didnt you know?
better radar makes you better in BFM)
1 Like
I said the radar is better in BFM? When did I say that?
BFM duel F15A vs Su 27, then we can switch to BVR fight too if you want even F15C vs. Su 27SM
Prove it
Soft locks will show the target in the HUD which means you don’t have to rely purely on visually acquiring the target. TWS also provides an indication for speed and direction.
Also targets have to populate on the radar in order for them to be hard locked for R-27ER unless you are purely reliant on the HMD and only acquiring targets visually.
The only semi-effective radar mode that the Su-27 has is PD HDN and it’s still very slow to complete it’s scan pattern and give consistent update on radar contacts.
Being able to widen and narrow the search pattern is less functionality?
I can use wide scan mode to have 120 degree of situational awareness in the same time frame that it takes Su-27 to have half of that. Or I can use narrow scan mode to have much more frequent position updates from it and also reduce the number of subsequent enemy RWRs that I am pinging.
HMD does not assist in the detection of targets. You still have to visually acquire them. Having multiple ACM modes is helpful for acquiring close range targets that you know their general location but cannot see.
I.E tall scan mode is pretty good following a merge when maps are dark and enemy target is a small plane against a dark background.
Being able to tell the location and type of aircraft that is pinging you goes beyond just a defensive advantage. Also the Aim-9M is a pretty strong offensive advantage in Air SB.
It wasn’t even very dominant when it was Russia’s highest tiered aircraft in SB. It was still getting destroyed by F-16C without Aim-120, F-15A, Gripen, and Mirage 2000.
The only thing that has changed since then is the radar has gotten worse (double scan), the Gripen flight model has been nerfed (it still wins against everything but can’t just pull full stick back and do it automatically) and multi-pathing was reduced to 60m.
4 Likes
pssst… Whats BFM?
That’s already been done?
When the hell did either the F-15C or Su-27SM come into this?
With who? Did you win? Did you prove your point that Su 27 is currently better in BFM?
Bro. You’re ducking. You claim the Su 27 is better at BFM, and that it’s radar isn’t lacking. If you stand by those points. Then prove it. I’m waiting
And the Su-27 does just that, with refresh times doing very little to aid. As I’ve been saying multiple times now, you have IRST for a passive track that shows exactly where the enemy is, and they won’t be given any information as to how far away you are nor what kind of aircraft you are… Or even your direction and height.
Ah yes, speed a direction… Two things the F-15A isn’t given by its radar while the Su-27 is.
Is there any reason why they wouldn’t? You don’t need to wait for multiple refreshes on TWS to be able to lock an enemy… You simply acquire and lock.
It’s quite literally TWS but worse.
Not having TWS nor an HMD is less functionality, as well as having it displayed in a worse method.
Neither does ACM, unless you’re simply brute-forcing your way through the map at 19km increments with boresight on.
Do you want to know what else is great for acquiring close-range targets when you know their general location and can’t see them?
IRST!
Also doesn’t give the enemy a hard tone when you lock them… As said before.
Tall scan mode is effective for locking somebody in your control zone, not attempting to find some mystically hidden enemy on a somewhat hard backdrop.
True, though that mostly plays into its defensive capabilities still. It would be quite easy to turn that into an attack, though nowhere near as much as an IRT indication.
I was under the impression that the Ja-37 that was downtiered has Aim-9L and PD radar. I might be wrong on this then.
It has strong flight model for dogfight and very cold engines. It is a plane you have to run away from.
My experience has been that there are more populated lobbies that are France vs USSR than USA vs France.
Well then the majority of the sim community has skill issues considering I was able to get over 300 player kills in the A-10C since it was released. This includes sim content creators who are working on a squad.
All of the planes that you are mentioning are basically some of the worst for their brackets or just farmer-mobiles.
None of the Tornados in-game have a good matchup against anything if the player on the opposite end has half of a brain.
It’s because the other planes they have are just as under tiered or they are over tiered.
The PD Phantoms could all move down. The agile eagle Phantoms are under tiered. The F8U is severely under tiered.
Tornado F.3 could be 11.7 in the current matchmaker and it wouldn’t change much. It’s an absolutely garbage plane when if it has to fight 12.3 Mirages and 12.3 F-14s.
Soviets are expected to make up the majority of the opposite side of the matchmaker. USA being handheld by BR system means I cannot find games to play.
Su-27 should be moved down to 13.0. So should the Tornado and the F4F ICE.
3 Likes
Basic fighter maneuvers I think
JA37D at 12.0 has the 9ls, the C has Aim-9Ps. I made a mistake with the PD, it does and its better than the FGR2s. Though the Skyflash DFs… Arent that great on PD, or at least the PDV on the FGR2
That is probably because US players joining the lobbies with the french (I know I do as Britain) specifically because Mirage F1 is pretty much the only hard-counter to the MLD and fighting both, especially in something weak. Is not fun.
I steam roll the Mig-23MLDs in it and even quite happily fight the Mirage 2Ks (you out stick them in the BVR and then outrun them afterwards, just dont try to turn fight them) and even quite happily wiped out a F-14A (you have better SARH, Better RWR and Better radar) and that is all before the new FM.
The Problem at flying it at 12.7 is that the Mig-29 and F-16 are equal or faster than you, can match you in the BVR if you arent careful (R-27ER is WAY better than Skyflash STs) and you cant fight them in the WVR at all, even with the new FM.
