"Small" rant about captured/lend lease vehicles in tech trees

[hjnbnb]

As someone who mainly plays Britain, Italy, and Japan, I can say I would rather not have copy pastas throughout the tree and would rather have large gaps, especially since it’s mostly experienced players playing these countries and don’t need to go through another 6 shermans

[Morvran]

@hjnbnb

I heard it might be a premium, if it is, yes I will fork over the $120 to buy the damn thing, but that’s just because I love both the British tree and MiG-21s. Does NOT mean I want it in the tree. All for adding it to Russia though!

I’ve heard this too, But leak list flip flop between both. Premium is where im expecting. But considering its been 18 months since the F4JUNK. I was hoping for an actually usable premium that i would want to buy. But I wouldnt buy the mig-21. If I wanted it. i would play the Russian TT.

What Britain really needs in my opinion is a really good premium CAS aircraft .Something like the Harrier Gr5. Basically a Gr7 but with 9Ls, so can sit a little lower in BR. Would be great fun. Other options could be the Saudi Tornado IDS. Good CAS/SL printer as well from that.

Another A2A, that really isnt going to be that competitive at its BR. Is just gunna suck. Not too mention the TKs. Plenty of aircraft i fly, that would likely encounter this thing, doesnt have radar. Like the Harrier Gr7 or future Harrier Gr9A. In Sim. I will always fire at a mig-21 silhouette. So if you are in this thing… Not my fault.

@hjnbnb

I mean couldn’t Britain get an early EF Typhoon prototype?

I wouldnt want it as a premium, but I think if the leaks are right. US and USSR are getting Typhoon equivalents this update

[hjnbnb]

@Morvran

I wouldnt want it as a premium, but I think if the leaks are right. US and USSR are getting Typhoon equivalents this update

Oh no not ever as a premium, I don’t agree with jet premiums at all (yes I know I buy them), but it would be preferable to any MiG-21. Premium or not.

[Kathryn_Janeway]

@Morvran

Saudi Arabian Tornado F3 (would need to double check they had AMRAAM)

If they had AMRAAM then please consider I’m on your side.

@Morvran

Indian Sea Harrier FRS51 and BAE Hawk

My opionion is that these subsonics with fox 3s, i.e. shit airframe with meta missiles at a relatively weird BR their count should be reduced to as few as possible.

For the other aircrafts you post I would say alright as long as they are technologically originated from Britain/South Africa and/or are produced in the UK (and South Africa, since it is a subtree). i.e. The Tornadoes, Harriers, Jaguars, that Hunter, the Buccaneer and of course the TSR.2, however I would say I personally oppose the Mirage III SAAF since it is technically a French aircraft. Basically same standard for the Russian made Mig-21, eh? (Same to that T-90S but it’s already ingame so we basically can’t do much about it now)

@Morvran

The point is. There is 0 need to add a Soviet aircraft to our TT. If they want to add more indian, fine, but at least add the Indian stuff we exported to them and not the stuff they imported from Russia.

Consider I have the same view as long as there are better candidates. ;)

[Morvran]

Yeah. Sea harrier FA2 likely this update. Which should be pretty decent if its the right BR. But I see Typhoon this year. Any later and we are back to 2023 levels of DOA at top tier

[Shrek_2_On_DVD]

Yeah, it’s definitely been more noticeable in recent years including the battlepass vehicles, new premiums and sub-tech trees with the most likely confirmed new Benelux tree coming for France no doubt. This is starting to get really out of control and playing major nations doesn’t even feel unique anymore in battles at certain BRs at this point.

Exported vehicles are realistic and can be added to fill missing gaps for minor nations which is nice
but I feel if there is a really different and close vehicle counterpart there is for a certain missing gap it definitely should be added over just the same vehicle with just a different camouflage.

[Kathryn_Janeway]

@hjnbnb

and where’s the M4A2E8? M4A3 75?

Just fyi I believe the swede premium sherman is an M4A3 75. (I don’t know much but i guess it is an M4A3 hull with 75mm gun)

@hjnbnb

I heard it might be a premium, if it is, yes I will fork over the $120 to buy the damn thing,

Overpricing, although serious, is pretty much a Gaijin issue.

@hjnbnb

early EF Typhoon prototype?

I would like the EAP since it’s pretty unique, however I do not know if its combat performance are OP or too bad…

@hjnbnb

I know your point about the MiG-21-93 but more people want to grind USSR so wouldn’t it generate more money?

Gaijin will get both the Russian and India money by adding both aircrafts easily lol

[Morvran]

@Kathryn_Janeway

For the other aircrafts you post I would say alright as long as they are technologically originated from Britain/South Africa and/or are produced in the UK (and South Africa, since it is a subtree). i.e. The Tornadoes, Harriers, Jaguars, that Hunter, the Buccaneer and of course the TSR.2, however I would say I personally oppose the Mirage III SAAF since it is technically a French aircraft. Basically same standard for the Russian made Mig-21, eh? (Same to that T-90S but it’s already ingame so we basically can’t do much about it now)

Yep, I agree. Mirage III was more of an honourable mention (as South africa is a full Sub-TT not this wierd CW third-Sub-TT-but-isnt-really-on-the-TT then anything they actually operated would be reasonable) . its also a BR we are a tad weak at.

But yeah. Plenty of aircraft to choose from that Britain did actually export.

