Battle Rating changes for January 2024 (post feedback)

What was your point then? The TPK has a number of advantages over the BTR-ZD. You just picked 3 very specific stats from over a dozen relevant ones to compare and judged them only on that, wondering why they’re the same BR.

and saying “the BTR is better in every single way” was just entirely wrong, as I showed you.

sigh … and you picked stats that are even less relevant …

Ok more ammo, but smaller calibre so you need more shells to down a plane cuz you often just do “hit”.

Why even compare top speed ? You’re supposed to be an AA staying behind the main force. Even if we wanted to compare speed, you’ll never reach 90kmh in the TPK and any mud/obstacle will bring you under 40.

Ok better reverse … and ? How useful is that gonna be on an AA ?

I’ll take a minute for the ricochet angle cuz i don’t understand how dumb you can be to use a number like that in a comparison between AA. Ok so the TPK’s got better angle penetration … and ? Purely useless against planes and light tanks that have no armour at all. Give me just one tank that the TPK can pen and not the BTR thw to the angle penetration. And furthermore, how could you even engage tanks when you can’t even shoot in front of you ?

You just took a handful of irrelevant stats and threw them in to give the sensation that the TPK has many advantages.
75% of the points you stated are either purely useless or so similar to the ones of the BTR that it doesn’t make a difference in actual combat.
The only valid point you made is the belt size but mitigate by the smaller caliber of the gun so i’m still saying that the TPK is inferior and so is everyone else btw.

because the actual gun stats are less relevant than armor that only protects against 7.62 or calibre size in itself, lmao.

as if 20mm vs 23mm makes that much of a difference, get serious. Better fire rate, shell velocity, and bigger belt size helps you to hit better in the first place. it’s not like a plane has 50 HP and the 23mm deals 50 damage while the 20mm deals 48 damage.

I was just mentioning some stats that are about as relevant as the armor on the BTR over the TPK, or the calibre difference of 20mm vs 23mm. you see how weird picking a couple things out and calling one better than the other is?

Again, no idea why you think 23mm vs 20mm makes a huge difference. RPM, belt size and shell velocity are much more important. I’ve used the 20mms on the Marders alot for AA purposes and they’re more than sufficient to onehit planes with, at a much higher BR.

Did you even see any of the images I showed you? The armor was comparable, full stop. The only time it wasn’t was at 11.3.

Other Russian top tier tanks lack thermals, can’t remember off the top of my head about smoke but why would it matter if it had smoke if thermals are apparently god’s gift to top tier.

Lol you want to try it like that? The Obj 292 has armor better than the 11.7 Ariete AMV, therefore the Obj 292 should be at 11.7.

At 11.3. 11.3.

If it survives a single shot it’s not a glass cannon.

Lol then why add it to the game if it’s useless? Oh wait, it’s a glass cannon like I’ve been saying, otherwise there wouldn’t be a point to its addition?

I’m talking about the amount of damage you’re doing.

Doing a lot of damage and low survivability is what makes a glass cannon, not mobility. You aren’t going to look at the 90/53 M41M and say it’s not a glass cannon because it’s slow. The Obj 292 is not slow and it does not have paper-thin armor like the Type 10, therefore it needs to be moved to a BR where it at least has paper-thin armor.

Lol, what? There’s no difference from only being able to shoot at only some weakspots versus lolpenning literally every piece of armor in the game? Really?

You can pen parts of the Leopard’s turret cheeks, not all of it is impenetrable. And that was with DM53, since as far as I know I can’t choose the Obj 292’s rounds in protection analysis.

DM53 has enough pen to pen the Strv 122+'s UFP, what do you mean the better penning Obj 292 round wouldn’t?

Penned it with DM53 in protection analysis.

This and the Abrams’ turret cheeks were the only ones I couldn’t pen with DM53.

Not every match is only hull-down snipe fests, Gaijin actually has been preferring forcing CQC down everyone’s throats.

Man the Leopard 2A7V, Abrams SEPv2, Black Knight, Markava Mk.4M, and Strv 122+ really need buffs then, it’s got worse mobility than the Obj 292! Plus the Challenger 2E and Challenger 3, which only has a 0.1 hp/ton advantage in mobility! I mean I don’t remember any of those tanks having effective ERA…

All of this is stuff a glass cannon should have to deal with in trade for the damage they do.

You mean the thing that won’t happen if you just hold down ‘C’?

It doesn’t have a proxy round either.

