# What would a balanced game in War Thunder be like? --> Multi-Battle Balancer

If is implemented a mechanic to balance up-tiering / down-tiering - 50%/50%, with the time, the statistical correction of vehicles BRs could be perfect.
Without this kind of balance, the BRs dynamics of the game are changing all the time.

Thanks a lot for your post.
I have a pending proposal.
Yes… maybe need to change, reduce or concentrate the text and the idea. English in not my mother language.
Right now, I can’t edit the suggestion.
But if anyone catch the idea, it’s value, and could help me writing the ideal expression to explain and sell it, it would be highly appreciated.

Fair play for every single player of WT… the veteran and new ones.
You could see that most player concentrate their spawns number in the first statistics page (60% is usual), we have +2000 vehicles and use mainly 25 because is no need to suffer stupidly try to master an unusual vehicle. On the other hand, is common to read that the game is “repetitive”.
Get a PvP advantage is a natural human behavior; but with an insufficient balance mechanics this could, not only, no addressed but promoted.

This idea is programmatically VERY SIMPLE to implement with VERY CLEAR POSITIVE BALANCE IMPROVEMENTS; I really don’t understand if it is my bad English expression to explain this simple idea or if the exploiter that we all have inside that create all this kind of reject or “skill issues” or “complex alternatives” or “really I’m not sure what is the problem; but is other”.

This is not white & black true really.
It is only a factible WT true, that is make possible the game, and even challenging and interesting.
Only if one time he is the king of the battle; but in next time you are the king → up-tiering / down-tiering balanced.
The ±1 BR difference could be the optimal election. Even you could figure out that the game point system priories “surviving trying to make useful battle actions”.
Without up-tiering / down-tiering balanced, this phrase has the same level of true of “2.7 = 3.7 = 4.7”.

3 shots to side without destroying him? Are you using APCR or what?

Uptiers are not unique to any player. The proportion of uptiers corresponds to the proportion of enemy players uptiered. What people don’t seem to realize is that less uptiers doesn’t magically make a vehicle fight uptier ones less often. Instead, it just means that when you are uptiered, almost no one on the enemy team is, so you are facing almost exclusively these uptier vehicles. Having less uptiers would not do anything towards addressing the real reason vehicles seem to suffer so much in uptiers- compression- but instead only encourage more one-death leavers and make the game stale.
Now because different BRs for different nations have different popularities, player uptier percentage and opponent uptier percentage do not always equal each other. But that is something that will always affect matchmaking, no matter how it is changed.

You are welcome!

A lost advice you might consider:

Keep discussions short - especially if topic of your post is not related to them.

Your goal is to discuss you idea, and not how many shots you need to kill a certain tank. A lot of guys are unable to read and are just interested to derail topics.

Imho you underestimate veteran players; their experience advantage allows them to benefit the most from imbalances within the game. Newer players with <5.000 battles are the main victims of imbalances, so it might be smart to focus on them.

GL!

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But man… I’m not talking of just a case, instead general balance issue and possibility to improve MM algorithm using only BR values.
I will try to resume: IMO the balance mechanics in WT should be also “Multi Battle” and not only “Single Battle”, but perfect single battle balance in WT model is also technically impossible to achieve (even not have sense at all). Multi Battle balance could be simple and high beneficial but is not addressed at all.

your solution would be : be kinda op (downtier) or fight vs op opponents (uptier), suffer or make others suffer … nice.
what if I see uptier then quit and only play the downtier ??

by the way, if I play 3.0 br and there is no one playing below, then gonna face 3.0 and up (constant uptier)

Implementation notes:

• You could select in options if you could wait 1, 2 or 3 minutes max. Also, if you want to disable the balancer in your profile to get a battle as soon as possible.
• To accrual +1 in your “up-tiered battle counter” you need to exhaust your spawn points or 10 battle minutes at minimum.
• If you think well, not necessarily increase the queue times for all players. Simply replace you with other player in a battle (you have enough up-tiering for now).
• After you enter in a down-tiered battle your counter will be reset to 0.

What??? I don´t make suffer anyone!
Just want a balanced gameplay for all of us.
See the rules to implement the mechanic. The accrual of Uptiered match is no free.

uptiers should not exist or at least make them less unfair. You want a downtier (happy player ) as compensation for the uptier (angry player), I don’t see it as a enjoyable solution

Sorry man… I´m trying to understand the “picture you are describing”.

I see the queue like a list.

BR, player quantitly
2.0 200
3.0 400
4.0 500
5.0 2500
6.0 300

5.0 has a big bubble because all the player a using a well know best vehicle.
How the MM address this situation?.. the major probability is to suck players from 4.0 to fill-up the matches to handle that big number queue entry.

On the other hand…

BR Compression: is not the case when you have several vehicles in a BR range (as example) 9.0 - 10.0 when you should be more balance to have some of them 8.5 and some 10.5… in other word expand the BR assignation range because the big difference in vehicles features?

