For my first part i didn’t worded it well i agree, i mean that there was nearly no choice in what you suggested and that was the problem, sorry.
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Ah yes, 360mm pen “very competitive” compared to 408mm for DM33, 430mm for DM63, 522mm for M900 and 580mm for 3BM60. All these rounds are on 9.7/10.0 BR
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I still don’t understand why gaijin is trying so hard to not listen to the community. I don’t even play France, but I am still very disappointed the way they handle this situation. First, they overpopulated 10.0-10.3 BR with bunch of premiums thus making 9.3 and 9.7 BRs literally pointless as most of the time they have to be food of juicy premiums and now one of the most anticipated vehicles of France lands directly into that dark BR range. Well done Gaijin, you’re doing great with your aim to disappoint us
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Please at least consider giving it OFL 105 F2. A lineup doesn’t mean much when you constantly face 10.0 and 10.3 anyways, this means T-80UDs, Leopard 2A4s, Object 292s, and much more that are extremely difficult to deal with. Not to mention there are similar BR’d vehicles like the Type 16 and Rooikat 105 that have better ammunition, but aren’t gimped for the sake of a lineup.
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I have to say, I am extremely happy with the addition of the VEXTRA, but I am very saddened by the idea of putting it at 9.7 with an anemic round. While I understand the idea of « creating lineup », we also need to consider what those lineups are.
The free to play 9.7 lineup consist of the AMX 40, which could very well go up to 10.0-10.3 if the armor was finally fixed (the turret composite was removed early in its introduction for no apparent reason), and if the assisted loader meant gaijin accepted to reduce its reload.
With the addition of the vextra, a fixed Roland, and finally getting back the access to 10.3 aircraft (which is the lowest you get flares/chaff with France), that would make a compelling free to play lineup.
Why do I believe the 9.7 lineup isn’t a great idea ?
- the matchmaking is horrendous. As of today, while grinding it with my 9.7 VBCI, above 80-90% of my games have been 10.0+, with at least 70% of them being 10.3+. The 9.7 BR (along the 9.3) is stupidly balanced due to the overwhelming presence of 10.0-10.3 premiums.
- the lower vehicles (9.3) aren’t very great. AMX 32 (and especially the 105) are mediocre at best, lacking mobility, armor and gun handling, only having a decent firepower (with a mediocre reload). The SANTAL, with the mistral is still about as useless as a SAM can be. And we’ve made a circle back. The issue of bringing 9.3 vehicles is worsen by the uptiers mentioned above. IMO, things like the AMX32-105 have no reason to face things like Leo 2A4s.
As for the argument of the vehicle being playable at top tier with the Leclerc, I can only say I think this is a very bad argument at best, and just making fun of us at worst (which I know is not what you intend to say, but still make it look like it). Having less than 400mm of pen at top tier is simply a joke. The OFL 120 F1 already struggles to make meaningful damage after penetration, so what is there to say about something doing less than 370mm ? Sure, the VEXTRA is fast. But that’s about it. 6.7s reload, against MBTs that do 6.0 at worst with their 120mm is so stupidly balanced I can’t start to think about how people believe it’s a good idea.
Is it because, it’s a French stabilized vehicle so of course it’s top tier usable ? That’s not how it works. Until I see people playing other nations bringing their 9.7 vehicles at 12.7 (A FULL 3.0 UPTIER) and do somewhat okay, I’ll just call that a skill issue of making French mains work harder than other nations just so that they can have interesting lineups (Char 25t cough cough)
In conclusion, in my opinion, even a lonely VEXTRA at 10.3 (ground) would be sufficiently good to hold itself, especially with the advantage of getting both CAS and anti CAS planes back.
The addition of a Roland with fixed elevation angle and AMX 40 with reworked armor would make it a better 10.3 lineup than the current 9.7 lineup that they create.
I am a fan of the vehicle, and am very happy to see it added. But you probably won’t see me bothering to play it anytime soon without a better round.
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You’re still not responding to the fact several other nations have stuff at the same br, or .3 higher, that either outclass it in round right now with comparable performance in most other aspects or will still outclass it upon getting this round.
Why is this fine for France and why is it deemed necessary for France to have subpar munitions compared to the competition at the same, or similar, rating? Or in some cases, even lower rating. This vehicle is not going to work well in a 9.7 line up as it stands, outside of French players on average playing better than other groups that have better kit. It isn’t exactly fair, or accurate.
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i guess the best thing we can do is just to voice our dissatisfaction in a professional way and hope for the best, attacking gaijin devs and staff wont acomplish anything :(
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Please take a look at the Challenger 2 thread and you will quickly change your mind. Well argumented thing doesn’t work. It just depends on what kind of mood gaijin devs have today or tomorrow
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ah… welp, i dont really give a shit about the brits if you’ll excuse my french, but good point, the best way is to just put pressure on gaijin, attacking the staff isn’t really a good way to get things done im still pretty certain on that.
It definitely should lol. With F2 it would be a better M1128 at a lower BR lmao.
But M1128 has M900 with 522mm of pen, which is still 33mm higher than F2!
Right now, M1128 has 161mm more pen just 0.3 BRs higher… that’s 31% higher penetration!
If you think shells makes that much of a difference, even better for my case: Here’s the pens for reference:
M900: 522
F2: 489 (33 less than M900)
F1: 361 (161 less than M900)
Which means that, regardless of F1 or F2, M1128 will still have higher pen; it’s just a matter whether it’s by 7%… or by 31% lol
So, even if Vextra got F2, M1128 would still have the edge in penetration power, just not by such a comically disproportionate margin, so not much would change all that much between these vehicles.
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Cant wait to watch the 10.3 lineup go from not real to very real as belgian/dutch Leopards and CV90s show up and then frances best Light tank is not in fact french, But a Dutch variant of a swedish vehicle.
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well good thing we have what feels like an endless amount of vehicles with the CTA 40
Sorry you will get exactly 1 native CTA-40 carrier (they are going to bolster the lineup dont worry guys)
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will likely be how it plays out lol
I totaly agree this
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It’s just a matter of time before they realise that it can fix lots and lots of line-up problems
Unlike Stryker,the Vextra is actually mobile and with good reverse speed. So it can flank much better so worse round is not an issue. Its light tank after all and even the F1 allows it to frontally take on 11.7 MBTs into the same areas you would be shooting with F2,M900,3BM60,DM53 or whatever other round. And if you flank then nothing matters as you penetrate the sides easily.
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not every map allows you to flank to the levels your talking about and just because you can the vextra should not be held to a double standard just because it can flank
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Sure if you you take penetration in a vacuum. You should know by now that you need to look at the big picture when comparing tanks.
The Vextra is about 50% heavier (assuming no one is stupid enough to take the add on armor on their M1128) than the M1128 while having twice as much engine HP. The difference in mobility between the 2 is massive.
Currently the Vextra is around the same level of capabilities as the VRCC and Centauro ROMOR. Adding F2 would make it significantly better than those 2, meaning it should definitely get a BR increase.