@Kathryn_Janeway

My opionion is that these subsonics with fox 3s, i.e. shit airframe with meta missiles at a relatively weird BR their count should be reduced to as few as possible.

Honestly… Sea Harrier FA2 will outperform the Mig-21. Sea Harrier FRS51 is worse than the FA2, but probably about equal to the Mig-21. The FA2 has more missiles, better radar, better acceleration and climb rate. Heck I’ve beaten plenty of Mig-21s in dogfights in the FRS1 and the FA2 has the better engine, meaning it would be even easier.

Vs F-15Cs, F-16Cs and Gripens would struggle, but so will most BVR trucks at that BR.

@Kathryn_Janeway

If they had AMRAAM then please consider I’m on your side.

I’d need to double check. I think they retired them in 2006, so its possible there was overlap. britian starting upgrading them with AMRAAM in 1998 ish

[hjnbnb]

@Kathryn_Janeway

Just fyi I believe the swede premium sherman is an M4A3 75. (I don’t know much but i guess it is an M4A3 hull with 75mm gun)

It’s a composite vehicle, Sherman iii turret (M4A1) with Sherman iv hull (M4A2) iirc. Don’t quote me on this though not 100% sure.

@Kathryn_Janeway

Overpricing, although serious, is pretty much a Gaijin issue.

It is, and the price actually has nothing to do with my statement I don’t know why I included it.

@Kathryn_Janeway

I would like the EAP since it’s pretty unique, however I do not know if its combat performance are OP or too bad…

Well artificially buff/nerf it, they do it to other vehicles so why not this one? They’ve already thrown realism out the window.

@Kathryn_Janeway

Gaijin will get both the Russian and India money by adding both aircrafts easily lol

True but are they going to do both?

[hjnbnb]

@hjnbnb

It’s a composite vehicle, Sherman iii turret (M4A1) with Sherman iv hull (M4A2) iirc. Don’t quote me on this though not 100% sure.

I got this wrong. Ignore me.

[Morvran]

@Kathryn_Janeway

I would like the EAP since it’s pretty unique, however I do not know if its combat performance are OP or too bad…

It would have made the PERFECT 12.0/12.3 aircraft for last year. The only thing that would have needed tweaking is swapping the ASRAAM out for Aim-9s.

But it was hard denied. Because it never actually live fired a missile. it only carried mock-up weapons. Though it had everything else. Radar, RWR, CMs, etc

[Kathryn_Janeway]

@Morvran

Honestly… Sea Harrier FA2 will outperform the Mig-21.

Well my point is that the Harrier (and Hawk, as you mentioned in the post above) are subsonic. Gaijin always drastically reduce BR of subsonic aircrafts with meta missile for some reason, maybe stereotype.

[hjnbnb]

@Morvran

But it was hard denied. Because it never actually live fired a missile. it only carried mock-up weapons. Though it had everything else. Radar, RWR, CMs, etc

What about the Yak-141 never having any of the equipment it needed to ever be combat ready? And gaijin can’t make an exception saying USSR struggles either.

[Morvran]

Maybe. I’ve been predicting the FA2 will be 12.0-12.3. I’ve seen people predicting the Mig-21 to be about 12.0-12.3.

Its possible theyd be the same BR. it would be carried by its radar/Missiles. but the entire meta is about to go that way I think. Otherwise aircraft like the Typhoon are never going to be added. Not a lot can beat it in WVR

[Morvran]

Yeah… That was the argument we all made. As well as the F-16AJ only existing in a brochure

[hjnbnb]

At the time I could understand the AJ to a point as Japan didn’t have anything… but now they have the F-15J it should be removed and eventually replaced with the F-2

[Kathryn_Janeway]

@hjnbnb

Well artificially buff/nerf it, they do it to other vehicles so why not this one?

These buff/nerf are always biased toward [ahem i dont want to get censored or start ww3 here] y’know x)

@hjnbnb

They’ve already thrown realism out the window.

Problem is they still want it to look like realism for some reason.

@hjnbnb

True but are they going to do both?

I think I saw the 21-93 on a leak list somewhere

@Morvran

But it was hard denied. Because it never actually live fired a missile. it only carried mock-up weapons. Though it had everything else. Radar, RWR, CMs, etc

Well that’s kinda sad… but yeah the Yak 141 situation.

[Morvran]

Riley went full deep dive. Well worth reading his research:

The British Mini-Typhoon the BAe EAP

[r/Warthunder - The British 12.0 Mini Typhoon the BAe EAP] The EAP in flight. Before anyone comments to inform me that the EAP was rejected (I know, I made the proposal), this thread exists for me to document my sources and for other individuals who are fans of the EAP or would like to see it in game to deposit theirs, this is done in accordance with Smin’s response to myself which said the EAP would be fine in the machinery of war category but with the current provided information did not fit…

[YaSen]

I don’t care much about C&P, but the most annoying thing for me is the need to research the same vehicle multiple times. It would be much better if once I researched a model in one TT it would be also available in other (I’m talking here about exact same models, such as for example M4A4 in Italy, France and China).
PS I also don’t like anything about trialed vehicles and captured vehicles in the regular trees (unless it was used in numbers, such as Italian D.520 for example).

[Morvran]

Or even if the mods carried over. So it wasnt a stock grind everytime