The Leclerc is in dire need of a buff

Machinery of War Discussion Ground Vehicle
3670

Hello

We very much are following this thread and raising the constructive feedback within as well as updating the reports wherever possible.

As you can see by the responses following, your post, its unlikely such a post would be of positive and constructive use as some already have pre-set opinions that sadly wont change no matter how much we aim to explain the reasoning behind certain topics or any progress or developments within them.

Those sorts of topics take a considerable amount of time to prepare and a lot of developer work. So we always aim to do them when there is A) sufficient new information to deploy and speak of, bringing new answers or explaining things that have otherwise not already been explained B) a serious desire and requirement for one where there would be a constructive out come and a good reception too it.

If we do indeed reach a point where there is sufficient content to cover a full articles worth, it is for sure something that will be taken into consideration. However at the current stage, the focus is on resolving the individual issues and deploying live answers as and when they come in from the developers to those reports.

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3671

Thanks for the answer. I can’t say that I am not disappointed by this response tho. I started really going deep diving in the Leclerc about a year ago now, and despite the numerous reports, many of them with primary sources, I have not seen much relevant changes, aside from the turret rotation and reload buff, that only happened after significant backlash and/or to follow buffs of other vehicles (the Abram’s reload).

I know that many staff to watch this thread, from community managers and tech mods, and actively participate in it for some. Actually, most reports on the CBR do get passed to devs rather quickly, in days if not hours in most cases for well researched and explained bugs.
However, I have to say I feel like that is not followed being by the devs. We often mention bugs being in limbo, and I understand that devs have loads of work to do, beside bug reports, and even within bug reports their are hundreds of issues.
However I and many others have felt that there is a clear, and I’d even say, deliberate lack of interests from the devs with the Leclerc specifically.
Indeed, in the year or so of Leclerc bugs reports I have participated in, I have seen many other vehicles worked on by the same bug reporters, with similar issues, sources, explanations… being implemented in just weeks or maybe a month or two, while the Leclerc did not get anything beside a start card change and 2 buffs that followed clear backlash from the community.
I now just have the feeling that devs just look at the stats of the Leclerc, then the bug reports, before simply moving them to the bin or the « limbo folder », never to be seen again.

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3672

I can assure you this is for sure not the case. Leclerc has many fewer open reports than something like the Challenger 2 or Abrams for example. Many have been actioned, and whilst its appreciated not all of them have been resolved, its handled in the same way (and no differently) to any other nations top MBTs in terms of report actions.

Much like with the Challenger for example, its also sometimes the case that issues are resolved in batches and reviewed within a period of each other whenever plans and schedules also allow.

Anything that can be done sooner wherever possible if all the information is clear and present is generally aimed to do so.

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3673

Alright. Thanks for the answer.
I do hope however that one of these batch issue resolving thingy could be coming soon, as the Leclerc (and it’s not the only one in this case) is truly not a great vehicle at top tier, as France is basically getting carried by it’s powerful CAS vehicles, with the Leclerc being at best uninteresting compared to many, if not most MBTs at the BR. And it could be much more unique with more polishing

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3674

I also wouldn’t accept the manufacturers website they are trying to sell the item. Would you trust NII Stalis website for the efficacy of Relikt ERA?

This is the game we wanted, things are classified Gaijin does things for balance or to promote other Nations. France like Britain aren’t key nations.

3675

Last thing done to the Challenger was a mobility nerf…Cool to see the devs ignoring the bug reports in favour of how to make the vehicle more miserable.

At this point the Russian devs do what they want and mods like you Smin just have to try and justify (the nonsense) and placate the rightly frustrated player base.

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3676

At this point I simply refuse to play the challenger 2s

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3677

What, how?

3678

It’s the main reason why I don’t like playing Sweden and Germany hahah

Leopard 2A7V has nice thermals, but the rest of the Leopards and Strvs have those torture devices called “1st Gen thermals”…

I straight up do not use gunner thermals on those tanks; only use commander ones to spot, then gunner sight to shoot, hahah. But I find it way more practical to just have good gunner thermals.

3679

Its structural steel around the carousel was removed.

3680

Check this thread just to be hit with this and now I’m sad.

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3681

It’s cause it’s only using the two steel plates in the calculation.

3682

I also wouldn’t accept the manufacturers website they are trying to sell the item. Would you trust NII Stalis website for the efficacy of Relikt ERA?

