Honestly from the sounds of it the best solution that can be implemented right now, is putting Russia on both teams, or at the very least not grouping nations together so consistently, at least until some AA/CAS parity can be restored
The ADATS lacks any capability to counter the Su-25SM3 outside of being behind cover.
It lacks smoke (only having ESS, which the Kh-38 can see through)
It only tracks with an optical lock, not radar, so it cannot track a Kh-38 until it’s too late
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It’s not, the most important factors are Defensive aids (MAW, good RWR), agility and quantity, if you know where and when the pantsir will attempt to engage from, then you can saturate the area with a weapon like the Maverick or GBU-39, forcing them to move and buying you position. Having a missile with long range is nice but if you are downed before reaching an envelope where it’s effective because you don’t know where the Pantsir is, then you have an issue
let me steer you back in the right direction here… The ADATS was never in the discussion… we were talking about the Pantsir… and I stated that not even the SM3 can reliably outrange the Pantsir… I have NO IDEA why you brought up the ADATS
US victim complex no doubt
No, I was originally saying the Pantsir allowed only one side to do CAS
The ADATS is insufficient to take out Russian CAS, and the Pantsir can simply shoot down American CAP/anti-CAS. Which is what I am getting at by bringing it into the discussion
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except it cant “simply” do that, a competent jet shouldn’t be phased by a pantsir
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If not putting RU on both teams (as there is valid criticism of civil war MM), at least block GER/SWE/RU from being allowed on the same team. Two of these together? Fine. But you can’t put the three best ground lineups together.
When you talk some of these systems they look cool and all, but the data link is what sells it.
For example, the IZ-305 (LMUR) is a really cool missile. But it’s effectively a KH-29T, and if I can’t launch it from without LOS and have a magical drone in the sky to “guide it in for me” I can’t get the extra 5-10km range out of it, and it’s only good for 14.5km.
imma be honest once the strike eagles and vipers take down the first pantsirs, its game over for the enemy team if we have 2 competent ground players and maybe 2-3 competent CAS players
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If we’re getting the Su-33, it should have it too, it’s still going to be a one turn gambler. Nothing obtrusive in WVR without TVC.
how much top tier do you play?
This is every game of top tier air RB, US on both sides all the time.
But I don’t mean as a permanent fix, just until new AA can be introduced.
Also, weirdly Sweden’s win rate is surprising low, not US, Britain, Israel low, but lower than the rest
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That’s an unrealistic expectation when Russian planes can comfortably sit in the immediate AO.
Let’s be fair and assume everyone knows what they are doing. Russian CAS can sit safely within the range of their friendly SPAA and outside the range of US SPAA (that is a range between ~10-16km from the battlefield).
The ADATS cannot reliably kill the Russian CAS, and the Russian CAS can simply multipath to the merge if the US player spawns CAP/anti-CAS.
And then, if they get to the merge, the Russian plane can simply pull up and bring the fight up in altitude so the Pantsir can kill them.
I’ve had this happen to me before. The enemy team was coordinating quite well and there was nothing I could do about it.
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If it’s needed, I’ll respawn in a Pantsir again to help the team. Not everyone does this, and even fewer people on all teams and nations are competent SPAA players, so I think the whole thing is very team dependent.
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The winrates (and lived experience) suggest this often is not happening though.
What more often happens is 2A7/122/BVM rout the US team in the initial engagement, push to spawn, all the AA gets nuked by Su-34’s and it’s GG.
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That is absolutely the key there. I’ve rarely had anyone drag CAS over to me in an SPAA on any team or BR above WW2 era and been able to help.
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lol what? Why are you following the bait? this is dumb in ARB it’s even more dumb in GRB. Why would you play to his advantage? You retain your advantage because your presence is a threat to his existence and he cant reliably engage with you around. Not to mention that the higher he goes the easier he is for Fox 3s to eat alive so?
i wonder, if there was a team with 8 ODL, and 2 competent full squads of US, vs 8 ODL, and 2 competent full squads of GER/SWE/RU, who would win?
I’m not. If I don’t they can simply drop on top of me
If I pull up for a shot they either already have a shot on me or the enemy Pantsir can see me (depending on positioning and terrain)