It was my gunners that weren’t firing. I’ve never done anything to turn them off, but we have cats that are not opposed to stepping onto keyboards…
The AI gunners are pathetic, they dont fire even max level and experted till like 500-400m, and fire super short crappy bursts.
You gotta use manual mode if you want anything to happen with rear gunners
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I think, the last time an AI gunner actually did something to protect me was at least eight years ago…but Gaijin keeps finding ways to continue nerfing them. Now they barely open fire at all even with maxed crew skills.
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AI gunners are entirely useless.
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8 years ago they were great
Spaded B-17G crew couldn’t kill a 109K despite being in range (<.6km) for around a full minute
AI gunners? What AI gunners? Those are mannequins.
I do remember bombers being practically unnaproachable for a while without being absolutely lasered from 1.5-2km away by AI gunners.
This ^
Used to be able to actually kill for you but now nah. Gotta actually use them to get kills, Ai will barley do work. If it does, its rare now. Nerfs only happened because so many players cried about it :/
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Low skill level then. You are better off manually controlling them.
In RB, they have a range of about 300m with ACE I think (maybe not even that high).
Gaijin cant model AI gunners to be fair. Its either totally OP (look at naval AA or Sim SPAA) or cant hit a barn door at point blank range.
So they just dropped the range down to nothing. Even for me in a Spitfire, where Id usually hack and slash with bursts at more like 500m. Its never the AI gunners that fire back.
I hope I’m not the only one that thinks this sucks. At least they (as air crew) could warn you of an approaching fighter.
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Bombers need an overhaul. Its not just you
- The AI needs work (even if that is just calling out targets like they will in naval)
- Their damage models are too simplistic and need an overhaul
- BRs still factor in GRB and all bombers need to be given split BRs. Some like the Lancaster could easily move down a full BR.
- BRs also seem to be influenced by bomb load, even if there isnt a target to drop bombs on even if you actually make it that far. So overhauled ARB to give ground attackers more consistant targets to drop bombs on.
- Overhaul contrails to not be this great big warning beacon to your location
After that stuff like:
- Higher spawns
- Removal of markers
- RB EC Gamemode
- etc
can be considered for further buffs.
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It’s 600m which is still way too low
Contrails are fine
I don’t think BRs are influenced at all by ground performance, the only bombers really useful in ground are the Pe-8 and Lancasters, which are at BRs comparable to BRs of similar bomber aircraft (in terms of air performance). I mean, the Lancasters didn’t see a BR change when the tall boy was added.
Higher spawns or overall slightly lower BRs (.3-.7, ironically bombers suffer from DEcompression at the higher ranks) would be great. But I think the biggest problems with bombers is the useless AI gunners and lack of targets. I remember way back when airfields could be bombed. Nowadays there’s enough bases for a single bomber to kill- all others have to circle around for several minutes for them to respawn (if they manage to survive so long…)
They track at 660m but wont fire until 210m
There has been several good threads on this. In essence, they often spawn too low and too consistantly. Also they are too visible at long distances.
Lancaster always had the 4k bomb, which was pretty powerful and 14x 1000lb is no small impact either. Aircraft like the Pe-8 are a full BR lower than the Lancaster, with superior turret coverage and 20mm cannons instead of the Lancasters 7.7mm MGs. Also the B-17 at the same BR as a load of 50cals.
Overall the Lancaster and most of the WW2 heavy bombers especially those in the British TT are probably at least 0.3-.0.7 BR too high, maybe even a full BR too high.
This is the main change Id seek for a short term improvment, just make the AFs a perma-target, even if it didnt affect tickets. Just guaranteed reward if you made it through. Would be huge for all BRs, including stuff added this update like the GR4
2 Likes
Just a waste of points, invest them elsewhere because tail gunner is sleeping all the time until you switch to them.
I remember very well how my onboard gunners, probably in the G5N1 or H8K2, opened fire on the enemy fighter, but not from the right side. The left beam gunner was shooting at the fighter that passed me on the right. AI shooters almost never shoot, even at planes that are 100 meters or less away from me.
Make AI even stronger, I dont see any purpose in AI just being there to kill it… IMPO its too weak
Let’s use the B-17G -60-VE for example:
ACE Crew LVL 75, Gunner firing range is 233 yds, Firing and tracking probability is 66.24%
Target tracking range is 722 yds. (Mind you the max zeroing range for fighters is 800m or roughly 874 yds)
According to this:
the effective range of the M2 as mounted was 3,500 feet or 1166.667 yds
Then there’s this:
This Document (Gunner’s information file : flexible gunnery. Air Force Manual 20) states in multiple places that the guns should be boresighted for at least 1000 yds.
This one states that the START of the engagement should be around 600 yds
Being as generally there is going to be arguments anyways, why not just try to have it at the stated ranges according to the manuel?
So it would look like this:
Gunner firing range is 600 yds, Firing and tracking probability is 66.24%
Target tracking range is 722 yds.
For an ACE and maxxed out crew this would make sense and YET wouldn’t break anything as the only issue being corrected is the massive deviation between “I’m tracking the target” and “I might pull the trigger” without messing up anything else in the process. If you want to go manuel and open up at a farther distance then you can do so, but for the rest of us who may not be flying at +20,000ft and might be trying the terrain following approach to the target, this would help.
A long time ago there was a multiplayer game named “Warbirds”. In it, not only could we fly bombers, but we could also crew another player’s gunnery positions. Bombers would fly formation, frequently with the rear gunner manned by another player. It’s an increasing challenge for pilots to keep their formation despite increasing damage.
Now, that game was laggy (the whole internet was, back then, as nobody had the connections we do now) and the graphics were cave drawings by comparison to WT, but the game play was more realistic. Having a human that could change from one gunner position to the next would make a lot of the bombers in this game far more a challenge than they currently are.
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