If is the case… the thing that we are discussing here is to have same number of battles updiered and same number of battles downtiered. BR compression is another kind of balance issue, but could buffered by these multi-battle balancer.

ok man… don´t understand if you are in favor to deal better with “high frequency uptiering” or not.
Do you figure out what is the scenario that I call “high frequency uptiering”?

• uptiers should not exist… how could you achieve that?
• at least make them less unfair… how do you make less unfair an uptiered battle?
• You want a downtier (happy player)… with some vehicles you could have 90% uptiered battles. Is a sin to ask to have 50/50? Have you experience that situation?
• as compensation for the uptier (angry player)… i dont want to be unfair with anyone…

Ohhhh my God man!!! You are taking this as personal thing…
Calm down please… don´t want to argue meaningless.

Look my profile… You really think that I didn´t know that I have to develop and use a better ammo to deal with this threat?

But… seriusly man… don´t be mad. To develop that improvement, you need to earn research points doing useful actions in battle. How do that? making kills?.. but if you have high frequent uptiers the challenge much much steped up.

better balance, pain and simple

example : vidar was 7 ( i think) totally op at that br, why ? to sell it, thinking on money instead of players

Really? You think that i’m superb?..
Sorry if someone read that, maybe just don´t write english well to to write in polite way.
But on this point. I think no one observe my profile, too.

Major player, even those with more than 50K battles in RB, have very few elite vehicles.
Why?
Naturally could be by simple election…
Other reason because they try a little to master an unpopular vehicle and quit too soon, because don´t have success.
After level up (make elite) a lot of vehicles, in my opinion, I can say that level up an unpopular vehicle is a lot more steped than a preferred ones… the usual cause is high frequent uptiering.

The best vehicles can deal much much better with the uptiering that unpopular ones.

Ok, JIJ0K…
Look that you instantly think that it has BR 7.0… Well, VIDAR is 8.0.
This quick response “…I think is 7.0…” could be because you found it in the battlefield all the time when you go out with your 7.0 template?

Imagine… new VIDAR Pack…
-heyyy how good is the VIDAR???
-ohhh my GOOOOOOODDDD!!! is incredibly good… I take to the grave easily 3 kills per battle.
-Players buying the VIDAR Pack massively.
-Suddenly the MM need to handle massive numbers of BR 8.0 player templates in RB.

• If you press To Battle! button with 7.0 you have high chances to enter in a 7.0 - 8.0 battle with our friend VIDAR.
• If you press To Battle! button with 7.3 you have important chances to enter in a 7.3 - 8.3 battle with our friend VIDAR.

This simply because is the only way that current MM have to handle the high concentration of BR 8.0 player templates.

We ask to Gaijin… hey! the BR of VIDAR should be higher than 8.0, since VIDAR appearance in the battlefield, my performance fall a lot!
Gaijin answer… regarding our math’s (armor, punch, mobility, reload time, etc. etc. etc.) the 8.0 is the most adequate for the VIDAR rigth now.

Discussion in the forum… posts… but just maybe is clear some argument that VIDAR with 8.3 has no chance against 9.3 vehicles and maybe 8.0 is really the most adequate BR for its characteristic.
On the hand you figure out that your 7.0 tank is also a good value comparing it with lower BRs tanks.

Many players could say… the problem is BR compression!
This set of 20 vehicles that are actually in a BR range between 7.0 - 8.0 should be in a range 7.0 - 9.0…
The set of 20 possible vehicles to create a match are now 2 subsets of 10 vehicles. Gaijin answer. If we do that your current 30 seconds queue time could be converted easily in 3 minutes, you will complain about increased queue times.

Is the BR assigned to both vehicles the unique root cause and solution of the balancing problem?
The high numbers of VIDAR in the queue suck your 7.0 template into 7.0 - 8.0 90% of the battles; something that previously was only “occasional”.

Look again the proposal… this could give you a breath of 1/3 battles in 6.0 - 7.0 (extreme) or 6.3 - 7.3 (most usual case), helping in your game progression in a totally fair play way.

This balance strategy in totally simple. What wrong thing you see with it?

That totally abuse uptier will still exist, totally abuse = atgm heli vs not even radar spaa or radar spaa vs not agile aircraft or atgm planes, etc. Maybe you like to be down/uptier, it’s … okey I guess, I just hate unbalnced stuff.

I would say that br compression exist because of the bad balanced stuff, but I really can’t argue because “don’t care” ( never will be fixed, is a lost battle )

Back to the vidar example, its a south korean vehicle … on swedish tree hahaha top sale for nato ( red flag haters maybe? ), however it could have normal thermal ( or not at all ) or no laser rf for balance. But they want easy sells so just drop stuff instead of balancing, add the uptier to the equation and its a mess

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Ok man… you won.
WT is a totally unbalanced and irreparable mess.
Even the reparation is in opposition to their commercial objetives, so there is nothing that we can claim or propose about.

You won!