From game point of view, it’s the same gun firing same ammo for same damage.
Of course we may split hairs, but what’s the point?
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no, thats exactly opposite. At least as i know thats the main difference.
tho they may have similar settings, newither i nor you dont know that.
Dude, Shvak and B20 deal exact same damage as they share ammo and muzzle velocity. And Shvak is absolutely 1-shotting people left and right, just like B20.
Swedish AKAN uses different ammo. And 12.7mm variant without HE bullet is pretty much dogpoop. They only work because they are usually nose-mounted. But nose mihnted Brownings are just as good/bad (compared to single Shvak, 4 Brownings even in the nose are a joke).
I guess you’re now gaslighting yourself.
But you won’t win this argument. Because you see, I have played Soviet aircraft for the last 12 years. I’ve seen their ups and downs.
Shvak and B20 deal the same damage and always did.
Shvak and B20 have been 1-shotting aircraft for years ever since real sh*tter 3.0, though they are slightly less reliable than Type 99 Mk2 which I deliberately fired in single shot to laugh at P-47s losing wings and tails.
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well that`ll i check myself. Last time i flew the Yak 3 it did usual random damage from oneshotting to tail to not shattering the wing
it does?
I never suspected it
What is actually important is being nose mounted in case of 21 series, which makes them hit around the same spot. B-239 BTW has 4 MGs and deals great damage.
Why? Because you can keep people in the sights so easily you land looong bursts, and when 30 12.7mm bullets hit you in WT, you die. IRL if they don’t hit the engine or you, you may actually be kinda fine.
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so shvak cannons are insane right now if you do the math the SHVAK has A explosive mass of around 5grams of TNT while Mg151 has explosive mass of 19-21Grams of filler but for some reason in game right now the shvak does 3X more damage and does damage more consistently than any other cannon
hispanos and COLTs do similar damage but no where near as consistantly as the shvaks do
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No. It is a Russian game, that’s all you need to know.
I summarized this earlier this year:
Nevertheless i love it to clap the usual clowns in Yaks.
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It’s also crazy how the Yak-9T is 4.0 while the Yak-9 and Yak-1B are 3.0.
Previously the damage of ShVAKs was very poor so the 37mm was huge difference in killing power.
But now a single ShVAK is a much better plane killer than the NS-37, fighter or bomber.
Previouly I would run default belt for 50% API but now I just use the tracer belt because HE is just straight up better at killing planes.
What’s funny is that Mineshells deal practically no damage to engines, so you actually want like 33-50% AP, which you only get when using stealth belt, which also negates the velocity bug for Mineshellls.
While using MG 151/20, quite a lot of my kills were with the APHE and API.
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One would think that at least Gaijin would fix a game breaking plywood bug 2.0 by now. A bug they reintroduced themselves after they fixed it PARTIALLY by adjusting 20mm M-geschoss fuse sensitivity to be in line with the rest of 20mm.
But no, the bug is going strong for 7 months now. And to fix it all Gaijin has to do is to set plywood effective thickness to like, you know, same value as dural and copy-paste it for like few dozen planes.
Few hours of working if somebody does it 100% manually LOL.
It’s kinda clear Gaijin is way past fixing anything WW2 related. They are happy to watch WW2 gameplay slowly degenerate into oblivion due to bugs and horrible game balancing decisions.
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yes, because they are Brownings and them Shred through. Tho the Swedish 13.2s are still much superior in terms of damage.
i myself never look at the filler as the damage is likely to be inconsistent anyway. Them Tiger 105s shots have much more explosives than the 88mm but usually deal same to less damage. Same with the, for example, Maus 128/88 and 128 shots.
Regularly the damage is inconsistent so i usually never look at the mass, preferring to try them in battle to see.
Last time i used ShVAK it was ITP-M1 and the planes i hit survived pretty well. But not consistent as the oneshots were also a thing.
i know it pretty well, and i also know that USSR gets worst things around. The USSR is the onluy nation that needs to grind NVD + Thermals (or it was some time ago at least, for about a decade), its the only nation that has T-72 UFP buff “Otrazheniye” NOT BUILD IN BY DEFAULT, it has closely worst top tier tank lineup when there IS an opportunity to make better lineups, it also has no “tender” vehicles added, ect ect.
Even the theme about T-34s being higher than Shermans and Panzer IVs exists. And its crazy.
At least in terms of grounds, USSR is likely least favourite of gaijin. At least in comparisson with other “mains”.
Yes, because of HE bullet. And HE bullets are hard hitters because real sh*tter 3.0 basically reduces the real life differences between shells. 12.7mm HE bullet is not that far from 20mm FI-T, which is fairly close to 23mm, and 25mm is basically equal power as 37mm. Which is of course ridiculously wrong.
88L71 deals less damage. But it’s not super obvious. But do some protection analysis tests and you’ll see.