F3 is an exceptionally good aircraft these days, Just needs BOL fixed or Phimat. Pretty much its only weakness these days is having essentially non-funcitonal CMs. Main reason why I havent touched the F3 Late yet to spade it. Just a shame there is no 12.3 bracket so it only has 1/4 its playable as it stands no chance vs the 12.7s it faces.
The TWS tracks in the Su-27 are slow enough to update that they might as well not be there in the standard TWS mode.
The F-15 gives target location for more reliably and much faster if you know how to use the radar. Tailoring the scan pattern for the situation is a big tool that is under utilized by most players.
You are assuming the scan pattern doesn’t just miss the enemy the first time or that there is no change in altitude between the first and second scans that it takes to IFF the target.
It’s the most usable mode because it reduces the refresh time.
HMD has nothing to do with the radar and radar detection. There is no scan/detection mode where the radar is slaved to the HMD.
You probably don’t know how to use it then or just don’t have any experience in actual sim battles. I know that 90 percent of the custom games you play have Air RB markers turned on.
If you can pick me up with IRST…I can pick you up with radar. The range limitation of IRST is pretty severe and it is not able to IFF.
It’s also not like experienced sim players are unfamiliar with the concept of flying around the map with IRST or the radar turned off.
2 Likes
F5E is a perfectly capable fighter. It’s got the modern RWR, which identifies and gives direction/distance to whoever turns on their radar on the map. You could almost say (aside from launching R24R’s) the 23MLD’s radar is a detriment going up against F5E. If 23MLD scans anywhere in the F5’s vicinity (doesn’t have to actually find the F5), the F5 will know and can hone in with high accuracy on the location of the 23MLD. It’s RWR both serves as detection and IFF. It’s also about the only flight model that didn’t get nerfed when most other 3rd gen stuff was 2 months ago.
I think you severely underestimate just how good the survivability and situational awareness of the A10C is. Couple that with 4x invisible IRCCM missiles, tight turn radius, best gun in the game, MAWS and unlimited flares.
I agree, they used to be more on par IMO, JA37C made up for worse/unique FM and worse missiles with much greater radar/situational awareness. RWR rework/changes and FM changes didn’t work too much in JA37C’s favour. JA37C also went up 0.3 BR.
3 Likes
BVR can be negated by flat maps and multi-pathing.
F-14 has the same SARH missiles in one case. Or it has better SARH and good ARH in the case of the Iranian one.
The new FM is still not going to cause it to win any dogfights. It will only slightly less frequently compress and smash into the ground.
I disagree. It is only good when it is fighting at 12.0 and lower.
2 Likes
Wait a minute is that fully loaded F-15A vs empty loaded Su-27 ?
1 Like
I carried missiles for some of them because I didn’t have a clean load out that is pre-made.
3 Likes
bruh US mains never disappoint. they got multiple aim-120 slingers at 13.0 and us mains never complained about this shit, but this mf thinks ERs will be a problem of climbing. SUDDENLY
im not even at jets for USA lmao, im a british main. But multiple? they got an av 8 just as we have a shar, cant think of any other 120 slingers at 13.0 apart from them for us. Plus, an r27er is harder to defeat than a 120.
Not really for the US, but blue for in general, they of course have the f14s, Av8B, sea harrier, Kfir C10 and occasionally even the Ja37DI.
Still, the 3 best planes for that bracket are Jas39A, F15A and arguably Mirage 4k/Kfir C10.
2 of these are always on bluefor, while the other 2 can switch sides depending on the matchup
3 harriers (us, brit, italy) depending on the setup, f4f ice also depending on the setup, both late viggens (tech tree and premium) and kfir c.10. so thats at LEAST 3 depending on the setup. Apart from that, F-14 has 6 phoenixes that are notchable only in small window of 5-15 seconds after launch (unless you aren’t playing a flat map, which is not possible 8/10 times a day since bluefor plays only the easiest flattest maps in existence like denmark, sinai or tunisia, etc).
Then its a long time of RWR earrape, and then the last small opportunity window to dodge it with sharp crank when its 300-500m away from you. Otherwise you explode from a proxy fuze since that missile has 60kg of TntEq.
For this exact reason you’ll die if you attempt to multipath it. And US has 3 of those tomcats on 12.3-12.7, the only thing stopping them from ruining lobbies is the absolute absence of skill and game knowledge on US mains part.
Also let`s not downplay the fact that premium hornet (which sold and sells, and will be sold the most out of all the hornets in the game, quite possibly the most out of all the premium toptier planes in the game) has the best radar, RWR, HUD, airframe, gun placement, missile count (for its size) at the entire <13.0
In what world SARH missile “is harder to defeat” than ARH missile? How come your thought process put SARH(continuous radar tracking of a SINGLE target only, until impact) higher than ARH(fire and forget, multiple datalinks in TWS mode) in terms of strength and effectiveness in first place???
(???)
Also, there is absolutely no logic that can justify Su-27 sitting higher than: F-15A(in 3 nations), F-14B, F/A-18c early, Gripen A, and all other mentioned fox-3 carriers. The fact that su-27 sits at a bracket, where it ALWAYS plays against absolute toptier, whilst being GENERATIONS behind it is yet another case of gaijin intentionally ruining the game for more sales.
That said away, god`s witness, bluefor playerbase en masse still sucks at the game even when having quantitatively and qualitatively superior vehicle pool. And it sure will continue to do so even after F-35 comes out