The F-5C is no longer good

Then most other 10.7s would need to move down to 10.3 as well. Including most of the all-aspect slingers. and then most 9.7s and 9.3s would have to move down as well.

Also it was 10.3 before the decompression. So you would be undoing all decomopression.

Quite frankly. The F-5C should never have dropped down to 10.7 to begin with

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Sorry, there was another F-5 defender ‘trully’ believed that Harrier outperforms and beats F-5 in a dogfight. :|

Glad that you aren’t that type of guy.

He genuinely believed F-5 could beat nothing outside of A-7 Corsair II and Buccaneer S.2B, and being outturned by every-goddamn-thing.
Including attacker jets. :|

They still have engines that dont really produce heat, meaning they defeat all missiles with stupid ease

Wrong, they already can be locked from 4km away with an r60.

and their FM is significantly overperforming because the devs for some reason are using soviet secondary sources instead of american primary sources to model the FM.

If their FM’s are overperforming what are mig21 mf’s outrating them and running away from them even with f-5s on 15 mins of fuel and mig21s on 20 mins of fuel?

Quite frankly. F-5s are under BRed, sure,

The F-5C is overBRd. The F-5E (USA/GER) are probably a little high in BR.

maybe compression is preventing them from moving up currently,

Cheerful reminder that the f-5e used to see mig29s and f-16s all day at 11.0, alongside the f-4s and mig23 ml.

but 95% of aircraft at and below them (and probably a few above them) dont have an easy time fighting an F-5. Just because the J-7D can fight a F-5C, doesnt mean that everyone else can as well.

Literally everyone else can outdogfight the f-5c: the mig21 spam which outrate it nowadays even if both have been nerfed, the su25 has much more engine power, the j35s spank it under any circumstance, the viggens, the j7e, literally everything else that is not an attacker can deal with them and if the phantom E player is smarter than the f5c/e (us/ger) and goes clean wing it can even outdogfight the f-5s in a 1v1 near the end of the matches. Every single fighter above 10.7 will definitely give the f-5c a good run in a dogfight.

Then you can flare it with a single flare tap thanks to the cold-fusion engine.

Naaahh…

They are no longer facing MiG-29 and F-16, so maybe sending F-5C up to 11.0 while giving AIM-9J will be fine.

BTW,

British Rank 6-7
Off topic reminder:
Maybe because we don’t have any PROPER fighter jets to fight against either F-5C or J-7D.
And Jaguar GR.1A or SHAR FRS.1(Early) will be one of our best bets? :P

(After Lightning in 9.3, there are no fighter jets in our branch until we unlock Phantom with Spey or Tornado F.3 in 12.0)

and? F-5 on full reheat is colder than an F-117. F-5s are chrononically cold due to how they model heat sigs.

Have you ever wondered why you could 1 tap flare anything in a F-5? Including IRCCM?

Try aircraft like the Harriers if you want to see the difference in trying to flare something, they are on the opposite end of the spectrum and are some of the hottest known things in the universe.

Performance against another aircraft is irrelevant. F-5s are overperforming. Though wouldnt be surprised if the Mig-21s were overperforming as well.

9…7s should never be facing an F-5C. But they do constantly due to it being premium and being spammed.

Congratualations. Friendly reminder, you have subsonics without flares facing the supersonic F-5 with flares.

No they dont. Heck. I’ve seen F-5s outdogfight Mirage 2Ks. They are some of the strongest dogfighters of their BR.

So in a full uptier the F-5 struggles? Good. Though more than a few in a full uptier that would actively avoid dogfighting an F-5 still. Heck, in the F3 I dont go anywhere near them if I can avoid it.

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At least we can stab F-5E with SuperTEMP if they aren’t flying low enough :P

Now imagine when you face them in GR.1 instead… XD

Yeah, which is what I do, and in fact, I fly high, funny how many people try and hide in MP and dont defend.

But yeah… They suck to deal with in the Tonka IDSs, thankfully you can outrun them.

Yes it did, however the thread isnt named “F5C used to be bad” , its “F5C is no longer good”.

