It is kinda sad that people use some premium jets such as MiG-23ML and F-4S use it as bomber even they are one of decent fighter at its BR.
They basically gets insta wiped by AIM-54s which is super easy to dodge if they see huge smoke trails.
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Well, most 3rd and 4th gen jets can take a full AA load and still enough bombs/rockets to kill a base. The ‘Free’ points from doing so can be much more useful for efficient grinding than the improved positioning afforded by not carrying the added weight/gaining favorable initial positions for a fight.
I’d argue, that for most premium jet players, the goal for their games is to grind, not to win. this mind set hurts the overall player-base at the hot premium BR’s, namely 10.0-11.0 range. If the grind were improved through either more bases, faster re-spawns on bases or other worthwhile endeavors (RB-EC anyone?) for Bombers, Strike Aircraft, GRB Players grinding an air tree, and ARB premium users grinding top tier, then hypothetically they would spend less time grinding and more time playing the fighter death-match like a very vocal group of players insist that ARB is.
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Give us like, Sim-EC sized maps, in air RB mode, and have like, 10-20 bases to bomb, boom, issue fixed.
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Bombing targets need to stop being borderline PNG targets with a health bar and need to become something that has a tactical impact on games, such as GBAD sites, Ground based radar, forward airfields, etc…
The entire problem around bombing bases has always been a mix of how much impact they had on the match vs how much effort was needed to bomb them, and how much easy RP it was.
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Naval aircraft perks, I personally run the Sea-Harrier FRS.1, I can carry 4 aim-9L’s, and enough rockets and one bomb to take out a base, and still take off/land vertically on the carrier, with minor issues. Only other plane I’ve actually played in simulator is the AJ-37, and I bomb with it, perks of the high speed is getting in and out, getting back to base, seeing if there are any bases free, and either reload with bombs, or air-air weapons.
Denmark is one of the best carrier based maps, because you can get closer to enemy lines, which works well with the harrier’s lackluster fuel capacity/efficency, one thing I’ve yet to see, that I’d love to is the Sea Harriers drop tanks.
Isn’t Denmark even the only (large - I don’t play smaller maps with high tier aircraft…) EC map with carriers?
As to the Sea Harrier, I just recently have reduced my default fuel load for it to 20 Minutes. As I never fly with a power setting above 85% (to keep the engine cool) except in emergencies, that gives me quite a bit more flight time than those 20 minutes, and I never had an issue with low fuel: I’d load 5x 1’000 pounders and 4x 9L’s, take out one base, then on the way home maybe loiter a bit or deviate to engage air targets of opportunity…
Yes, drop tanks would be nice, to be used mostly in an A/A only setting, to reduce the fuel load even further and drop the tanks for A/A engagements…
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There’s two other, I can’t remember the name, but I think it’s Tunisia.
I carry the rockets instead on 4x bombs, mostly because it’s lighter and you can go faster, and retain some of the little maneuverability you had before, I think Morvran has an active bug report on the Sea Harriers missing radar gunsight. I think I run 35 minutes of fuel, can’t remember, because I take advantage of the WEP on take-off to get up to speed, then run 60% to cool down, and then 80-87% to cruise.
Hm, not sure that’s the better choice: Sure, you’re initially lighter and faster, but after firing the rockets you still carry the empty pods and are affected by their weight and drag. With the bombs, once you dropped them, you obviously lose both their weight and their drag, having only the pylons and twin racks that affect your aerodynamics and mass…
Of course getting into a dogfight with those bombs isn’t a smart choice, as I have learned all too many times, haha!
You can jettison the rocket pods though, you have to do it manually however. Yes, the bombs put a massive damper on the already not-so-great performance, still love the Harrier though, still a marvel of engineering.
Oh, also, do you know why they changed the original Dark Navy color to the Cloud Grey on the paint job, I remember at the release I was a Dark Navy with the red tail insignia.
Also, some FRS.1’s had a Fueling boom, even before the FA.2, which has a larger radar dome if I remember, aerial refueling is still a thing I’d love to see in sim EC:
Do you know what weapon that is on the inside pylon? Just off of shape and size, I’d assume it’s a Radar-guided anti-ship missile.
You bought a subsonic attack plane and expected it to outperform the supersonic fighter/bombers in the tree? The A6E, like the A10s/Su-25s, aren’t well suited for air RB because of their airframe’s performance. They are too slow to cover the distances required, and aren’t good at air to air combat (minus the Aim9Ls/R-60Ms they get for being slow attackers). They perform much better in ground RB because their strengths can be properly utilized for their role. It would also be quite effective in Sim with the reduced repair costs and higher rewards. You’ll also deal with less fighters overall since Sim games aren’t forced to be full.
I hate that you feel you’ve been ripped off somehow by purhcasing it and not being able to do what you wanted, but premiums don’t come with a promise of “you’ll be instantly successful at whatever you want to do”. Nothing they do with base bombing will really help your A6E at 10.3 because you’ll always be outclassed by faster aircraft that will always get to the bases before you.
The bases respawning extremely quickly was unintedned and was fixed. They didn’t change it to be that fast intentionally, and they corrected that problem. Probably because it is rediculous to allow players to just bomb and bomb and bomb because it kind of defeats the ovetall purpose of the mode.
If they didn’t want people bombing then just get rid of them all together? Now its just a teamkilling race to see who can get there fastest and it ruins the game. It didn’t lower the amount of people bombing and it just made it more toxic. If they want people fighting others more it should be incentivized higher. Just removing one of the only ways people can get through the game at a barely reasonable pace shouldn’t be how they “balance the game”.