You mean a difference so small it doesn’t factor in to the vast majority of gameplay scenarios?

All this stuff is just something a glass cannon is going to have to deal with. Plus it should be the one flanking, not being flanked.

It quite literally has better armor than the T-80B, I have straight up no idea what you’re talking about lol.

I was using it since I already had images from a different thread, of which I was using the IMP1 to shoot M833 (a 10.0 round) because someone I was talking to there used the CCVL event vehicle which I don’t have.

Anything beyond 1v1 you’re going to die regardless unless the multiple enemies somehow shoot within the like 1-2 second interval of the reloads overlapping.

Because it can take out better armored targets, and the Type 90 can’t.

Except other tanks can’t lolpen stuff. What use is a better reload if it does no damage?

Then bare minimum put it at 11.0, where it at least isn’t always 11.7, but there are still rounds that can actually pen most of its UFP and turret.

The QN506 and AGS need to be removed from this Sim lineup.

image

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Don’t forget the CV90105. That thing is also absolutely busted in this particular sim bracket.

The Russian variant that could fire R24s was the MLA, not the ML. The ML was simply a slight redesign with a better engine, though it lacked the radar of the MLA that allowed it to fire R-24s.

IRST mounts were implemented onto the 141 later in its staging phase, though was never tested.

That’s what somebody else had said to him, though…?

He does have a solid win rate though. Just noticed this. Props @_Renzo, do you play with friends or are the win rates all solo?

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The “Eridanus Supervoid” between Français 1 40/70 and 1 40/56 is getting bigger and bigger…

I played the first 50-75 games in the SEPv2 with friends after the update.

But I have barely, if at all, played US top tier ground in a squad in the last 1-1.5 months. If I was in a squad playing top tier I would usually swap to Germany, Israel, China or Russia. Because of 2 reasons:

  1. I wanted to see how low my US winrate could get when playing solo. Seeing as my SEPv2 has been sitting at around 50% for weeks now, I guess that is the answer.

  2. I simply have/had grinding to do for these trees.

I almost have 1:1 kd in the sep v2 but win rate is still trash(I haven’t played it much in the last month) I get frustrated and quit after about 6 hours of grinding it. So when I come back to use again later, I have to retrain myself how use the sep v2 again. But I stopped using Abrams. I only play 10:3(strykers) and below now. I’ve used the LAV at every tier above 10– I just noticed it’s my most used vehicle……lol - I noticed y’all’s disagreements and wanted to state I do not use my SPAA first lol 😂 . I’ve universally used it the most.

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“Why yes, I enjoy LAV-AD.”
giga-chad
“How could you tell?”

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There was way too much green on the “10.0” round to be considered good armor, especially since the LFP is lethal in most cases, contrary to most other tanks.

Only one that lacks at 10.3+ is the UM2, which has APS. It’s not god’s gift, but it certainly helps with spotting when sniping, which is pretty much the only thing the Obj 292 can do kinda well (but doesn’t even have all the additional tools for that other tanks have).

10.0, the area around the vicinity of the mantlet you can go through is large.

I guess not a single light tank or even truck with a gun is a glass cannon then, since they can all survive badly aimed shots.

Because its a funky prototype, perfect for an event tank. It’s not meant to be an amazing tank, just a fun little gimmick, like the QN506 or LOSAT, for example. Or most of the recent event planes. Can’t speak for naval since I don’t play it.

Which makes no sense since a well played shot with a 120mm DM23 can do the same damage as this. More pen and more shell weight can certainly help, but once you reach a certain level of both, having a better reload does way more. If I can pen the important weakspots and disable gunners/drivers/breaches/engines, it doesn’t help much to disable them harder.
Or, in other words, sacrificing alot of DPS for a little more alpha damage isn’t useful in most situations.

So why is the 90/53 M41M 3.7 and the Breda 501 4.7, with the exact same gun and ammo on a more mobile chassis?
Because strong guns without the mobility to back them up aren’t all that strong.
And reverse matters alot at top tier, it’s why even though people cry about the T-80BVM and T-90M, they really don’t perform all that well.

Just having a good UFP won’t make it great at 10.0. Especially since your reload is so long, enemies can take their time to push you and aim well, worst case taking out your gun, which makes you a sitting duck. While 12km/h is better than 3km/h in reverse, it’s abysmal compared to to usual 31km/h or better other tanks have.
Hint, the Type 10 is faster in reverse than the 292 forwards.

