The Panther KF51!

[Zyranovos]

@dotSHINI

in that regard show me the british manual

@dotSHINI

you are kinda being hypocritical asking for stufff for britain but then saying no for germany

It’s because it’s a POLISH Abrams, not GERMAN

[_Renzo]

That is a brochure/advertisement, not a manual.

[Zyranovos]

Also, when I said British Abrams, I meant the AUS Abrams. While Britain would have been a prospective buyer

[_Renzo]

I think that the Australian M1A1 is where it’s supposed to be, just like the 2A4M.

And Sweden can respectfully piss off, they don’t need more top tier ground handholding.

[CodyBlues]

Oh no! The most exported tank in history is going to other nations!

[dotSHINI]

@dotSHINI

britain doesnt use a<brams or leoaprds either and neither is asutralia or canada part of the british tech tree

like i said, britain doesnt use them

[dotSHINI]

when we start odder for buying etc germany can get all the american goodies as well
f15, F/A 18, AH-1Z etc etc, the brochure for buying wont end in his benefit

[Zyranovos]

I’m not an American main, so, I don’t really care, also it is possibly the least exported MBT of the west, other than the Ariete, LecLerc, and Strv 103.

My point wasn’t that the Abrams was exported anyway, my point was Germany doesn’t need a Abrams, which your counterclaim was “everyone has leopards,” which I seconded with the fact that it’s the most exported western MBT.

Come on that this point, you’re making yourself look dumb.

If you want numbers, here you go:

No. Of countries that operate Leopard 2:

• 23

No. Of countries that operate Abrams (excluding non-recognized nations)

• 10

[Zyranovos]

@__Renzo__

And Sweden can respectfully piss off, they don’t need more top tier ground handholding.

Honestly never taken the time to play top tier, let alone grind it, so I can’t fully say. Everyone says that, but I’d have to see for my self, while ground gets its hand held; air gets the stinkiest pile of compressed shit you can imagine. (Gripen are fine to my knowledge)

[dotSHINI]

@Zyranovos

other than the Ariete, LecLerc, and Strv 103.

so… every other tank, u forgot to name the challenger

abrams and leos realy only are the only western exported tanks

[Zyranovos]

Challenger is a given, no one wants a rifled 120mm gun, because it’s worse than every western MBT imaginable.

[dotSHINI]

ah yes ariete…

[dotSHINI]

and forgot the merkava, but unsure if it ever was offered as a export

[Zyranovos]

I don’t believe so, but if we are going for all eras the Cent. can take the cake for Britain.

[dotSHINI]

all eras? the talking modern stuff, merkava isnt old

[Zyranovos]

Sure, but it’s still a Cold War era MBT.

[dotSHINI]

so are leopards and abrams…

[Zyranovos]

Yes, that was my point.

[TheArcticFoxxo]

@SpeclistMain1

On the M829E3 versus M829A2 : “The design is driven by the need to counter KE-effective explosive reactive armor (ERA) and the desire to destroy targets at a longer range than is possible with the current M829A2.”

So… You’re saying M829A3 is designed to overpower Kontakt-5… Great, thanks for agreeing.

@SpeclistMain1

Also the Soviets having the exact same opinion of M829A2: “The built-in remote sensing of our Kontakt-V tanks is overcome: [skipping unrelated ATGM/grenade launcher stuff] foreign BPS M829A1, M829A2, M829A3, DM43, DM53, having a pointed head part, which allows to overcome the DZ without detonating explosives. In other words, our built-in remote sensing can only deal with old ammunition that has one cumulative charge, or with domestic BPS.”

If by “Soviets” you mean blogspot poster Rastopshin, known for spewing out low-quality blogs almost 2 decades ago about a large amount of information that was entirely unclear at the time.

Let alone the fact that you’re citing a blog, I wouldn’t give him half a grain of salt along with similar frauds like Steven Zaloga or Fred Janes.

Now to address why his statements are stupid…
Claiming that APFSDS can penetrate an ERA element and displace plastic explosives quickly enough to avoid a detonation is outright stupid.
Stating further that rounds such as DM43 and M829A1 can penetrate Kontakt-5 “without explosion” is… Well, what’s a kind way to say it… I’ll leave it to your imagination.
This is also the same man that claimed the Russian armor industry is dying because the Object '195 was cancelled, and calling major overhauls of the T-72 “useless”. He claims Russian ammunition from the 2010s is incapable of penetrating “dynamic protection” (fails to name such) while making the erroneous claim that those same “impenetrable” vehicles are outranged by 2.5x.

@SpeclistMain1

You said yourself that Kaktus is third-generation ERA, and it was around before the M829A3. Is it hard to see that M829A3 could take out other third-generation ERA when M829A3 was meant to “counter advances in armor protection technologies, including explosive reactive armor”?

Kaktus as a program was cancelled in the late '90s to early '00s. No design features were reused beyond this, and the only part of it that remained was the slightly less powerful plastic explosive that was then introduced to light vehicle armor arrays, such as that of the BMP-3. That’s only the explosive element.
As well as with 4S24U, it doesn’t use anything that the original Kaktus program had provided, only sharing with it the name as it was further based on the light-vehicle arrays.

Are you trying to say that M829A3 can penetrate Relikt because Kaktus is a third generation ERA?
In what way does that make sense?
It’s as stupid as me stating that 3BM22 can penetrate an M1A2 SEPv3’s cheek because the M10 Booker can be penetrated from every angle.

@SpeclistMain1

It’s the only visual difference.

Going off of this budget justification, M829A4 performs better than prior rounds: “The M829A4 captures several new technologyies along with components previously used on previous APFSDS-T cartridges, but incorporates technology advancements to yield significant improvement in performance over previous fielded cartridges.”

None of which insinuates an increase in penetration or anti-armor performance. It’s well known that it’s more accurate when paired with the M1A2 SEPv3… That’s it.

[TheArcticFoxxo]

@Kenny110

Even Northrop Grumman themselves state “M829A4 is a line-of-sight kinetic-energy cartridge designed specifically for the Abrams M1A2 System Enhancement Program version 3 Main Battle Tank. It provides the Abrams the ability to defeat threat vehicles equipped with third-generation explosive reactive armor.” Wherever you’re getting your info from its incorrect.

So… No reason as to why? As said previously, the steel tip remains visually unchanged.

Anything can be stated in press releases. Without sufficient proof of changes, it’s nothing more than an empty statement.