I dont see big 3 getting copy cat vehicles from other trees on regular basic just to fill the tree? Why should Japan keep getting american things in tank tree?
Japan is nowhere near having the amount of vehicles the big 3 has. Wake up shindo.
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It can be filled with japanese stuff. Gaijin just adds anything unique japanese like Ka-Chi as 1 chance event and copycats are regular in the tree.
Show me Japanese jet planes that could be used in a CAS role
Like with what?
Japan lacks any serious ATGM carrier and I don’t think it’s going to change soon. The LAV does not have a fixed ATGM launcher, so I don’t think it’s eligible
No modern/high tier IFV. Even if they add the ICV (the new 8x8 IFV), that’s 9.7 tier and it only has a Bushmaster. Also, I’m not sure about you but I personally hate these gigantic boxes they have added like the Vilkas and VBIC
Top tier also lacks variety. You can choose a Type 10, a Type 10, an 11.0 Type 10, a Type 90 or if you want to get spicy, a Type 90 (B) ! I understand this is entirely “Japan’s fault”, but you get my point. The 48t config has yet to be shown to the public either. Same thing as France with the Leclercs but at least they have options for support vehicles and maybe the EMBT in the future
Not to mention CAS, Japan is never going to have competent CAS unless they add ASMs and GCS-1, but considering we still don’t have them I doubt we ever will. JDAMs are alright but they are only good against stationary targets considering their small size
Most of the unique things that were suggested and could help Japan without a subtree (Komatsu B78 / GSR, CCV etc) are great, but we just simply have no information on them
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Japan lacks any serious ATGM carrier and I don’t think it’s going to change soon. The LAV does not have a fixed ATGM launcher, so I don’t think it’s eligible
It is not totally true. There is one vehicle with 6 ATGM and, honestly it looks like the refreshing the Japanese tree or even revival of Japanese top tier.
It is MMPM or Chuu-Ta.
It is Toyota based ATGM carrier with 6 special missiles which can be guided with Fire-and-Forget method or laser, like Hellfire.
Also the aiming system looks good because it is the Thermal sight (The vehicle from 2009 so I am sure it is 3rd generation) and Radar what can detect vehicles. And all of This is located on high bar what allow shooting from the safe cover.
And yes, all of this on Toyota drift base!
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Oh, You are right, I totally forgot about that thing. Hopefully we see it soon since we already have some Spike/Spike-like vehicles in game.
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Your name reminds me that I recently suggested Ohka. Have you seen?
I was talking about ww2 tanks that could fill the tree. I play only ww2.
I got renamed because my previous name was offensive so I just choose something at random, don’t read too much into it
Yeah I read the suggestion, I voted yes but honestly I’d rather see some other guided munitions first like the Ki-147 which would be easier to implement and are less offensive, especially after reading other people’s concerns
I’d love the supposed interceptor version though, shame there is not much info on it
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oh okay then
So I am assuming you are proposing an unprecedented addition into the game? Since as far as I know, not a single subtree nation currently have more than one top tier vehicle (not Finland, not South Africa).
To be fair you never add all options at once. The game lives from having vehicles that aren’t yet in game, so having options is just about the most important thing for a techtree.
All existing subtrees have the option for additions that players can look forward to, that they keep playing the game for and that they keep playing the techtree for.
As for the amount of top tier vehicles per subtree, I don’t think there is any fixed guideline. South Africa and Hungary none yet, while Finland has two. And keep in mind that none of these subtrees is done, they will keep getting vehicles in future updates.
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Finland has two, the 2A6 and ITO 90M (not part of the Finnish line and added in a previous update, but still from a ‘subtree nation’). The Hungarian Leopard and Lynx were both top rank when implemented., though not sure if that qualifies them as top tier.
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For what it’s worth, South Africa has one for air forces in the JAS39C, and it’s been arguably the most game-impactful one to date (While ITO and 2A6 are competitive top tiers, the relative leap in performance of the UK air forces from the Gripen being provided was greater than the addition of the 2A6 was to Sweden).
Whether or not one supports the Thai VT-4, I will say it certainly counts as a double standard to pretend that top-tier subtree content that is present outside of the native faction does not exist, and it’s especially ironic given the VT-4’s nature as an export vehicle.
I don’t personally consider it a vital addition in a broader sense, especially if the Oplot-T is up as a candidate, but I’m also not against it due to the standards the game has already, and would again refrain from closing doors on arbitrary double standards. There may be other arguments as to why it would not belong, but the argument about top tier gating is nonsense as it does not reflect on the rest of the game.
