Thinking about upgraded maps

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
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What do you think:

Which updated maps better than the old/original concept? Why?

Which updated maps worst than the old/original concept? Why?

Forexamples in my point of view:

Tunis: force players to rush the captured points in middle of no where without covers and not able to fall back safety if attack lost, objects not provide enought covers, too big the opened field and no cover object or rare, too easy to reach opposite points where spawn camp the opposite teams spawns, too easy to encircle opposite team spawn points, basically you can spawn camping from middle of the map, dunes cause gun lower depression problem and lot of armors useless, in Arcade game mode above 2.3 unplayable. Basically a R.A.T. playground which disgusting.
One from the many example:

Spoiler

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Old Variant from 2022 is better concept not the best but contain less element from the previous mentioned list. We got a full new map concept which bleeding from different wounds more than the old ones…

Carpathian Hills: Not able to attack from down side located hill opposite side, from added spawn point easy to get stucked by slope and opened fields between spawn and hil ,no cover objects, slow tanks are extremly useless, recapture the A point(hill) too hard and most case imposible, the trenches in middle (B point) restricted the walkable ways and tanks able to get stucked.

Old Variant from 2022 is better concept not the best but contain less element from the previous mentioned list.

Hurtgen forest: Restricted the sides and force players to move to city only into a meat grinder, added hills/dunes around the spawn points which cause easily get stucked inside spawn and get bombed,
to leave spawn you need to across the cover hills and in hil top you are a free target.

Old Variant from 2022 is better concept not the best but contain nothing from the previous mentioned list basically the spawn protection problem will solved when expand city area to spawn in both side

Middle East: CQC urban nightmare, Ambush points removed, force the players to rush to points to a bloody meatgrinder.

Old Variant from 2022 had a bit better concept.

38th Parallel: CQC nightmare, force players to rush the middle island , removed attack ways, more opened serpentines, less cover, much hard to push back the enemy thanks to island provided covers and limited opened areas/ attack ways.

Old Variant from 2022 had a better concept, howevery in first look its a camping map but contain more opportinity…

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Most maps could do with more elevation and longer range sniping in my opinion

Also old big tunisia map was great now in my opinion its meh at best

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You might not like it but this is what peak map design looks like.

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An issue might be that how do you get players to:

Move
Interact
Not just hide
Not just turn into sniping peekaboo.

No matter what they do players will flock to the dumbest spots or play super snipey (aka Sands where I never ever went up the hills like most people, yet survived, capped points, locked down spawns, all the while most wanted to hill rush (yes I understand the sentiment but all going there is poor tactics) because “too dangerous” in the 80% of the map I am wassocking around in wondering why I am near their spawn with no pushback).

This is the same idea as Berlin with everyone rushing to corridor left of A and ignoring the map as it is the most “fun”.

It IS just what the majority want so get used to it. If it ever moves back to a little more tactical (8.0 and below) then hit me up, I might re-download.

I don’t really need to grind anything so just “playing” I found the majority of players boring as hell.

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You gosh darn youngins and your 3D games. This is real peak map design:

168837-2

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I have never asked for a map to be changed and I dont remember anybody asking me.why do gaijin think they need to change things?

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Multiple objectives spread wide enough apart with enough covered routes/dead zones that you cannot lock down all approaches on multiple points.

This would allow a team on offence to recognize a given point is impossible to take and relocate to take another on the other side of the map where the enemy could not have placed as heavy defences.

Which would then force the enemy to weaken their defence on the original point, opening it up for assault in a game of back and forth, high-mobility engagements.

It is important that the different objectives should not have firing lines into and from spawn points and other objectives, otherwise you end up with people camping those spots without disadvantage.

Now, I have not played dota 2 in years (last played at 7.00), but a major part of teamplay was centered exactly there: constantly rotating pressure wherever the enemy was weakest while distracting the defence at a third point. It punished passive play severely.

Perhaps to achieve a similar effect, we might need new game modes/objective types rather than a simple 3 point capture system (perhaps the ability to capture forward spawn points? Or perhaps start with forward spawns near the objectives with the ability to permanently destroy those forward spawns for a lasting advantage - similar to pushing towers in old dota giving massive map control by removing teleport points for the enemy).

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So for me the critical point is “Objective/s”. An Objective needs to be something believed to be needed to be obtained by players.

So to design a system where people see this incentive, for whatever reason, as part of their “match experience”.

Stemming from the “are you grinding/spading/playing for stats/playing for fun/etc?” problem in WT what can actually be concieved that make an impact on player choice?

People have many “styles” which are not always linked to what I see as a matches overall goal; to win a match (which contradicts the differing player reasonings in the previous paragraph).

Maps do need to help promote players actually “playing the map” but from experience a majority prefer as quick a bit of action as possible (aka lemming trains).

Breaking this is a complicated task. And wity AB being vastly more popular then maps in RB will have to be suitable for AB first, again complicating factors in a map focusing on differing game mechanics.

It definitely has no simple solution as there are so many variables making these maps.

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They removed this spot, now I can’t sit there and camp anymore lol

MapLayout_Domination_Carpathians_ABRB