It really is sad. The majority of games I see at least half the teams hauling bombs trying to race each other to the bases while avoiding combat with other players even if they are engaged. Way too often have I snuck behind a conga line of premium F-4s just to kill them without them even flying defensively just to then proceed to complain in chat.
The mindset of the majority of players seems to have become “mindlessly grind out thing and then wait for new thing in the next update to just do the same”.
And it’s not like we can go back to bases being meaningful objectives, at least with the current system and maps. It would just turn into a game of “do the bombers reach the base or do the interceptors reach the bombers first” with all of them flying in a straight line.
In my opinion in their current state bases should be removed as it hurts gameplay, even if they are the most efficient grinding tool. It promotes not being engaged in the game.
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No, denmark and tunesia are the only EC map with carriers iirc.
Spain used to have them but gaijin removed carriers from it (or removed the version of the map with carriers). Either way, its very sad.
As a sidenote, Denmark is an arguably terrible map. Its actually pretty small and incredibly flat
Its better than garbage like Sinai or Tunesia though. Sinai is pverly flat as well and has nothing interesting nor any real point of interest either, while tunesia is incredibly small (or feels like it at the very least) and is mostly. Tunesia was even a major issue back when heli ec was a thing because of its topography making it near impossible to close the distanfe against the cancer Kamovs
Premium momen
I actually like Denmark a lot in Sim EC, but then I like the A-10, and for that aircraft’s role, Denmark is great (also for the A-6E, btw, to “stay on topic”…).
As map sizes go, Denmark is one of the 6 “large” maps with 128x128km. I’d also prefer larger maps for high tier, 128x128 is the absolute bearable minimum, all the small maps are completely unsuited I find for anything above, say, 10.3.
Here my personal assessment and view of the six “large” maps:
Afghanistan
- Most mountainous of all maps
- Weather often a really strong negative impact
- High elevation of northern airfields may have strong impact on aircraft performance
- Good for fighters requiring a more sneaky playstyle
- Bad for bombing, as CCRP doesn’t work on high elevation targets, also bases are difficult to spot visually
Denmark
- Only large map with significant naval forces and carriers
- Very flat, impossible to hide anywhere or be sneaky
- Great for attackers like A-10, thanks to proximity of ground battle events to airfields (at least for forces spawning south)
- Good for base bombing, offering also possibility to divert to naval targets if a base gets “snacked” away
Rocky Canyon
- Varying landscape thanks to large canyon, offering some interesting options
- Weather sometimes a really strong negative impact, especially if spawning in the south (low visibility on airfields)
Sinai
- Desert map, so air and ground targets are often visible form very far away (good and bad)
- Suez Gulf separates map east/west, with west often moderately “safe” for bombers
- Good for base bombing, bases also easily visible without aid
- Great for attackers, ground battle targets are very easily visible
- One of only two maps with convoys (offering more target opportunities - but they’re dangerous targets…)
Spain
- Varying landscape, providing good cover in the mountains, but also ocean.
- Surprisingly, it’s rarely seen in high tiers (haven’t flown it often myself either)
Vietnam
- Varying landscape, providing good cover in the mountains, but unfair distribution north/south
- Interesting for fighters, bombers, attackers alike
- Can be tricky for attackers as ground battle targets are sometimes difficult to see
- One of only two maps with convoys (offering more target opportunities - but they’re dangerous targets…)
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Is it really? It feels miniscule? Maybe ive been to harsh on it then…
The only sim maps i particularly like at top tier are afghanistan, Spain, Vietnam, and Rocky canyon
Spain specifically being the best top tier sim EC map imo
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Hm, definitely have to try Spain more…
But generally I really hope they introduce 256x256 maps soon, especially when advanced Fox 3 missiles come. AMRAAM on a 64x64km map is just ridiculous…
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The consequences of conceiving certain vehicles as mere tools or transit means to progress in the vehicle hierarchy, rather than presenting them as integral options to enrich specific gameplay styles as destination vehicles.
Is there anyone who truly enjoys piloting a bomber, finding competitive and immersive value in them as they would with top-tier beasts (because apparently everyone longs to get there, to the point of self sacrifice), or do they simply use them to accumulate profit points without dedicating real interest?"
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Raises hand
I actually enjoy playing bombers and attackers, not for grinding, but as a playstyle.
My Sim EC career actually started with the A-7D, then later got the A-6E when it came out, enjoyed both a lot. Then of course Harrier (mostly Gr.1) and Milan. Even later, I got the Tornado IDS MFG, and like this one very much as well. There’s something about sneaking towards a target at treetop level, evading enemy air defense and dropping a load of iron onto a target that I always liked…
Sure, flying fighters and besting your (human) opponent in aerial combat is very interesting and especially fulfilling, but that does not mean that a bomber or attacker playstyle can not be enjoyed, or must be used only for grinding trees and events.
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You and me both, ive been begging for larger maps for a while. You’re the game master, you have a lil more pull id think
Id also love to see maps like Guiana Highlands, Mountain Ridge, Pacific Hidden Base, and Alpine meadows reworked and rescaled to max in-game size. I had made a suggestion on the old forums, but trying to remake it on this mew forum and it got killed 8x in a row so I gave up.
WT already has increadible maps, theyre just old arcade maps that have been lost to time and need a little modernizing.