As long as the match maker keeps the same number of SPAA and planes on each team, there won’t be any major issues that I can think of.
Honestly, I’m all for it cuz it will stop all the CAS hater “ARB shOUlD hAvE SPAA iF GRB HaS plANes” copy pasta.
And in ASB player controlled SPAAGs would be a decent nerf to what we have now 🤣
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For me, a fun concept has always been being able to do SOMETHING in ARB after dying. So maybe SPAA is a second life? Ideally ARB would be in a much better place.
Its not something I’ve thought out in egregious detail because;
A) It’d likely never come to the game (and if it did, it wouldn’t be permanent)
B) It’d be a niche feature at best
C) Probably would fit in a different environment, as ARB right now is just go on tiktok for 5 minutes (while multipathing, if applicable) and then throw out all your missiles or fly super high up, fire your Fox 3s and then notch your way back to low alt.
I think it’d be cool, alas it isn’t something needed nor necessary, so how it’d affect ARB is not something I’ve thought of. If I was advocating for it or really wanted it, then I’d have a 10 page document detailing it
Whilst I don’t think it would be appropriate for ARB due to it’s very nature, and nor am I sure how you could incorporate players directly. SEAD / heavier AI air defences in SB and a future RB EC gamemode would be very fun.
I suppose in a “infinite” respawn gamemodes, you could have player “remote control” some of those Normally AI controlled SAMs/SPAAGs (even if it was purely the turret and you had no control over the movement of the vehicle(s))
Bait used to be believeable lol. But hey, I like fishing, so I’ll take it.
I can turn your entire argument around, and it’ll make just as much sense, depending on your biases. You say, “SPAA only requires an extremely basic understanding of lead and bullet drop”, and I say CAS only requires an extremely basic understanding of lead and bomb drop.
Meanwhile, as an AA player, I first have to find a suitable spot where I can A) properly observe the sky without leaving any blind spots for CAS to sneak up on me, while also B) making sure I’m not in view of enemy tanks, which I’m often unable to defend against.
Then, assuming I don’t have radar, and let’s say I don’t, since you’re also basing CAS’ difficulty on not having a bomb computer (which would handle most of the targeting for you), I have to find and identify a target. This becomes increasingly difficult at higher BRs due to faster planes, and I also have to hope for good weather to get a clear view.
Next, I need to accurately judge the plane’s range and speed. Depending on the ammunition I’m using, and its velocity and drag, I have to calculate the correct lead and only then do I get to fire. But if I shoot from too far away, the plane has enough time to dodge. So I have to decide whether to risk letting it come closer, for an easier shot, while risking that the CAS will kill a teammate or me, or try for a more difficult shot at range to prevent it from dropping its bombs.
TL:DR
I’m not saying SPAA is super hard, or that CAS is super easy, they both require their own share of skill sets. I’m simply saying that your choice of words was extremely biased, and thus isn’t a valid argument.
Your entire argument is based on CAS vs AA, which just isn’t the case most of the time, a regular tank has absolutely no way of defending itself against a plane. Period.
And no, getting a radar or even missiles doesn’t eliminate all skill required for AAs. It just means adopting an entirely different set of skills. The lead indicator isn’t 100% accurate, the slightest manoeuvres will throw it off, you still have to manually adjust your aim to land hits. In fact, I often find it easier to avoid locking onto a target and just eyeball it.
Same story with missiles. IR missiles either have a pitiful range or are defeated extremely easily. And line of sight guided missiles actually are hard to aim, again, the slightest manoeuvres make tracking and leading very difficult.
Second TLDR
CAS should be, in my opinion, high risk high reward. You should be able to take out an entire team on your own, BUT, it should require a lot of skill, you could just as easily be shot down before you manage to do anything. There should be an imbalance, but not towards CAS, as it currently is.
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This is just flat out false. I will often times lure in CAS in my Kv-7 using my MG so that I can shoot him down with my cannon. I’ve shot multiple planes down with my ASU-57 as well. The problem isn’t that tanks are defenseless or that its even hard to defend them from CAS, the issue is that most people would rather just ignore CAS, then complain when they’re the one who gets bombed.
