Statshark's Live Game Viewer is really bad for the game's health

For the record, I authenticated my website profile at Statshark to allow me to do some fancier searches than anonymous people. There are lots of ways to authenticate, including Google, Discord, Patreon, etc., all free.

The new live viewer is only available to paying Patreon subscribers, which I am not. The lowest giving level there is $6.50 a month.

I personally think people who are concerned about any aspect of this, rather than paying money and installing software no-questions-asked up front, should exercise the free option and ask about those concerns on their Discord first. Go direct to the source. I for one would be interested in the answers they get.

Only reason I’m talking about here is because this thread kinda turned into the thing I was worried at first about, that people were making this into a referendum about all of Statshark (which I think has some great aspects) and statshaming in general and not about this week’s new feature (the in-game app), a feature which was problematic for them the first time they tried to roll it out. Was really just trying to bring it back to OP’s point. Cheers.

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Fair enough.

I think the fact that a bad player has little to no issues fighting the vehicle is an indicator that it’s not OP, if anything. The whole reason I believe it’s not OP is cause it’s easy to counter it.

No, really no. Stats are used pretty much exclusively to just say (x) player is slightly worse so they go no opinion.

It is indeed a valid point the one you’re doing.

It’s just that I’d like Gaijin to do that service on a web platform and a proper ecosystem, not a 3rd party developer team which has been accused of… racism and cheating, to put two accusations midly.

Maybe it is a bit too much, but I humbly don’t want neither my stats or my performance to be related to them in any way if absolutely possible in case those accusations turn out to be real.
Though I wouldn’t mind if someone gets my stats from Gaijin’s own end.

p.s. Notice that I’m not a huge fan of the quoted CC like at all, but it’s the only one who dares talking about tough stuff about the game without many filters.

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When a vehicle has much higher stats than it’s contemporaries it is a clear sign something is wrong and that the vehicle in question is harder to counter before damage has been done.

Simply wrong.

Even much larger and definitely more competitive games are leaving that to 3rd party sites, so something happening from Gaijin’s side is pretty unlikely. I understand you have concerns about people that run SS, but I doubt something can be done about that, unless some competition arises.

Your and everyone else’s stats are public and can be scraped by literally any weirdo or a nutcase out there. If scummy people are in charge of SS, then players should revolt against them personally, not the tool itself. This could lead to some competition getting on the scene that’d “steal” the users from SS.

French players would laugh at that.

nope

There is a difference between minor nation TT players and major nation premium players.

You are both kind of right. Stats are often used purely to statshame others, but they’re also really useful to verifying/discrediting opinions

It’s more harm than good. If something someone says is actually wrong, you can simply disprove it using factual information.

When it comes to people like Beeschurger and Pooqich, they don’t care about factual information. They just statshame constantly and that only harms discussion.

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Last time I checked it didn’t work. It just levels out the ‘competitive’ (sweaty top tier players) vs the casuals.

Sure they can express their opinion but others might be sceptical about it if player is bad. Would you believe player who says that desert warrior is op when this player has 0.2 kd on that vehicle?

Then they will do it in game and/or via wt replay service

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Yes sure it is but you gave agreement to provide your data to gaijin including game related one. And they made it public (replays and in game stats being available for anyone). And if this data is public, those sites can parse it and use results for their purposes unless said purposes are illegal.

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There’s plenty of major titles out there that have ‘fan’ sites for stat tracking.

tracker.gg is the biggest one with some of the biggest titles in the FPS space.

Or maybe it’s that said mid player mostly only plays the US and thus barely faces the T58.

Different side of the same coin is your statement that Russia is the strongest top tier nation, which in turn comes from a lack of playing them.

(The latter part is another reason I like statshark. Hell I personally use statshark more to identify nation mains than I use it for the stats)

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i love you pangolin

From my perspective, there are several serious concerns regarding this application.

