completely missing the point of my post.
I am in support of RB TO. But the “it’s called ground battles” argument is stupid and it needs to stop.
Those would be stationary, and we have stationary air defenses in the game. This doesn’t counter the argument that any player controlled ground vehicle would be useless and wouldn’t have anything to do.
So my point remains.
It depends. It should definately be in sim. Since you emulate vehicles in a simulator and those imbalances would need to be recreated as well. In RB sure we can have balance. I am all for RB TO. I am pretty sure i stated that outright in my post. I am just against the ridiculous arguments you made in the post before. Balance and fun gameplay are very valid arguments. “It’s called ground battles” is not a valid argument.
I want to differentiate between reasonable and unreasonable arguments.
Sure, but again that wasn’t my point and has nothing to do with my argument.
Can you stick to what i actually posted instead of engaging in some weird shadowboxing against arguments i never made. I never said WT has a perfect representation of combined arms. I would never do that tanks are way too ridiculous for that.
I never denied imbalance, i tried to explain why planes in ground battles make logical sense while tanks in air battles doesn’t.
I never once said in my post that it is balanced. I explained why the logic of your arguments was flawed.
Major difference.
That’s because you completely misunderstood them.
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So lets include ships in ground battles because they can attack ground? See how that doesn’t make sense?
SPAA is nearly universally underpowered against aircraft across almost every BR range in this game. SPAA take skill to hit a plane, especially without radar. Aircraft can get kills by dying and pressing spacebar while ‘dead’. If you want to balance aircraft with ground vehicles with the current balance system, it should take effort to get one. A death with no kills shouldn’t get you an aircraft. A single kill shouldn’t be getting you an aircraft. Make people work for their spacebar minigame. Make it require the smallest quantity of skill to deny gameplay to others who have very little recourse against you.
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War != game about war.
And they can do it in their AIR mode as well :)
Nope, it is realism.
I did not. You made a statement, that even the greatest tank battles had aircraft, which is true.
But it does not have to be the same in game, because planes are too strong compared to tanks.
You are literally advocating for planes. I mean i understad why, but saying you support TO is just stupid.
No.
Speaking about missing the point.
Yes, long range SAMs would be stationary. And on most maps they would annihilate planes, just like planes do it to tanks.
And WT is not a sim. It has a sim mode, that is barely played.
Even games like GHPC, that are much more sims than WT do not have matches where you go with a T-34 against an M60.
You mean the “argument” you made?
It is. Imagine you download a game called “Swords and bows” and you get mowed down by a noob using an MG42 because he is trash with swords and bows, and the game instead of teaching him, just gives him a cheap and braindead easy tool so he keeps playing.
Again, utter nonsense.
Sure buddy sure.
Stats show how effective you are, and in general how effective vehicles are.
He is unable to understand it. He made a shit “argument” and now he is in hardcore damage control mode after i applied his own strategy on things he don’t like.
That’s the neat part - you can’t.
CAS is not balancable.
+1.
But then how would all the CAS enjoyers get even a chance to spawn in with their plane?
How could they earn more when they can’t even get a positive K/D (on average)?
it is the entire point of CAS - to give trash players an essentially uncounterable, braindead easy and overkill tool, so they don’t have to learn to play with tanks.
It is the same. Tanks have basically no chance.
Excuse me what?
Aircraft are far less of an issue in AB, and its not even bombs that are the scariest thing there. The only issue is rockets, mainly HVARs, with people that know how to aim and use them.
(And/or anything with tiny tims, but thats to be expected)
Like you have to be very careful where you drop your bombs because of the 10s timer- combine that with arcade mobility. If you are actually aware, you can avoid them 90-95% of the time.
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Your overall KDR will drop if you play more SPAAs, because you will die more to tanks than when playing tanks. A lot of tank mains has good KDR because they like to preserve their vehicles, rather than racing to the point to spawn a CAS.
1, bombs don’t have 10s timer. It is random. Many times you are lucky if it is 2s on a bomber. On strike aircraft it is ~2-4s usually. Still nowhere near enough to escape with most tanks.
2, tanks have these pesky things, called “engine”, “transmission”, “track”, “driver”. I think you know where this goes.
3, many times you literally can’t move, because if you move you will get killed by other tanks. Tho if i have to choose, i’d rather give my tank to an enemy tank user than to some loser abusing CAS. Or i just leave my tank before the bomb explodes. If a CAS enjoer wants to kill me, then he needs to learn to play with tanks.
So please don’t talk about things that you don’t know.
But they cannot always do that. Only if a sufficient body of water exists close enough to the battle.
Aircraft don’t have that limitation.
I agree that aircraft profit way more from mouse aim.
I also think there should be RB TO.
This has nothing to do with the argument i was responding to.
But i wouldn’t use the word universally, since that indicates that SPAA is harder to use outside of RB as well… Which isn’t true.
Sure, but you argument was “it’s called a ground battle” and that Argument doesn’t fly.
Because what a ground battle is, is defined by ground battles that have happened. And those die have aircraft partaking.
RB is a cartoony shooter, it of course can have tank only battles. But it isn’t because they are called ground battles. They are also called realistic battles, but they have tank guns phasing through objects and tanks having spare cannons magically materializing.
So what it is called is irrelevant.
Sure, but irrelevant to the argument i was making.
Then they do partake in ground battles on the air map. They still partake in ground battles. So the name ground battles is not the reason they should not be allowed.
You do understand that i am attacking your argument not your position?
You come up with argument after argument, for your position, but you are not defending the stupid “it’s called ground battles” argument which i am actually attacking.
It isn’t.
No that wasn’t the point. My point was that these battles are all understood to be ground battles. So if gaijin calls something “ground battles”, then the name “ground battles” does not suggest that there are no aircraft. Since aircraft in ground battles are the norm and not the exception in the real world as well.
Therefore just because gaijin calls it ground battles is NOT a reason for it not to have planes. There might be other reasons but the name isn’t one.
I am not advocating for planes. Geez… Is it that hard to understand?
I am not even adressing the Situation of aircraft in RB at all. I am adressing a specific sentences you posted:
And
Since this indicates you thinking that a mode called “ground battles” shouldn’t have planes in them. It’s that reasoning i am trying to show to be wrong. Nothing else.
So the only point inam making is that gaijin does not need to call ground battles “combined arms” since the general perception of ground battles and tank battles already has aircraft partaking in them.
So the arguing about the name is useless.
So, how do you evaluate a CAS player who has already achieved two or more or even 7-8 kills in a tank? many of the CAS player are also a good tank player too
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I do know…?
Bombs have a 10s timer in arcade, starting from when the bomb is dropped. Tanks are generally mobile enough to move, exceptions being open-topped SPAA- though they should generally be able to shoot down the plane if its coming at them. (And/or if your tank is disabled, though CAS aiming for them is fine.)
Bombs are inconsistent, and take time to detonate in AB. If you are aware, you can be pretty safe from them.
What you do have to fear is anything with Tiny Tims or someone who knows how to use HVARs, because they can pop 2-3 tanks per spawn.
Speaking as someone that does use CAS in arcade a good amount, bring along a closed-top SPAA like a Skink or Coelian, it does a lot against them- they cant strafe it.