It’s literally a 2S38 at 9.0 with a slightly lower first stage reload and inferior thermals.
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i have to agree with sanguin here, 80/60 is probably the worst tank in that br range i have ever played. Not even in the same ballpark as 2s38.
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gimme gimme spaa classification less spawn points needed to spawn lmao
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Are you saying you want the 2S38 to be an SPAA?
And the Bagel Panzer is also an exception, I guess.
That’s what happens when you have light ammunition with modern systems.
That’s a great point! Single feed autocannons shouldn’t be able to switch ammo types freely.
Make a bug report.
The PUMA doesn’t have a proximity-fused HE shell. The 2S38 does, and IRL it has 3 different shells to choose from… One is a guided shell.
Russian bias, though, right?
The OTO I’d say would be perfect at 11.0, with the Lvkv at 10.0 and the 2S38 at 10.3.
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It’s a 2S38 with worse gen thermals, inferior survivability, 2s reload instead of a 0.5s reload, much worse gun elevation with no IRST, and much much lower ammunition pool. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
Also the darts don’t deal any post pen damage.
Both seem to fail at dealing any post-pen damage, just that the 2S38 can fire 3 more shots while the VCC reloads.
@SanguineSerpent
Identical survivability, no armor for both.
2s is a bonus more than a negative.
It’s anti-tank, gun elevation and IRT is irrelevant.
Oh, I see you’re here to insult everyone and defend the 2S38.
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You’re completetly forgetting the crewless turret Alvis.
Fuel tank on the 2S38 explodes only half the time. Other times it shall just absorb shells completely or at least partially.
You’re saying that any additional features that make a vehicle better is irrelevant. This is completetly not true.
Something with IRST is ALWAYS better than the exact same thing without IRST.
The VCC has proxy, so IRST is very useful at making a vehicle like this into an actually decent SPAA for the BR.
Strawman argument.
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In what world is having a longer reload a ‘bonus’ more than a negative?
If you’re going to say ‘so that you don’t run out of ammo nearly as quickly’, then that’s on the player for using the reload so recklessly. A faster reload is always better, as you have a greater option of how to use your ammo (whether it be in quick succession or slowly).
The VCC is easily more survivable than the 2S38. I’ll give you the rest, but the 2S38 is literally just an OHKO ammo carousel in the middle and all three crew up front. My most played BR is 10.0 and I one-shot them 99% of the time.
The VCC, on the other hand - has a heavily sloped UFP covering a large portion of its frontal projection, and a turret that will block 30mm APFSDS. From the side - it’ll also survive a front shot where there’s only the driver (and a frontally mounted engine - which also helps absorb 20-30mm autocannon shells from the front), while the 2S38 dies when shot almost anywhere in the side - considering the front of it is 3 crew perfectly lined up while the middle is a massive carousel that will kill it instantly.
The 2S38 even has a bit of ammunition stored in the turret and will die when shot there, as well:
I can’t believe I forgot to mention it when talking about how the unmanned turret is barely an advantage. It’s not just the horrible gun handling that will make it show its hull more often than not - but you CAN kill it through the turret, even. Jesus. No wonder I never found them very scary.
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Happened to me maybe once, out of hundreds of times - that the fuel tank absorbed my shell entirely without doing any damage, and I had made a poor shot where my shell went at an angle to the other side of the vehicle, instead of the middle, where it would have hit the carousel and killed it.
Whenever I was using a vehicle with an autocannon - the 2S38 was also destroyed essentially instantly because the fuel tank was gone momentarily.
So, that’s unfounded.
I do agree that IRST is absolutely useful, especially considering the VCC also has proxy. So it is definitely relevant, I would say that you are correct on that.
And lastly, that’s not what a strawman is. He’s not explicitly changing the meaning of your post, he is implying that you’re making out the 2S38 to be a lot better than it actually is, which is true.
And I forgot about this. I don’t understand how anyone can even bring up the crewless turret at this point when it’s already been repeated multiple times that the advantage of the crewless turret has been completely neutered due to the poor design choices of the 2S38.
An example of a crewless turret that actually has merit would be the AGS, or the QN506, or the Vilkas, or the PUMA.
The reason why is because the QN506, Vilkas and PUMA all have built-in systems to save the vehicle in case of ammo explosion. The 2S38 dies instantly regardless. Along with all of the other arguments made surrounding it, such as the gun handling, height of the vehicle, ammunition stored in the turret… I would personally be ashamed to even mention it, yet here you are.
it could probably go up to 13.0 without anything changing much
Sure, I would reckon that all 10.0s should go to 13.0 and the Strv 122s should go up to 15.7, along with everything else as well. Makes room for the necessary decompression of 5.7-9.7!
Excellent idea.
that would be nice but i would prefer a removal of the soviet tech tree and all aircraft alongside that
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The ‘heavily sloped UFP’ is no where near as ‘heavily sloped’ as the HSTV-L’s UFP. Sure, it can possibly ricochet some APDS, but I have tested on fair number of APFSDS rounds from different nations, and it cannot ricochet any of them (at least practically).
The turret can block 30mm APFSDS, which is impressive for a light tank, although the lower breech area is effectively only ~42mm of armour, so a couple rounds placed in that area would kill the two crew members inside.
Yes, this is true for autocannons, but not really for MBT APFSDS. The sheer number of APFSDS rounds from autocannons can simply overwhelm the weakspots and eventually kill all the crew members too.
Fair enough. Like you said, its turretless design is not as useful as other turretless designs because of its lack of invulnerability due to the ammo belt being hooked up to the rest of the ammunition. Although, this is still better than having crewed turret in most cases.
This is your experience, and I have shared mine. Fair enough.
The post was about the Hitfist, not the 2S38. He brought up the 2S38 and I simply compared the Hitfist with the 2S38, not the other way round.
And with what you’re saying, he’s implying, in this statement, that the 2S38 is that good by mentioning it.
Yes, the same way the Wiesel 1A4 is not a SPAA.
1 - Loosing the ability to scout is a buff to you?
2 - With the Begleitpanzer having the same ready-rack-reload speed its clear now that Otomatic totally off, or the 40mm should have a lower reload speed. That depends from the chosen perspective…
3- What? The autoloader of the leclerc can choose the following type of ammo. In a single-feed-system the next shell is given through the order chosen while loading.
5 - 2S38 and Puma have smart munitions. The smart munition of the PUMA aka AHEAD is absolutely useless cause the system in combination with IRST is not constantly adjusting the fuze.
So what does Gajin do? Implementing the same useless system in the 2s38? Nope, 2s38 gets working HE-VT shells instead.
6 - 2s38 is by far the most versatile vehicle (Spaa) of these light tanks. None of them has IRST and 75° Elevation.
The buff comes from its reduced SP cost. Losing scouting outweighs the gains of having a 70sp spawn cost. People always complain about the ADATS(that one right?) not being classified as an SPAA.
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It also gets a far lower spawn cost. I’d say it’s about equal.
Would take the Lvkv9040C’s radar + three times higher RPM with IRST over the 2S38’s higher elevation for anti-air duty. And the 5 spall lined crew that make it impossible to one-shot also make it preferable for ground IMO.
I’m mostly just calling out you saying the “2S38 is by far the most versatile” - it isn’t.
I’m literally grinding Sweden just for that one vehicle, while the 2S38 was not something I’d ever consider buying.
Cool! Everyone, round of applause to the guy that wants the 2S38 to have almost half the spawn cost!
That is in no way the same?
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