Well meta is a subjective term.
If you alter your tactic even a little bit instead of bombing / mindlessly rushing the enemy team, both can be very dominant.

With the F5E i have been the sole reason my team won on multiple occasions.

Partially true, individual performance is somewhat irrelevant in the grander view of things , however:
I mentioned my performance with the F-5E because it deviates drastically from my usual stats. (Also it was the most fun i had in months)

While it is true that the first 5-10 matches were horrible , because i tried to play like i normally do.

Instead of rushing i cut the afterburner and i went slow , i found it better to hit the enemy from the side when the main fight is over, since they dont expect it.

5C and 5E have similar engine temps , aka really cold , and that makes it easy to flare incoming missiles.

You shouldnt stick around for a fight you wont win.
Play to your planes strengths. Pulling a reversal on unsuspecting fishbeds is really easy.
Only plane that consistently gave me trouble was the J-7E.

True, the 9J of the F5E(Swiss) is better than the 9E , but at least in my case, AIM-9J was the last upgrade i got.
Most people will see and flare your missiles, so i started using them simply to scare the enemy.

At least 90% of my kills in the F5E come from guns , the last 10% came from AAMs or the occasional AGM-65B shot.

I doubt the F5C is horrible to the extent of being unplayable , maybe a change in tactics wouldn’t hurt.

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I watched the 4 vs 4 air at weekend

Full teams of F5s and canards
If not meta why is everyone using them in a tournament over mig 21s etc?

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what does being TK’ed have to do with the F-5C not doing well?

One thing I will agree with is that the F-5C can be outrated. But that’s kinda their weakpoint historically and if they have a lot of energy you have to make sure you’re not near them. As shown by this dude with a hardwing F-4E.

Look at how much time it takes though. Unless you’re really stuck with a one-on-one. If someone tries to shove you into a rate fight. Just move on.

BTW. I’ve seen people say that Statshark shows the Mig-21Bis outrating the F-4E (Agile eagle) And I believe that’s absolutely bunk as F-4 pilots in the 80’s were taught to rate around 390 knots (720kmh) to fight the BIS. Phantoms in general, should be the better rate fighters.

Are the Bis’ still scuffed where they are having double the acceleration of their 2nd stage afterburner? Decino posted about that years ago and I don’t know if they fixed that.

Why would it be at 11.0 if the Chinese one gets 9ps at the exact same br

Maybe when you fly it

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one of the Mig-21s, I think it is the BIS, does use the combat thrust settings for its afterburners. It caused quite an uproar in the Tonka community when that was discovered because we were constantly told that combat thrust settings are not used for any aircraft. As far as I am aware, it still has it.

Plenty of examples of the same aircraft being at the same BR but with wildly different loadouts (Harrier GR1 vs AV-8A/AV-8S comes to mind) unfortunately there simply isnt the capacity to give every single aircraft their own BR. So probably wouldnt be that big of a deal if 2x F-5Cs were the same BR with slightly different missiles.

The fact is, the F-5C is a total menace when you have to fight them in a full uptier in the subsonic and often flareless aircraft often found around 9.7. Moving all the F-5s up 0.3 BR or giving them some healthy nerfs like addressing their overperforming FM or cold fusion engines would go a long way.

Love it when gaijin is weirdly biased towards their own vehicles.

I think every F-5A/C without an all-aspect missile should be 11.0,

Every F-5 variant which don’t have an all-aspect IR missile
(F-5A-USAF/F-5C-USAF/F-5A-Thai/F-5E-Swiss/NF-5-Dutch) should be 11.0BR with AIM-9J/P.

And it seems I forgot to mention ROCAF F-5A… :(

As I claimed earlier, I think giving AIM-9J to send them higher feels good for me.
Well, USAF already stole [AN/ALE-40 countermesure for F-5] from ROCAF
(AFAIK, one of the reasons why Gaijin gave F-5C-USAF CM, was reports about F-5A-ROCAF which was originally came out without CM)
So nothing would be worse if they also steal AIM-9P from ROCAF. :/