The Challenger 2E is a fine 12.0. Black Night has protected me against Kh-38s at least once, and Spikes at least 2 times.
You have to remember that T-series tanks only get less mobile as ground physics improves over time.
Also 10.0s went to 10.3 and 10.7. 10.3 cannot face 12.0.
Not even 10.7 can face 12.0, and their differences are primarily ammo with the secondary differences being armor and sometimes mobility.
And again. 12.0 - 10.3 is 1.7. It’s basic math.
I’m not sure you you get 0.3 from 12.0 - 10.3.
They couldnt before either. Something like the Challenger Mk2 was 10.0 and therefore couldnt see 11.3. Its now 10.3 and cannot see 11.7. The same tanks.
All that changed is that 9.0 cant see what is now at 10.3
Did any tank between 10.0 and 11.7 get a BR icnrease of 1.7?
No? Then where are you getting 1.7 from?
10.0 to 10.3 is an increase of 0.3
10.3 to 10.7 is an increase of 0.3
10.7 to 11.0 is an increase of 0.3
11.0 to 11.3 is an increase of 0.3
11.3 to 11.7 is an increase of 0.3
11.7 to 12.0 is an increase of 0.3
2A5 and T-72B3 or T-80U were the same BR for at least one update as well.
2A5’s BR is 12.0 today instead of 10.3… or worse, 10.0 even earlier: YouTube sourced image.
There still a lot of third gen MBTs left to be add
and currently right now there still sht tons of them in the game that aren’t model correctly add forth gen right now it going to be mess
If i want something new i want it completed work not unfinished garbage.
It still needs more decompression.
Leopard 2A5 is not at the same level as Leopard 2A7 but if lowered to 11.7 it will absolutely destroy 10.7 premiums like M1 KVT, Christian II, Challenger DS, Leopard 2 (OTCo) and I only said premiums because they tend to have low level players who aren’t very well skilled but it will absolutely outmatch non premium 10.7 tanks as well.
This will also help decompress high BR CAS because the F-5E or A-10C shouldn’t be nearly the same BRs as the Buk or IRIS-T. It’s a bit ridiculous how these AAs are balanced against CAS above their own BR, leading to any 11.0-12.0 CAS being quite bad.
We do need decompression because there are 3 different performance levels of MBTs at 12.0.
SPAA should be balanced based on aircraft BRs not tank BRs.
My stance on that has never changed.
From 1.0 - 10.7 it’s the case that their BRs are primarily based on aircraft BRs.
@Promenak
2A7 and 2A5 fire the same round, have identical weakspots, both have thermals, laser range finder, etc. The exclusive difference is an UFP improvement, which for MBTs doesn’t help survivability when it’s not even half of the front hull protection, and most matches are closer range where front plate armor isn’t really relevant when everyone’s shooting side armor. That and armor isn’t something to be relied on as a primary tactic.
2A7 is not a notable improvement over 2A5.
It’s more akin to the differences between Panzer 4J and Panzer 4H, or T-34-85 and 85 Gai in the Chinese tech tree. Marginal differences that don’t really change anything.
The only way to make 2A7 objectively better than 2A5 is giving it DM73, which Gaijin won’t and shouldn’t do because China and USSR cannot keep up at this time, and all other tech trees cannot keep up without being given French SHARD rounds to utilize that 120x570mm standard that they rely on.
2A7 has 653mm of penetration and 2A5 has 30mm less penetration at 623mm.
2A5, 2A6, PSO have 1st gen thermal for gunner, 2nd gen for commander and 1st gen night vision (not thermal) for driver compared to 2A7 that has 3rd gen thermal for both gunner and commander and even a 1st gen thermal for the driver.
This can be said about 2A5 compared to 2A6 or PSO but 2A7 has better penetration, better thermals for both gunner and commander and better armor.
Yes, the gun difference exists but is not notable at top BR.
2A7 and 2A5’s guns will pen the exact same spots of all tanks at 12.0.
The benefit of the L/55 is over the T-90A and T-80U, which are 11.0 and 11.7, and even then DM53 out of L/44 pens both at closer ranges as well.
Thermal generation only matters for BRs if you’re the American tech tree. Having thermals is better than not having them, and the best players in the game don’t even use them as common practice. Most maps they aren’t even beneficial as their primary benefit is cutting through forests to find IR signatures.
Deserts, snow, and urban environments thermals are only a marginal aid.
2A7V has the identical turret, and identical hull weakspots because that UFP only protects for long-range maps when you’re sniping… which aren’t the primary purpose of MBTs, it’s a purpose, and a super rare purpose in War Thunder. Maginot Line is the only example I can think of where you can hull-down snipe still.
This is why we need more decompression!
2A5 is worse than 2A7 but still cannot be lowered in BR because the top tier is compressed as hell.
2A7 can be moved up in BR until there is no need to shove 2A5 and 2A7 at the same BR.
(And I’m saying this as a Leopard 2A7V main myself. Leopard 2A7V is easily one of the best tanks in game and doesn’t deserve to be at the same BR as 2A5 and has to be moved up in BR)
The type 10 should have been added with tanks like the t-14 and black panther. It got artificially nerfed to shit because gaijin lies about trying to make the game realistic.
Edit: yes I’m complaining about the type 10. I just want to play one of my favorite vehicles but it actually be represented well.