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Missing Little Fella, P-64 and how it nearly got to Thailand.
If you look at the infographic for 2024 Children Day’s static show, you will notice a little plane that, despite having not been used by Thai Airforce, makes an appearance on the Children Day’s show. I am talking of, of course, the North American P-64.
The story of how North American P-64 nearly got itself into Thai service is an interesting one. In short, P-64, initially called NA-68 before being pressed into American service, was the fighter plane that Thailand brought from US prior to the Franco-Thai war. The order of purchasing was later canceled by the US as Thailand began its military operations against French Indochina with the fear that Thailand might use the purchased NA-68 against France in the Indochina, causing Thailand to look for alternative fighters, resulting in the purchasing of Ki-30, Ki,-21, and Ki-27.
NA-68 with Thai marking readied to be sent to Thailand before the cancelation
As of currently, the displaying P-64 in Thailand are the recreation made through the utilization of T-6 Texan training craft components.
Thai “P-64”, “Hanuman”, shown in the 2024 Children Day Static Show, Don Muang Airport.
References:
เครื่องบินขับไล่แบบ P-64 (NA-68) และ A-27 (NA-69) ของกองทัพอากาศไทยที่มาไม่ถึงเมืองไทย | “รัชต์ รัตนวิจารณ์” ท้าวทองไหล (rach1968.blogspot.com)
Sompong Nondhasa’s Facebook
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Well depending on wether china gets the M1A2T then well it would be more or less fair if this were to come to japan that japan would get the VT-4
Just my honest opinion
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I’d certainly not be against it, but I don’t think a Thai VT-4 for Japan is contingent on an M1A2T for China, the precedence set by the game already qualifies both, and how fair one or another may be is not conditional upon each other.
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Yesterday, January 18th, was a Royal Thai Armed Forces Day.
On this day in the year 1592, King Naraesuan the Great led his army against the invasion force led by the Crown Prince Of Burma, resulting in the victory of King Naraesuan after the battle on the elephants’ backs between the two.
Emblem of Suphan Buri Province depicting the event
The artwork depicting the event
Interestingly enough, the record of this battle also mentions the involvement of around 500 Japanese mercenaries on the side of King Nareasuan, making it the oldest record/chronicle that mentions Japanese people in Thai history.
Under the employment of Ayutthaya Kingdom, Japanese mercenaries and traders were valued for their martial prowess and trading skills. Among many Japanese, the adventurer named Yamada Nagamasa volunteered himself to the Ayutthaya Army and rose to the rank of nobility within the short period of time, valued for his martial and leadership skills.
An image of Lord Yamada Nagamasa’s Japanese Army under the employment of Ayutthaya Kingdom flying Hinomaru flag
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Im not sure if this is the right place to put it but I think this ship would be a pretty good and interesting premium naval vessel if SEA does indeed go as some sort of a sub collection of nations headed by Thailand.
Introducing
BRP Rajah Humabon / JDS Hatsuhi / USS Atherton
Cata Raya Chita!
BRP Rajah Humabon / JDS Hatsuhi / USS Atherton
Cata Raya Chita!
US Navy Service
One of the last World War II era ships to ever been decommissioned. DE-169 or USS Atherton is a Cannon-Class Destroyer Escort laid down in January 14, 1943. She was first sent for ASW patrol duties around the waters of the Caribbean and then was transferred to Task Force 62 for escort duties for transatlantic convoys. It was with this that she earned her famous kill when she destroyed U-853 close to Rhode Island using depth charge attacks with the newly developed Hedgehog mortars. This was credited as the sinking of the last German submarine attack in American waters in WW2.
Before being decommissioned, her crew received these awards:
- American Campaign Medal with one battle star
- European-African-Middle Eastern Campaign Medal
- Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal
- World War II Victory Medal
- Navy Occupation Medal with “ASIA” clasp
JMSDF Service
Post-war she was decommissioned and transferred as a loan to the newly formed JMSDF as the JDS Hatsuhi (DE-263) in 1955 to bolster its capabilities while the ships of the JMSDF were still being built under the terms of the Mutual Defense Assistance Program. She was joined with JDS Asahi (USS Amick / BRP Datu Sikatuna) where they both served until being decommissioned from JMSDF service in 1975.
