its hard to survive in an M-51 when u have paper armor, medium to bad mobility and get constantly uptiered once u research basically ANY other vehicle in the Israeli tree. I guess its BR is the way it is rn so as to make research fairly possible.
Well the Magach 3’s 105mm HESH is PRETTY DEADLY if u hit it right, besides being slightly inconsistent, but it can still OHK (mostly if u hit turret roof). (in my opinion)
It’s important to note that the two biggest factors that make this game a disaster are the damage model and the map design. For today the M51 in Br 7.3 would have a bad time for essentially what you have said, lack of armor and mobility, but this could be solved (and practically all the problems of the game) improving the damage and making larger and more balanced maps, since for example the HEAT in general cause too low damage and also continually suffer from the damage being absorbed by a module or crew member, preventing the damage from continuing into the tank causing damage to other crew members or modules. On the other hand, the design of the maps, so small and with exaggeratedly covered areas, the only thing it generates is that the key to the game is to get to a certain point on the map as quickly as possible and from there kill everything that moves. All this makes the M51 a difficult vehicle to balance, since it uses ammunition that penetrates 400mm, but in turn generally does little damage, has no armor and mediocre mobility. On the other hand, with the correct modifications the M51 HEAT It could kill a T-54 with the first shot most of the time, and even though it has less mobility than the T-54, it wouldn’t be as serious as that, since with more open and better-balanced maps, there wouldn’t be the exaggerated need to reach certain points of the map before the enemy. It would become a “first-hit-wins” situation.
Another point would be to give the tanks the real ammunition they carried, since the T-54s in the game should have the APBC as their best ammunition, with only the T-54 1951 and the Tiran 4 carrying the APCBC. Only the T-54A (not in the game) could carry the HEAT-FS, and the T-55A could have the APDS. But hey, that’s already trying to achieve the most historical balance possible.
Well, I agree, mostly. HEAT does indeed need better damage but still, hitting ammo usually solves the problem. Most maps are neat, and I dont say that cuz theyre appropriate for fair gameplay, but cuz they force you to play strategically, which undeniably helps making us better players. No pain, no gain. And anyway, if realism is the thing, then why aint real life wars on prepared terrain? Obviously, theres some preparing indeed like trenching, etc. But u cant control an entire battlefield’s topography IRL. I know fun and realism must have a balance, but ig maps arent a first concern. And back to HEAT, it also forces u to play strategically. Obviously, it could have a bit more damage, but if it had more and came way too close to APHE or APCBC-ish postpen damage then M36B2s would have to fight Leopard I’s, I think. And M-51s would be even more uptiered (which ALREADY HAPPENS due to Israel having 2 French vehicles at Rank IV (where the tree starts) (its very annoying to be put to fight Rank VI vehicles just cuz of the AML-90, and also, if u wanna use planes in GRB too, you’ll likely go thru what I went thru: HAVING TO FIGHT A MYSTERE IVA (Rank VI) IN A SAKEEN (Rank IV plane that fights Rank I’s and Rank 2’s cuz its quite BAD for Rank IV (sorry Sakeen)))). So I think theres not that much to do rn. But thx for replyin anyway :D
Almost 2 years later and not a whisper about this issue
Ifind it hilarious 183mm HESH and 90mm HESH has same damage
A different type of problem I noticed is not the HESH model itself but the tanks’ models. Every tank has a different model with different details and love put into it, so you get super weird inconsistencies. Add to that how the game calculates things like sapced armor and you got your answer as to why the most vulnerable-to-spaced-armor round is shit… To prove it look at the hit analysis and shoot hesh on the jagdpanther frontal plate, jumbo frontal plate and an uparmored centurion frontal plate and you will see how the different modeling causes issues that I believe affects ALL (but aphe) rounds… This also explains the excessive shell shattered of apds rounds…
Just shot the side of a Tiger 2 turret where the ammo is stored in my Centurion AVRE. Absolutely nothing happened. No damaged modules, no injured crew, ammo didn’t even turn yellow. Absolute perfection.
After a slightly extended break from the game I can conclude big HESH (183mm) is still atrocious beyond all reasonable justification.
That is to say, no change.
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What it does prove, is that there is certainly anti-British bias…
Also just noticed when testing, Ontos barrels are immune when you use it’s HESH
The HESH with 152mm pen. This is on live btw
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hesh works fine
