I have played both the M163 and Shilka and their guns have different strengths and weaknesses.
The M163 wouldn’t be as low of a BR as it currently is if Gaijin would just fix it’s god awful target locking.
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Even if Iglas are better than Stingers which in my opinion they are not.
The gepard has significantly more capable guns in both an air defence role(more range less rounds on target needed to shred the target) and anti armour role(way more punch and better rounds), it has seperate track and search radar allowing it to keep track of a target whilst also staying aware of the situation in the air which the ZSU-23-4M4 can not do
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Pgz04a is at 9.3 aswell. Playing a bit worse than gepard 1a2 in anti tank but the missiles are extremly reliable
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No. Helis sitting at 4km can’t be locked by MANPADs and it only gets worse with higher tier helis.
Most heli ATGMs have 3,5+km of range and you won’t get a lock until 2-3km.
The Littlebird has them at 10.3 and there’s no way it’s ever getting shot down if they use terrain for cover even against SACLOS SAMs
That quick locking never worked for me anyways. Try T-6-1 and hope the air alert tells you the height.
The split BR has only been added for top tier aircraft to make them LOWER in ground than in air. Very few aircraft have gotten a higher BR. Helicopter need to stop getting downtiered like the German one with 6 ATGMs that recently moved to 8.3. The helicopter modules also didn’t do shit to prevent sitting at max ATGM range and only stopped some of the heli rushing. All while CAS got buffed they not only raised almost all SPAA higher than 8.0 by 0.3, they also completely castrated all SACLOS SAMs to make them entirely useless.
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With a worse radar and no proxy fuze, bless your cotton socks morvran your bias is showing. Its fine where it is.
Prox fuse is largely irrelevant if the missiles guidance is so buggy (let alone half its irl G pull) that it misses more often than not.
I’d rather take a missile that will hit the target it’s fired at with no prox fuse rather than a missile that will miss with prox fuse.
All well and good apart from the fact you have no clue whats going on around you because the shilkas radar makes a rotation for every three around the sun. So no id rather have the proxy missiles and a separate search and track radar and the better guns even if the missiles are as bad as you claim (which i highly doubt they are and believe you are just using them wrong).
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it is not, there is a large difference between have and not having it, as it decreases the randomness of the missile which you cannot really control, on the other hand the “worse” short range performance of the stingers have an relatively easy solution, just wait to a better shot and dont waste the missile.
And again it isnt like the only disadvantage is the lack of the proximity fuze, you also have lower overload and it is caged and you keep having an overall worse performace as an spaag due to the radar.
Btw it isnt like the iglas are “good” at close range, the lack of proximity fuze makes them just as bad
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Stingers still need there 20-22G pull among many other buffs. Starstreaks on the Stormer HVM are still more than likely the far superior SAM in the British TT when compared to the Stormer AD
With those buff they wouldnt be the same br to begin with and it has nothing to do with the difference in performance that they currently have compared to the igla…
It is better in some ways but worse in others
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Shilka has a search radar, even if not a terribly good one.
The 20G pull wouldn’t change anything. Their problem is over-/undercorrecting.
With all those implemented Stingers would be better than 9M37M, which means most Stinger slingers would need to go up by at least two BR steps.
Could just make Stingers good and leave them at their current BR so that SPAA is actually good…
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the gepard should be at least 10.3
It has dual radar and cannons just as efficient as LAV-AD.
It doesn’t have thermal imaging, but it does have APDS for necessary situations. It doesn’t have rockets, but it has much better armor, allowing it to survive .50 caliber spam.
Only if they end up adding the ZSU-23-4’s grenade launchers and IRST tracking could it maintain its 9.3 rating. Otherwise, it’s down.
I dont know why people are bringing up the guns+radar combo as being OP. its the exact same combo found on the 8.3 Gepard as far as I am aware. Just now has 4x Stingers.
The only reason the Gepard 1A2 isnt 8.3 is the 4x Stingers, which imo, are pretty bad.
as a santal regular, let’s just say it can be useful at times, especially against a heli hovering 2-3km away that can’t be locked because gaijin can’t be bothered with modelling seekers and IR signatures correctly
Edit : read that incorrectly, thought you meant gun + missile combo instead of gun + radar
Because you need to look at the full picture
Gepard 1A2 at 9.7
- seperate track and search radar. This gives the ability to look with radar and track. no thermals though
- 2 35mm guns which are excelent AA and AT guns
- 4 FIM-92E/Ks which are fine missiles
- Adequate armour to withstand HMG fire
- good mobility
LAV-AD at 10.0
- no radar, but thermals for some manual searching
- 1 25mm rotary cannon with a good amount of punch and range
- option to replace some of its FIM-92E/Ks for Hydra rockets
- a lot of FIM-92s in reserve
- incredibly mobility
- vulnerable to HMG fire.
ZSU-23-4M4 at 9.3
- combined search and track radar with a limited arc. no thermals either
- 4 23mm guns, incredibly rapid fire but lack range and firepower compared to 35 and even 25mm guns
- 4 9K38s which lack promixity fuzes and do not have a gimballed seeker
- not particularaly mobile
- vulnerable to HMG fire
Stormer AD at 10.0
- Radar and thermals
- 1 25mm gun, very rapid fire, good range and punch but severly lacking in ammunition reserves
- up to 8 FIM-92E/Ks but only 2 ready at any given time
- good mobility and small size
- vulnerable to HMG fire.
so compared in that sense i think it is only fair the Gepard 1A2 is a slightly higher BR compared to the ZSU-23-4M4, it is just better in quite a few ways that matter, you may disagree with how much the BR increase is but to say it is on par or worse compared the the ZSU-23-4M4 is in my opinion based on nothing but vibes.
When you compare IR missile equipped SPAAGs to their missileless counterparts you see that universally they increase their BR by 4 BR steps so 1.3/1.4 BR
- Gepard 8.3 to Gepard 1A2 9.7 is 1.4
- ZSU-23-4 8.0 to ZSU-23-4M4 9.3 is 1.3
- SIDAM 25 8.3 to SIDAM 25 Mistral 9.7 is 1.4
In that sense the Gepard receives the no different treatment compared to other upgraded SPAAGs and all those IR missile are at the very least equally capable with FIM-92Ks in my opinion being the best of the 3(technically 4) options presented.
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So you want Strela equivalents at 9.3 - 9.7 ?
LAV-AD has much better firerate and is way more consistent in hitting stuff.
Gepard only has 40 APDS split across 2 guns, LAV-AD can bring up to 2/3rds of its ammo as HVAP.
It also has many more Stingers which become very important when planes aren’t within the 2km that your guns work at.
Shilka’s missiles have thrust vectoring on launch, you don’t need to lead them.
According to you, it already is