  1. there is a slight difference in being able to pen a few more weakspots, but you can still be fine without that
  2. as I said, you don’t lolpen every piece of armor. Your armor analysis further down the reply seems weird since most of the cheeks of toptier tanks are >700mm effective, and finding small armor holes where it is less that you’d have to pixel snipe won’t help you in actual battle.

The beak, not the upper part of the UFP.

in CQC weakspots become more prominent, so pen matters even less and reload matters even more

All have better mobility (much better reverse, dunno why I have to repeat myself over and over for this), some have APS which is a big survivability increase, all of them have armor that works even against the 292 (some even have enough armour to tank missiles to the turret, so they don’t even need the ERA), while all of them lolpen the 292. All of them have half or almost half the reload of the 292.

If you are nothing but gun, your tank sucks. There are plenty of glass cannons in game already that have good mobility, because if you can’t bring your gun into position, all the firepower in the world doesn’t do anything for you.
It should deal with the reload, and it can deal with the mobility issues, which it can at 10.0, because there it has a noticeable advantage over other guns. that starts to dwindle heavily at 11.0.
That’s why the 90/53 M41M with its terrible mobility sits at a BR where its gun is alot stronger than its contempories, and the Breda 501 is at a BR where similar tanks start to catch up in gun performance.

It was about using a roof MG, not proxy main calibre shells. I was talking about when they closed in. But you can’t even do anything against them in the 292, since you don’t even have a roof MG, contrary to its russian brothers.

hilly terrain messes with your elevation (if you lock it using C you lock your turret too, and the turret traverse is already bad enough), there are a couple maps where you have to react to enemies above you, or react to enemies at your level after you dealt with enemies above you, etc
All not too common, but a single awkward situation where you can’t get your gun on target in time can mean the difference between having a bad or okayish game and having a really good game.

  1. if the advantage its gun gives it is big enough, sure. it wouldn’t be at 11.0.
  2. for flanking, reload is alot more important than pen. you’re shooting at weak sides, so what do you need all that pen for? even less of a reason to bump its BR up.
  3. you’re always susceptible to getting flanked, people flank popular flanking spots, or notice you and try to get you out of your position to help their team. or even just come back from an unexpected angle after getting killed by you to get revenge.

Except for the part where it dies to most missiles and the T-80B can eat the non-tandem ones, both from lower BR vehicles brought up and stock ones on IFVs around that BR. You know, things that actually otherwise struggle with your frontal armour?

2v1 doesnt mean sitting in an open field with 2 enemies staring you down. there’s retreating behind cover before the second tank comes out of cover to kill you, reloading quickly enough to shoot first before they come out of cover and aim, reloading quickly enough to kill them when they push into your cover, and others.
Type 90s can sometimes even shoot the dirt and take a shot before they round the corner bc they thought they have the time.

  1. In a Type 90 you tend to flank, where no armor matters because all the sides are butter.
  2. Give me any tank and I’ll tell you how to kill it frontally, either on the first shot, or where to put the second shot after taking out the breach. The Type 90s are my favourite tanks at high tier and I haven’t struggled against anything in them.

What use is a lolpen when you can shoot weakspots that EVERY tank at that BR has frontally and have the same effect, but do so almost twice as often?
What use is a lolpen when you flank and shoot at weak sides?
What use is a lolpen when you kill one tank then die to the next one coming around the corner or turning around for you, bc you can neither retreat nor reload in time?
What use is a lolpen that doesn’t actually lolpen because you want to throw that thing so far up in BR that it regularly faces tanks that actually withstand its round?
What use is a lolpen when center mass twitch-shooter-style click doesn’t even end in a disable, let alone a kill? (greetings from spall liners this thing would face regularly at 11.0)

Honestly, if you said to put it at 10.3 I could totally see the argument but 11.0 is just ludicrous.

If and when it actually works. Plenty of times I have taken critical damage to my engine/transmission or crew by an “intercepted” vikhrs in my Merkava Mk.4M.

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Well, better have some minor damage than being dead

Idk, I don’t consider a completely destroyed engine/transmission or 2 dead crew members as minor damage.

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It’s possible to watch other players replays?

https://warthunder.com/en/tournament/replay/

Despite having tournament in the URL, it hosts all replays of all matches.

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The other guy already sent the link. It’s a pretty useful site imo as it contains the server replays iirc. Not just the normal replays that are in the in game replay tab.