First of all, everyone should understand that running a poorly documented third-party application is inherently risky. Users do not know exactly what the application does in the background or when it performs certain actions. The risk becomes even greater when the application requires internet access, as it can theoretically transmit any collected data without the user’s knowledge.

What we can reasonably assume is that the application captures the screen, most likely in the form of screenshots, in order to perform OCR. Even if nothing malicious happens intentionally, there are still legitimate concerns. For example: what if a user has their online banking page open in the background while the game and this application are running? What if the user alt-tabs from the game to a sensitive window? Could such data be captured unintentionally? What happens to those screenshots? Are they stored locally, processed remotely, or sent elsewhere? What exact data is being collected, transmitted, and stored? At the moment, users simply do not know.

Using such an application ultimately requires trusting that its authors have no malicious intentions and that the software behaves exactly as advertised. Each user has to decide whether they trust the people behind StatShark enough to accept that level of risk.

Another major concern is that this application appears to violate Gaijin’s Terms of Service.

3.2.3. No malicious or deceiving use

  • employ any third-party software that interferes with the Game(s) in any way, unless explicitly authorized by Gaijin for that specific Game(s) or related Service(s)

Technically, we do not know whether Gaijin has authorized this application, but there is no public indication that such authorization exists, which makes this highly questionable.

3.2.3. No malicious or deceiving use

  • use software (such as bots or mods) that automates gameplay, alters the game’s mechanics or functionality, provides an unfair advantage over other players who do not use such software, or otherwise disrupts the intended game experience for you or any other player

It is difficult to argue that this application does not provide an advantage. That is, in fact, the primary reason for using it. Without such software, accessing and processing this information during a battle would be significantly harder. As a result, users of this application gain an advantage over players who do not use it. This also disrupts the intended gameplay experience, as decisions in battle can be influenced by external information.

8.1.3. Attempting to gain unauthorized access to the Service(s) or another User’s Account or collecting information through the Service(s) not explicitly permitted under the Terms and Conditions.

This application clearly performs automated information collection. Screen capturing combined with OCR is, by definition, a form of automated data collection, and the game does not explicitly permit this kind of real-time data extraction.

A further issue is that some players will likely use this application regardless of these concerns. If Gaijin ultimately considers this software harmful or rule-breaking, the consequences will most likely affect the users rather than the developers. In such cases, arguments like “I found this application on the internet and did not realize it violated the rules” historically do not protect accounts from penalties.

If Gaijin intended players to see detailed ratings or performance indicators of all participants during a battle, such information would likely already be available on the in-game scoreboard. The fact that it is not suggests a deliberate design choice, possibly to avoid toxic behavior, targeted harassment, or premature match abandonment based on perceived team strength.

Finally, it is also worth noting that this application is effectively pay-to-use, as access is limited to Patreon supporters. This raises an additional concern under the Terms of Service:

3.2.5. No Commercial Use:

  • use the Game(s) or any part of it for commercial purposes, including but not limited to (1) engaging with or facilitating commercial advertising or offers or (2) transferring In-Game Items through means other than those explicitly provided by the Game(s) or other Gaijin Service(s).

At the very least, this particular issue would fall on the side of the application’s authors rather than its users, but it further strengthens the argument that the project operates in a legally and ethically questionable space.

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As others have said before it was just as easy to do this before Statshark came along. I used to play with a group of people who when the match started scanned through the leaderboard within seconds (I still do it myself) to find the best players and target them.

Statshark is an extension for this but even in its current form it is quite slow. I bought a Patreon membership yesterday to try out the SharkClient and it takes several seconds to minutes for the stats to appear. (You have to hold TAB for the app to check through the names)

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They don’t have that different stats than contemporaries from minor nations. Community had it’s suspicion about minor nations having higher average skill level than major ones. SS pretty much confirmed this to be true.

This allows people to identify outliers at both ends of the spectrum. For example, T58 stands out really hard at 8.3 and no one can deny that.

If you want, you could DM me a couple of your concerns and I can relay it to Hadi in the PatreonChat.