Su-39: R77,R27,R73

The upcoming update has the possibility of being the best air update in ~2-3 years if gaijin finally gets rid of excessive multipath


i mean im hopeful(not expecting but still), since this is basically the first time where every nation will be on roughly equal footing radar missile wise. So all will suffer and benifit more or less equally with a more realistic implementation of multipathing.

I doubt itll happen personally. MP is a feature because if it wasnt, bad players would cry, a LOT. Gaijin cant keep selling their overpriced copy paste premium jets if the bad players aren’t having fun, so we get to continue to have baby mode applied at top tier.

It’ll also be interesting to see if the fox 3’s are fixed when they’re added, since some of them were significantly underperforming iirc (like the AMRAAM and MICA iirc)

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yeah, there certainly would be a ton of outrage - im not expecting it either. Still, it is definitely possible, and imo should happen at some point in time. Its extremely stupid that we can basically ignore a whole class of weapons whose usage make up probably over 95% of all modern aerial combat. The wt playerbase are certainly babies, but they can learn and adapt when change is forced upon them - they will do it kicking and screaming the whole way, but they do eventually adapt. Same as the first IR missiles, and the first radar ones, then 30g stuff and all aspects - and now most recently with IRCCM missiles. They can learn to use proper kinematic and notching defenses just the same.


yeah pretty much

If they want to do it, this update would be the ideal moment. All Fox3s coming are more or less comparable, not sure it will stay like that for long, so now would be the correct moment for Gaijin to pass the change and for people to learn how to notch

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Notching isn’t particularly good radar missile defense, particularly in the case of fox 3’s and MPRF seekers. Positional combat, going cold, keeping pressure on the opponent, reengaging, altitude changes, etc… that’s what people have to learn. Notching and proper chaff use is a just a portion of radar missile defense.

BVR is supposed to be like a long range dogfight and a game of chess, not “who can suck up the most dirt with their intakes or notch best as a last resort”

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yeah - the funny part is its not even a hard thing to learn, i’ve been climbing to alt without chaff ever since F4E. Simply dont fly right at the enemy, or heaven forbid - turn around. Its ezpz, but people really think its the hardest thing in the world. Let the people who really enjoy furballs and diving in to yeet IR missiles everywhere stay around 10-11, just the same as how those who dont like jets or ‘missile thunder’ stay at more enjoyable br’s for them - and finally we can have the game progress.


fair point

The missiles that have Inv. Monopulse and Monopulse are fine. It’s the ones that don’t that shouldn’t be doing so well. I’m not sure if that’d include stuff like the AIM-54 or Super 530s, but if it didn’t it’d give people a bit more breathing space against missiles that don’t have Monopulse Seekers

Afaik 530D is Monopulse CW. IDK about Phoenix

lol no… Top tier air is bouta be cancer. There will quite literally be the possibility for 192 FOX3s to be flying through the air over the duration of a match. (I’m still going to play it of course)

if people vomit out all their fox 3’s early game, literally all you have to do is go cold, wait for the volley to be over, and surprise, you are now the only jet left with BVR weapons.

Granted, I dont really care much about air RB, as I only play sim now. Air RB is a terrible game mode with or without fox 3’s at this point, because the player base that mostly plays RB want AB, but dont wanna admit they want AB, so they settle for air RB (AB+ as some people have called it)

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Air sim is fun, I just wish the maps had more terrain (I know there is some with decent terrain I just want more maps with terrain)

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Yeah theres a lot of bad maps in air sim. Theres 4 good ones atm imo.

  • Spain
  • Afghanistan
  • Rocky Canyon (sorta?)
  • Vietnam

I had made a suggestion for gaijin to rework some old AB maps into full sized EC ones for RB/Sim, but when the new forums happened, they had me rewrite the suggestion, denied it 7 times in a row (despite approving it in the past) and i just gave up


Afghanistan is so much fun because you have a nice mixture of mountains with wide areas of open space

Big problem with Afghanistan imo is there isnt enough mountains in relevant spots, with them mostly covering the edges :/

Multipathing is still significantly overperforming, even against SARHs. Documents put Skyflash as effect even as low as 12 meters

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7M and phoenix down at 5m, and 27ER at ~20m iirc as well. MP is just dumb at this point

The worst part (imo) is that it dispropirtionately impacts jets that have better avionics or that rely on radar weaponry. Tornado, 29SMT, Su-27/F-15 (kinda sorta, these 2 are a bit of a reach), Tomcat, F-4. All these aircrafts are denied their ability to properly hold/threaten enemies at range due to excessive MP.

It is technically impossible to keep an enemy from the merge or signigifcantly degrade their position/energy since they can just fly low and straight and there is LITERALLY nothing that can be done to counter it, meaning you end up in a forced merge vs something like a gripen/mirage/viper/J-7E/mig-23, and now its an uphill fight just cuz of gaijins handholding

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Had this issue when flying the SU-39 in simulator, when going to point A to point B there are areas which lack mountains and a bus like the SU-39 doesn’t really benefit from this whatsoever.

The TWS can help a lot whenever you expose yourself, just look out for enemies on your RWR or radar and you should be good (if not simulator ignore this).

I hate Afghanistan because of the alt. Quite a few of my normal jets just hate being high