Similar story with Soviet 85mm vs Pzgr 39 8.8L56 - 85mm deals more damage, but usually either will 1-shot the target. Of course then there’s the Pzgr 8.8 nuke shell…
Peak delusional.
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Dude - seriously: Take the red pill asap.
Basically all Yaks (except Yak-3P) are severely undertiered - and this is no accident, that is on purpose. Idc about Ground RB or other modes - this thread deals with Air RB at prop BRs.
If you invest some time in forum research you find countless threads dealing with op Yaks and ShVaks - and USSR props in general. It boils down that the combination of too low BRs, overpowered damage output and the implemented FMs allows way too easy kills for plain average players. And as soon kills become too easy it is logical that you see criticism in this forum.
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i mean i dont see criticism for B-239s, Hayabusa, or any other CRAZILLY BETTER than Yak 1 plane. Ones much more maneuverable and same fast, with propper armanment making kills easy af. I dont see any criticism for Bf 109 E which is crazilly good. J9 which has 2x13.2 with OP damaging HEs is also one of the easiest planes to get kills, and Morko-Morane is as crazy as Yak 1. But nah hell yak is op because…
I’m sure he isn’t talking about the Yak-1.
While the cannon is busted, the flight performance is average.
I think ALL Yaks being severly undertiered is an exaggeration by him, because the Yak-9T certainly isn’t when the Yak-9 with a now arguebly better cannon is sits at 3.0.
But in general a lot of them are quite undertiered, since they only had a lower BR because how bad the 20mm cannons performed, which isn’t the case anymore.
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Yak 9 that cant even turnfight a Bf 109 sits at 3.0, correct.
them have lower BR because they are one of the least fast planes at the rank. They turnfight well but are not best planes out there tho.
Well, does it need to?
It has a nose mounted Berezin and a ShVAK so a much more effective armament.
It can quite easily hit enemies that the Bf 109 wouldn’t be able to hit and it carries more ammo as the Bf 109 only has 60rds per gun.
Bf 109 has better climb and turn but not by much.
Bf 109s and Spitfires also overheat very easily.
Pretty sure the Yak has better energy retention and can run from both.
So in that sense the Yak-9 is more effective against lower BR opponents because the performance is good enough while the armament is practically unmatched.
A P-39 might outperform it but it lacks the lethal armament to make the same impact.
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Yak 9p is fine too
I was talking about Yaks with 20 mm ShVaks - it looks like that i was not precise enough😉
Again, the 20 mm makes the difference, that’s also why i excluded the Yak-3P at 5.0. These 37 or 45 mm versions are not relevant in this context.
Yeah - the 20 mm makes the difference👍
I am not sure if you got the underlying message:
The OP damage output of a single centralized 20mm is especially for average players a massive advantage - rookie players prefer head-ons and the 20 mm ShVak is extremely easy to aim.
So whilst experienced players can avoid head-ons - the numbers game in every Air RB match is highly affected by the outcome of these head-ons.
In addition to that: The FM of certain USSR fighters looks way more suited to be flown with Mouse aim (with instructor) as the instructor limits aircraft from other nations way more.
The term “crazily better” is highly subjective.
Experienced players can play around the known weaknesses of B-239s or Ki-43s & Ki-44s which are mainly centered around top speed at various altitudes - but the teamfights of less experienced teammates on both teams are often decided in plain stupid head-ons in which the 20 mm Shvak is able to kill these adversaries with a single hit.
So i recommend to look at this topic from a way more holistic pov: Most players are way less experienced than you and the justification of the low BRs vanished with the ShVak buff.
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I remembered this thread as i had today a very long fight with a 2.3 Yak-1 in a 3.3 F6F-5.
I stated earlier in this thread:
This means that the AoA restrictions of fighters using mouse aim & instructor are often detrimental for actual turn performance., but some fighters are allowed to have quite impressive agility and turn even with mouse aim and instructor (like Yaks) whilst others have a severe disadvantage with that.
So if two players using mouse aim meet each other the plane with less AoA limitations will win a turnfight.
In this replay (skip to ~ 16 minutes):
Gaijin Entertainment - Single Sign On
…you see met getting caught low and slow in my Hellcat.
The fellow Yak-1 player could not use his superior Power-to-Weight ratio and his energy advantage - he saw a Hellcat as easy prey and started a low alt turnfight. Without the AoA limitations of the instructor (i use a HOTAS and fly with disabled instructor) the Hellcat is able to outturn any Yak - including Yak-3s.
I had no ammo 😎, reversed his dive attack and planted my Hellcat at his six - from ~ 17:00 until ~ 21:30 - he died as he killed his engine in his attempts to get away from me. The replay is available until tomorrow morning - as soon as the new update is released older replays won’t work.
Because it is a Russian plane, if it were an Italian plane they would have immediately placed it at BR 3.0
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