Okay lets compare with the type 90 and the T-90A if you want to get the leclerc in 11.0.
Type 90 (B) "Fuji"
Pros :
56.5°/s for the rotation of the turret.
2502hp at 2400rpm.
reload : 4s
LWS (Laser warning system)
Controlled suspension
Good ammunition (481mm at 10 m)
81km/h max speed
Cons :
Gun depression ( controlled suspension make it not that a cons)
Gen 1 thermal
T-90A
Pros :
Self-entrenching equipment
Electro-optical Active Protection System
800x600 thermal ( gen 2 thermal)
less heavier
good hp/t ratio.
great armor protection.
cons :
A bit less max speed than the MSC
A bit less turret rotation (because of the weight of the protection).
7.1s reload
MSC with buff
Pros :
reload : 3s
Gun depression
good armor on the front hull
cons :
34°/s for the rotation of the turret.
huge weak spot for the commander.
less horsepower
heavier
To conclude :
if the MSC goes 11.0 because of the 3s reload i don’t understand.
If it gets more turn rate i will understand but now 10.7 with 3s i think it’s reasonable.
Even then, armour is becoming less and less relevant with each and every update, this obsession with armour from folks is funny, its still a 70kmph, auto loading, DM23 sligning tank, which as you say comparable tanks are at 11.0
Gen 1 thermals are not that big an issue at all, leopard 2a5 and A6 still pack em at 12.0.
the relaod being 6 seconds is just stupid and is there to justify it being at 10.7 with the 2a4’s
As well as this, realistically didn’t the damn MSC fire a better round than what AMX40 did?
EDIT i mean they told us on the dev stream that it didn’t have composites, and low and behold, it has composites, the reloads artificially nerfed (as usual with france) just to force it to a BR it shouldn’t be
Give it, its historical fking stuff and balance its BR of that.
Why bother adding a tank stripped down, much like Shir 2 if its not gonna be what it should be.
(also because gaijin balance off of performance metrics, I can see the french players doing extremely well with this and thus it being moved up, that was my original point)
Thermals are no longer ‘gen’ relatable cause Gaijin does bring in specific pixels now, but Leo2A5/6 have gen2.
Which will uptier it. Gaijin specifically want 10.7 along Leo 2A4 so that it makes a lineup which 1. stops people from crying about lack of vehicle in that spot and 2. sells Leo2 better.
The leopard 2a5 and 2a6 do not have gen 2 thermals at all, teh quality is akin to gen 1 I should know, I’ve got them both, the commanders sight has gen 2
Yeah but they have the leopard 2a4NL in the TT already, so if it performs well they can move hte mSC up regardless
If this is true, it’s probably the funniest thing about Leclercs this year, not only will the MSC be in 10.7 but it will also be almost better than the production Leclercs
Yeah, for the shell and the thermal I can understand to a certain extent but for the reload it’s absolutely absurd that they nerf the speed of an autoloader while they buff manual reloads on many tanks
I’m not making the decisions. I personally find dubious at best the claims for the composite on the MSC. I would rather have the Leclerc armor fixed, and MSC staying as a paper tank with very good reload at a lower BR
When I see the previous messages, IMO some people are getting excited about nothing. The tank isn’t exceptional at its BR, no more or less than the equivalent of a Leo2A4. It is as it is, with its weaknesses and strengths, and in 10.7 it’s in its place with its current characteristics.
We need to temper the comments, between those who won’t play with it and who will say it’s too powerful, and those who will use it and who always say they don’t have enough… People, be pragmatic.
Regarding the armor update for the production version… there is indeed something to be done, but it’s not to put the same thing on the Leclerc as on the MSC, but rather to give the current armor layout of the Leclercs values more consistent(buff) with the high-tech composites currently installed on the vehicles, knowing that the 3D representation present in the game is consistent with the known and declassified data… although, that too varies between the S1 and the S21.
Where it is really necessary to intervene on the other hand, is on the composition of the lower hull armor on the production versions of Leclercs, actually just a 50mm RHA. But in reality it is almost identical to what we find on the AMX-32(120) in the game, namely, two plates separated from each other, either by air or by composite (there is no declassified information on this). Having observed it myself on many occasions, I can say that what we have at our feet in the cockpit is not the simple 50mm plate present in the game, but at least another of roughly equal thickness approximately 35-40cm behind.
It may be silly, but just to make this part more realistic would prevent these tanks from getting blown up by 57mm autocanons or even smaller ones from the front…
