You’re not really being realistic. If gaijin raises the BR cap, they will simply raise the Leclercs and merkavas and arietes and every other crap top tier MBT along with it because they don’t care about that
Quite a number of the lesser MBT’s weren’t moved up last time, that includes some of the Arietes and Merkavas, so clearly that’s not true.
Furthermore, you’re dodging answering my question: Is my method preferable over the one mentioned in the other reply or not?
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I think Leclerc and Ariete are getting HE rounds per Datamine. Correct me if I’m wrong tho
Fixing its UFP, fixing its mobility, giving it the SHARD APFDS.
I’m all for decompression but 0.3 BR isn’t going to make any difference. Also lol at the Leo 2A6 and PSO going down to 12.3 while the Leclerc stays at 12.7.
Again: With this nerf, the Leclerc is worse than the Abrams in every way. It can be at the same BR as the M1A2.
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Didn’t notice this but yea Leclerc definitely isn’t superior to the 2a5
It depends,
On maps where 2A5 can use its turret, it’s better.
Otherwise Leclerc is better, mainly due to reload, albeit I wouldn’t be opposed to 12.3 Leclerc.
For M1A1 HC variants to stay at 12.3, they’d need M829A2 removed at minimum and be given A1 instead, though overall I’d prefer them going to 12.7.
I personally highly disagree with the opinion that the 2A6 should be at a lower BR than the Leclerc. I also think that the T90M, despite it flaws, has enough good characteristics to stay at the same BR as well (tho the 72B3 can go down)
Anyway, new HE shell (finally) dropped on dev for the Leclerc. Had to wait for another nation (Centauro 2) to get it for a French vehicle to actually have a French shell
The 2A6 is on-par with an M1A2 which currently sits at 12.0, and is 12.3 in my proposed changes.
I suppose that means the M1A2 and M1A1’s need to either be moved to 12.7 together with the 2A5 and 2A6, or the Leclercs have to be lowered to 12.3 together with the 2A6, M1A2, etc.
Either way, the current BR’s make no sense.
It does not.
I was being generous with 12.3, it could also be 12.0.
It’s got atrocious mobility, awful firepower, mediocre gun handling, unreliable armour and RNG survivability.
It’s the lowest performing MBT at 12.7 statistically and that makes complete sense given it’s awful attributes.
Literally the only thing going for it is the fact that premium/bad players occasionally mess up their shots on it’s armour, but then why the heck would I want to be playing a T-90M when I can also have them mess up shots against a 2A7V or Strv 122 that offers actual mobility, gun depression and a better reload?
I personally think that it could stay at the Leclerc and M1A2 BR, considering the other proposed change of decompressing the strv and Leo2a7 to a higher BR. Its armor layout still makes it a pain in 1v1 situation where it can rush a lower armored tank and shoot it center of mass, while the other player would loose precious time aiming at its weak spots.
The same applies to the 2A7 and 122, but those having other huge benefits other the T90M should also be decompressed to a higher BR
There is a “F1HE” round in the files as a unused weapon but I’m not sure if it is EXPL 120 F1 or OE 120 F1
it might even be some other HE round
It’s not unused, they have it.
Yet somehow it is one of my best performing top tier mbts. Yes it has obvious downsides. But also strong things going for it. Is it meta? No, theres quite some better tanks. 12.0 u gotta be kidding.
40° a sec vertical and horizontal is mediocre? I mean its the best any tank at top tier gets and theres quite some with worse. its survivability even at penning shots is one of the best (spall liner+indestructible second spall liner around ammo carousel). One of the best frontal armor profiles. ESS, IR tracking, Strong HE, basically only russian tank with fully stabilzed commander sight with gen 3 thermals, laser warning, 1° better gun depression than t80s…
Sure the reload is subpar, theres better penning rounds and the (forward at least) mobility…well…its similar to all the other tanks with very good armor like strv 122s and leo2a7s which also only have a 60kph top speed in case of the leo 2a7s and/or a slower acceleration in case of the uparmored swedish ones. Use ess and smoke when in a pickle and play less agressive than with t80s (which is already indicated by its abysmal reverse. Once youre left alone being overextended all you can do is smoke, turn and run).
EDIT: Oh, btw, it still performs a 360° turn in test drive in roughly 7 seconds that is about 3 seconds quicker than some tanks that have neutral steering…with its awful mobility…
And its NOT the worst top tier tanks. YK you can sort all 12.7 tanks in statshark by K/D and K/S? its at the lower end in both but not the worst.
Because you can’t play those when youre playing your russian lineup?
Okay… Now please tell me the remaining (and equally important) aspect of gun handling.
Then also tell me how the T-90M performs in that regard.
Is RNG and 9/10 you die/get crippled when penned.
The 10% chance that a shot is less lethal than it would otherwise have been is not even close to off-setting all of the massive drawbacks this vehicle has.
- Quite a number of tanks have ESS, including tanks that are massively superior to the T-90M.
- Tracking is incredibly niche because 99% of the time you’re fighting tanks, not airborne targets.
- Strong HE is also found on the T-80BVM, which is the better all around tank at the same BR.