Philippine Navy Service
Remained laid-up in Japan, she was transferred to the Philippine government on 13 September 1976 and was Transferred as an Excess Defense Article on 23 December 1978. She was then towed to South Korea where she received an extensive refit and modernization in 1979 and was then commissioned as BRP Rajah Humabon (PF-6) classifying it as a frigate under the new Philippine Navy Standards. She served as the backbone of the Philippine Navy with her sister ship BRP Rajah Sikatuna where she served as the Navy’s flagship. She served until 1993 but was recalled and overhauled back into service in 1996 with a new hull number (PF-11) where she served until being decommissioned in March 15, 2018. Planned to be placed as a museum ship, she was sadly sunk during a storm on October 30, 2022.
Cannon Class Specs Drawing based on sister ship USS Swearer (DE-186)
Specifications
Now the specs and armaments of the ship vary mostly in 2 overall stages. Before and After its overhaul and refit in 1979 with more minor refits during its recommissioning in 1996. As such I will split this section in 2 main parts.
JDS Hatsuhi
PRE-1979 Refit
Displacement
- 1,390 tons standard
- 1,620 tons full load
Length
Propulsion
- 4 × GM Mod. 16-278A diesel engines with electric drive, 6,000 shp (4,474 kW), 2 screws
Speed
- 21 knots (39 km/h; 24 mph)
Range
- 10,800 nmi (20,000 km) at 12 kn (22 km/h; 14 mph)
Armament
- 3 × Mk.22 3-inch/50-caliber guns
- 1 × quad 1.1" AA gun
- 8 × 20 mm Mk.4 AA guns
- 3 × 21-inch (533 mm) torpedo tubes
- 1 × Hedgehog Mk.10 anti-submarine mortar (144 rounds)
- 8 × Mk.6 depth charge projectors
- 2 × Mk.9 depth charge tracks
BRP Rajah Humabon
POST-1979 Refit
Displacement
- 1,240 long tons (1,260 t) standard
- 1,620 long tons (1,646 t) full
Length
Propulsion
- 2 × GM-EMD 16-645E7 (Turbo) Main Diesel Engines, 2 x GM-EMD 8-268A Auxiliary Diesel Engines, 1 x GM-EMD 3-268A Auxiliary Diesel Engine combined output of 300 kW, 2 x screws
Speed
- 18 knots maximum sustained
- 21 knots top speed
Range
- 10,800 nmi (20,000 km) at 12 kn (22 km/h; 14 mph)
Armament
- 3 × Mk.22 76mm U.S. 3"/50 Caliber Guns
- 3 × Mk.1 Mod.2 Twin Bofors 40mm L/60 Autocannons
- 6 × Mk.10 Oerlikon 20mm Autocannons
- 4 × M2 Browning .50 Caliber Machine Guns
Sensors and Processing Systems
How will it function in-game?
There have been multiple proposals for the Canon Class Destroyer Escorts to be placed in the game as 3.7 Destroyers, I think it should be the same or upped to a max of 4.3. HTMS Pinklao, another Cannon-Class Sister ship was part of the proposed Thailand Naval Subtree as a coastal ship without a precise BR so it can go either Coastal or Bluewater as long as its the same BR.
What I envision it in the game however is to be some sort of prototype to give developers a feel if they should implement dynamic BR based on installed modifications (and dynamic vehicles based on installed modifications as well). If the player chooses to remove the radar and sensor suite, in exchange of having ASW weaponry, and inferior AA guns - players could play it as a 3.7 destroyer but if it chooses to have the radar and sensory suite, in exchange for not having ASW weaponry, and superior AA guns, they could get the vehicle upped in BR to 4.0. Whatever modifications were chosen though could also change the name of the ship with it either being the JDS Hatsuhi or BRP Rajah Humabon.
Why post it in the Siam-Thailand Lineups for Japanese Tech Tree?
From my perspective, the reason why the ship is interesting is because it was part of the JMSDF and THEN became a part of the Philippine Navy. Japan has no need for this ship in its tech tree as it has far more superior ships but this interesting tidbit makes it enough as something of like a “collector’s vehicle”. Why in the Thailand proposal you may ask? Well as mentioned earlier, HTMS Pinklao is already part of the proposed naval subtree and this is a perfect sidegrade with the regular tech tree version. Thailand also has the best chance of being a gateway to introduce Southeast Asian vehicles and why not start it with something that is both interesting and actually once served with the Japanese Navy?
More Photos:
USS Atherton
* USS Moberly conducts a Hedgehog attack on U-853, USS Atherton in distance. HH-NH48872*
JDS Hatsuhi in another angle
BRP Rajah Humabon Decommissioning
BRP Rajah Humabon partly submerged in its dock after Typhoon Paeng
Sources:
https://www.cnnphilippines.com/news/2022/11/1/Philippine-Navy-BRP-Rajah-Humabon.html
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