I disagree here too. SPAA can attack CAS from extreme distances, even from spawnpoint to spawnpoint. CAS does not have to engage SPAA for it to be a threat, so CAS is a constant fight with SPAA, whether it’s trying to get kills whilst avoiding SPAA, or actually going face to face with SPAA to destroy it.
Ive always seen CAS as the opposite imo. Most CAS planes (aside from Russian ones) can’t get alot of kills due to limited armament, so I’ve always seen CAS as a quick and relatively low risk way to destroy overpowered tanks like Jagdpanzer 4s or players who are spawn camping.
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Radarless SPAA requires a lot of situational awareness since you have literally no warning when a guided bomb is coming for you, By the time you hear a plane flying over its already too late.
Even AA’s with radar have blind spots above them that you can abuse by just flying higher.
SPAA have to not only worry about being spotted by multiple planes but also have to avoid everything on the ground, Since most AA’s lack the means to effectively defend themselves against tanks.
MANPADS AA’s suck at fighting helicopters and are free kills for them since they struggle to lock within 2km half the time.
Most CAS aircraft get flares at 9.7+, You can just pre-flare and cut the throttle as you make your run and watch as MANPADS fail to hit you.
A-10’s and Su-25’s are extremely annoying when they are played by someone with more than 4 neurons because of that, Especially the Su-25’s since they have a habit of surviving missile hits than any other plane even the A-10’s.
Even in the lower tiers most AA’s are flimsy and open, If you have an aircraft that can carry rockets all you need to do is lob one in their general direction and pull away and that AA will be dead before they have a chance to do anything about you.
Moving out of spawn is not always an option for AA, Loads of maps lack any place that an AA can effectively hide without putting themselves in danger of the enemy ground team, The second you start shooting at planes the ground team is just going to see the bullets or missiles as a big “FREE FOOD HERE!” sign and rush over to kill you.
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coming back from my WT break and people still going about SPAA and CAS, oh wells. Guess some just won’t ever learn how to properly counter or use CAS or use SPAA/SAM.
“loads of” you mean like one or two?
I remember you, that “just spawn spaa bro” guy, why bother coming back though? I heard once you quit playing, you will finally get a gf bro
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No
i don’t care about SPAA in ARB
what i meant is, it should be a rock - paper - scissor kind of situation
right now it’s basically rock - coughing baby - nuclear bomb at almost every BR except 9.0-10.0, where AA can actually do its job.
And let’s not pretend CAS doesn’t have counterplay. Manpads and things like roland are hilariously easy to evade
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Cool beans
When you were away, I think I found your long-lost brother
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Nice! hope you were doing well. Glad to see ya again too.
I gave up playing things like the osa or roland because of this. I die to enemy tanks more than planes. Sitting in spawn no matter how well your team is doing you will die to spawn campers.
And because everytime you shoot, you basically also shoot a giant streaming flare saying “here is a free kill and where I am” its impossible to hide anywhere, and some maps are just dreadful.
SPAA without guns that arent rat tanks like the weasel are miserable to play.
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yes, so lets add more AA, balance AA and CAS, therefore creating counter play. Not advocate for Aircraft to be removed from Ground?
Real. Type 93’s only redeeming factor is that you can zoom around if your team controls a massive area, or find cheeky spots that your team can cover you from. Also just being able to avoid being kill because of raw speed. Other AA don’t have that, which makes them miserable as hell. You rely completely on your team, whereas your team (at these BRs) only look ahead of them for a kill.
Always glad to see people clown on certain individuals arguing SPAA is the issue, and not cas, some will argue for an eternity just so that their US 9.0 whatever lineup can be stronger, but it ain’t ever happening.
Anyway i’m gonna take my ozelot for a spin.
Imagine cancer rolling without a repetitive route and spit a bomb accurately without a CCIP on the worst gepard player that opens fire at over 4km and drove himself right on your attack route.
Holy skill issue not to understand how CAS works