- 3rd gen thermals are found on plenty of it’s peers and also not a significant difference compared to 2nd gen thermals, let alone the fact that thermals in general are overrated.
- And 3-4° worse than it’s NATO peers. Stating the gun depression is better than that of a T-80BVM is like me saying I’m a better marksman than Stevie Wonder.
‘‘Subpar’’ implies there’s worse than it. There isn’t, it’s reload is absolutely atrocious.
It is not.
It’s the worst accelerating tank I’ve tested by a significant margin at 12.7 and including the vast majority tanks between 11.7 - 12.7 that I can think of.
There’s no reason why the T-90M can’t be 12.3 already.
It literally is.
Vehicle - Winrate - K/D - K/M
Leopard 2A7HU 55.1% 1.62 1.42
Merkava Mk.4M 52.9% 1.56 1.37
Strv 122B+ 48.2% 1.51 1.35
Type 10 52.7% 1.50 1.36
M1A2T 54.3% 1.49 1.37
Leopard 2A7V 44.3% 1.42 1.31
Challenger 2E 51.7% 1.35 1.22
Leclerc Azur 51.9% 1.34 1.21
T-80BVM 50.2% 1.33 1.23
M1A2 SEP v2 50.7% 1.32 1.20
T-90M 48.4% 1.22 1.09
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ok. Yeah if you disregard the tanks that are actually worse, Leo2a6, Leo2PSO and VT4a1, then yes ofc its the worst (disregarding Winrate bc why would you consider something that is mostly dependant of the lineup that has nothing to do with the tank itself and with which its actually middle of the field)
If you disregard all the tanks that perform better than it, then its suddenly the best tank at 12.7? WOW
Oh and if youre gonna use year old all time stats, that dont matter at all bc why would i care about how good it was in the meta 1 year ago (and then mix that with the actual up to date stats that do matter), then pls dont leave out m1a2 and m1a2SEP which are also worse then it in all time stats.
Uh…theres none? gun moves vertically gun moves horizontally? unless you consider depression and elevation angles as gun handling? i said it has glaring downsides, everyone knows that. But despite all of that being offtopic, it still being a solid tank that could possibly go a bit lower, then again, balancing is a mess anyhow with Leo2PSO with useless add on armor being 12.7 and leo2a7 being 12.7. If you dont like it fine, understandable, a lot of people seem to not like it for obvious reasons and theres quite a number of better ones. Its still solid
I mean out of 10 nations there’s 4 that doesn’t have turret basket implemented next patch. I’d say they are much easier to kill or cripple with significant larger weakspot. And even if you compare the rest of them Merkava with its cardboard armor and Challenger with that large lfp with ammo behind it. Even Chinese have significant larger weakspot with no side protection what so ever. What was a death shot at an extreme angle for ztz wouldn’t even scratch T90M thanks to the era+fuel tank+spalliner combo.
While other points maybe valid the survivability isn’t the correct argument here. It has by far the best protection out of all top tier tanks
Nah he thinks only Russian tanks gets either crippled or one shot if the round penetrates it while completely ignores that same thing also happens to every other tank.
At least from my own experience the 2A5 is consistently better than all of the Leclercs and easily on par with M1A2 and M1A2 SEP.
It’s got insane turret armor, DM53 which even out the L/44 is still very good, and it overall just feels way more responsive than all of the Leclercs even with the slower (6.4 seconds expert) reload.
By far the biggest things for me has been the survivability difference between the 2A5 and all of the Leclercs.
Even with the annoying turret basket module, hits to the hull are considerably less lethal and the UFP (which is only really good against 3BM42) still manages to block a surprising amount of APFSDS hits while my Leclercs stop pratically none.
For this reason the only Leclercs I even run in my 12.7 Lineup are the S1 and the S21, with the 2A5 and 2A6 being my main MBT’s due to how much better they overall are.
I don’t think the 2A5 is OP at 12.3, but I think all 4 of the Leclercs should be at most 12.3 if not 12.0 due to the massive gap in capability/performance when you play them alongside the 2A5.
Just confirmation bias, if enemy didn’t pen T90M he probably thinks it’s enemy skill issue, like T90M has so good armor coverage that only weak spot are breach or lfp. Obviously you gonna be dead or crippled when hitting those place (given enemy didn’t hit the funny gun trunnion)
While I wouldn’t say its on par with M1A2, otherwise I largely agree, although I tend to prefer Leclerc on maps where the reload comes in handy.
I don’t really disagree with your post overall except for this part. Top tier T series tanks are absurdly tanky, and as someone who plays only France and Japan (I.E. two nations with non existent armor as they are implemented) they’re a massive pain to deal with.
T series players can often hold W without much care knowing that there’s a good chance that the enemy will struggle to hit one of their weakpoint while they’re moving as fast as they are, and can just fire center mass of the Leclerc, Type 10/90, Chally to guarantee a one shot, Abrams can be disabled/ one shot through the turret ring, etc…
The ERA also overperforms a lot, I’ve had the side of BVM tank multiple side on shots from a Type 10 @ ~100mm with the ERA completely defeating the round. The round has ~610mm of pen at that distance.
The T-90M may has its problem, but survivability really isn’t one of them.