The actual problem with the kopyo-25 is it’s inability to track more than two targets, or to lock one target amongst several others. If the only thing they change is the detection range of ground targets, there is not much that will change: kopyo-25 will still be garbage for ground strike.
Maybe now R-77 and R-27s are on the Gaijin’s plans for the SU-39, but the vital part of the SU-39 is that it is a strike aircraft, and there is now so much fog and “visual pollution” as never before, limiting the capacity of the mercury targeting pod to spot targets; making the only really strong point of it the quantity of A2G weapons it can carry.
I’d say we should first receive the R-27R1/R-27T1 and the Khod thermal pod before anything else and see how the vehicle performs then add more additions in the future.
Yeah. This would be the update for it, specially for the Khod/Kinzhal pod because of the addition of several A2G radars and others very strong multi-role strike aircraft
Planing to give only a buff to the kopyo-25 in ground detection range is devious of Gaijin, even more considering the fuzzy mess it is the gmti of that radar. In game the kopyo-25 is useful only in air battles, for finding targets, and Gaijin should keep only for that reason – because of the R-77 and R-27ER
Any ground targeting capability change should be proposed only if it concerns the possibility of a Khod/Kinzhal container, specially because the manager has pointed out that the missing container and missiles in that moment was a balance decision – the decision to not add the “missing” weaponry.
The veracity of the “flesh” of the missing loadouts wasn’t questioned.
From what I know of their sta ce on the Su-39 and its missing R-77 and the likes, i think its because they have a BR they want it at and adding more advanced systems would make it too strong and would force it to increase in BR most likely.
Tho the aforementioned tornado, M2KD, and harrier all have thermal pods, they do not carry the number of air to ground weapons, nor have the quality of air to ground weapons the Su-39 already have. Tack on a thermal pod, or a MMW ground attack radar, or R-27ER/R-77’s and the plane begins significantly outclassing every other attacker until you hit ~13.0.
The SU-39, in general, will have a hard time dealing with any long range SPAA – and a even harder time dealing with other aircraft, depending on who in the pilot. Besides the power of it’s A2G weapons and it’s survivability, it has nothing more going for it, specially speed and agility.
I don’t know very well how is the ground strike for the aircraft you’ve mentioned, but in SU-39, if you have the KH-29TE, it will get a target lock only under 8 Km, depending on weather conditions. The KH-25ML, if fired from 10 Km, will land after 17 seconds of flight, so if you fly straight you will be at a distance of between 7 Km or 6Km because you need to keep the target lasered, being totally exposed to ozelots and LAVs missiles. You have to be very lucky to not have numerous SPAAs in the enemy team.
Yet this circumstance is manageable, but add to this the bad weather or the damned morning or setting sun, which now are very recurring, and you can’t effectively deal with the enemy spaa because can’t find them before 6 or 5 kilometers.
Other thing worth of mention is that if those get added the way Ralin mentioned, you would have to chose: or have a strong air power with the R-27ER1 and the R-77, because they use kopyo-25 radar pod, or have good ground targeting with the Khod/Kinzhal pod, because the Kinzhal can’t track air targets.
I don’t think Khod and Kinzhal were in the same container.
From a logical standpoint, it seems impossible to place both systems inside the container enclosure at once, as they require specific layout and enclosure materials.
I’m leaning towards the idea that Khod should be added until there is solid evidence as to how the two systems were in the same container.
I added the official OKB Sukhoui book to my report, which shows the existence of the prototype thermal imager and its tests
I was wandering about this. Gajin could add both Kinzhal and Khod as separate containers, because there was tests with both systems, right? I find very fascinating the possibility to use a milimeter-wave radar to ground strikes, considering the test drive i did with the already in game kopyo-25 guiding the vikhrs, and my experience with the Khrizantema-S
But you did say you haven’t found the sweeping angles of the Kinzhal, maybe Gaijin only adds the Khod until there is more information about it
And another thing about the possibility of the SU-39 outclassing every strike aircraft at it BR is: unlike the harrier and other planes that have those thermal pods, the SU-39 can’t maneuver well to dodge missiles, not only because it is a fat flying whale but because the angles of the targeting pod severly limit the area it can track.
To be able to fire any of them powerful weapons, the minimum range to be able to lock any of it’s TV guided weapons or laser guided missiles like the KH-25ML or the Vikhr is 10 kilometers. the TV guided missiles would need to be even closer, depending on the weather conditions. By definition you still will need to expose yourself to the enemy because of the range cap on it’s weapons.
The SU-25SM3 has the KH-38MT and the KH-38ML, both of them have a range of 40 kilometers, bigger than the range of any spaa in the game, and is the only soviet aircraft that has a thermal imager, so it can find targets from under the artificial range limit(20 kilometers) no matter the weather. Hardly I think the SU-39 would be able to mimic such power, considering the De Facto range limit for any engagements it’s weaponry imposes to itself.
Only considering this, it’s BR being raised to 11.7 or to 12.0 would be sufficient rebalancing, because being there is the certainty that you will encouter SPAAs that can engage you on the range you can fire.
We don’t know what container Kinzhal was in. I don’t think it could have been the same container as the thermal imager. If only because a radar requires a round radio transparent cover, and an optical system like khod is rather flat and transparent in the optical and IR spectrum.
So I guess Kinzhal won’t see the light of day until there are photos of the airplane in testing or photos of the container where it was housed.
Well some of the radar characteristics are unknown. Scan times, angles, etc.
The information about the kopyo-25 is easily accesible as the Kinzhal? Maybe, if Gaijin found by themselves the info about the radar that already is in game, they could, to add the new radar, use their own resources to try to find these informations.
But that would demand they be interested, which is…
Kopio-25 is widely known and has many sources. Plus there is information on the progenitor radars.
Kinzhal, on the other hand, is completely unknown. It’s not even clear what the container looked like.
I unequivocally say that kinzhal has minimal chances to appear in the game, because there is too little information and in general it is not needed, because there is kopio.
Very unfortunate. The ideia of a ground radar always fascinated me about the Su-39. The kopyo-25 is barely usable as a ground radar, and as you said there is little information on the Kinzhal, so probably only the Khod could be added.
Kopyo is 3 times better then gen-1 thermals because its allows you to attack enemy fighters at off boresight angles with your trust vectoring r73s, and also rises your situational awareness in case of air threats.
It is also possible that su39 will recieve a higher br after this addition which is bad overall.
A bug report about missing R-77 and R-27ER was already accepted 14 days ago. Su-39 will have it’s BR raised when it receive them, so the thermal pod is needed.
Cmon, its going to get 12.0 BR, you guys srs?( I dont want to play against 12.7 jets every game… And he probably wont recieve thermals anyway because there was none of them actually made for su39.