You’re comparing apples to oranges. Velocity is non-negotiable as it’s a hard stat that does not change and isn’t reliant on as nearly as many factors as ERA’s performance. Gaijin’s data for 1660m/s is pretty much non-existent, nowhere have I been able to find it on the net, they pretty much made it up and it goes against everything that’s public.

You possibly can’t be serious with that logic either. Rheinmetall & GDLS have absolutely no reason to fabricate the velocity of DM43A1/KE-W A1, nor does the Bundeswehr have a reason to lie about it. Heck, they’ve been using manufacturers data for nearly (DM43 is the irregularity here) every projectile up to date, but somehow DM43 should be an exception? The OFL F1 (the French name for DM43A1) is set up according to such data as well.

Even by applying pure logic one should be able to see that their stats for DM43(A1) are pure nonsense. It uses the same type of propellant as DM53 (L1), but is a whole kilogram lighter. In what world does a lighter projectile using the exact same type of charge flies at a lower velocity than the heavier one?

If you’re going to peddle nonsense, do us a favour and don’t, at all.

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3683

I prefer to have better mobility, better gun handling, blow out panels, better breach armour than just better thermals personally, as poorly spec’d the leclerc’s are compareds to real life i prefer to play them over the challenger, especially now they have that 5 second reload. Ironically i think the challenger 1 is much better to play than the 2 as well.

1 Like
3684

You miss the point entirely, velocity isn’t non negotiable. Velocity is a vector its a variable perhaps you mean speed?
Velocity changes, barometric pressure, size of the charge, barrel length, humidity all have impacts on the Projectile.

Gaijin don’t use available information…Why would they imagine the game when Leos can just shoot T-80BVMs anywhere and one tap them. That’s not good for gameplay and when you consider Russia is still the largest nation played, perhaps apply some common sense. We know based on tests NATO ammunition is designed to counter Russian K5 ERA.

I didn’t say lie, but they certainly exaggerate, have you not seen military ads before. The aim of Rheinmetall is to sell military hardware. The Bundeswehr didn’t make the round.
The facts for the round are incorrect, we know that and we know L27A1 is wrong as is DM53 but we cant start using the manufacturers website as a credible source.

3685

Probably saving that for T-90M Obr 23

3686

Massively the CR2 is crap, the CR1 is playable although not great

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3687

Sorry, if your point was to make a comparison that is completely off the mark then yea, I did my best to conciously avoid it.

Muzzle velocity (to be precise) isn’t negotiable, velocity loss is, to a degree. The report in question is and always has been for the L/44, as that’s what the data is for, and all sources state the same MV regardless of whether you like it or not.

I didn’t say lie, but they certainly exaggerate, have you not seen military ads before. The aim of Rheinmetall is to sell military hardware. The Bundeswehr didn’t make the round.

Again, why would 3 different institutions (actually, more than 3) all exaggerate the performence of the round? Listen, if you haven’t got a good reason to claim that the velocity ““claimed”” by Rheinmetall, GDLS and the Bundeswehr (who btw, had to test and qualify the round, because otherwise it would not be called DM43(A1), since that’s a naming scheme only used by the Heer, so I think they would have a pretty good idea of how fast it) then I’d really suggest to be quiet.

The facts for the round are incorrect, we know that and we know L27A1 is wrong as is DM53 but we cant start using the manufacturers website as a credible source.

We always have been using manufacturer’s data, sometimes backing it up with additional sources. At this point I wonder if you have any idea what we’re talking about honestly, because pretty much all APFSDS are set up according to such data.

I also take it, that, if I were to ask you for proof of manufacturer data being wrong on L27A1 & DM53, you won’t actually have anything to back your claim up, correct(?)

Now, since this isn’t a thread about DM43 and/or how Gaijin handles data on APFSDS, I’m gonna drop this talk, since it’s unlikely I’ll be met with a reasonable response and might end up wasting my time at the end of it.

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3688

Just noticed that the Leclerc is also the only rank VII tank sitting at 11.7
Which means it gets stock HEAT while already being the worst MBT. Any explanation from the devs or it’s just another middle finger to the french players ?

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3689

Take a look at France rank 7 currently. Now imagine that the two Leclercs are moved up to rank 8… there’s not a lot left in rank 7 is there? One might say that an empty rank 7 would compel Gaijin to add more vehicles to France (one can only dream).

But if Leclercs would be modelled accurately then earlier varianta could be placed at a lower BR. But that’s currently a WIP.

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