pl12s are so much better its not even funny
to add to this, aim120ds are simply not better than pl12as, they were worse before the aim120d and pl12a were added and they are still worse cause nothing changed besides launch limits removal(which are actually viable in pl12s)
you mostly focus around soviet and russian stuff, much more stuff available
bug reports has been useless
Yeah but “hydraulic limitations” and other similar limitations will always apply if a plane is Russian or Chinese either way.
It’s just dumb imo for people trying to argue that Chinese planes shouldn’t have the same limitations as Russian ones just cause the Chinese planes are newer.
in an absence of evidence sure, is there any evidence hydraulics in Chinese flankers have been changed? also i might be wrong on this but arent those limitations not in the game currently?
Rudder lock up and roll rate lockup are definitely limitations modeled in game. Just look at the schimitar or other British planes for example, that thing has a horrendous rudder at speed because it locks up at near its max speed according to the manual irl afaik.
For flankers
@MatrixRupture thats right right
Yes the manual says the rudder gets very stiff and by 550 knots or so it’s almost impossible to move.
It’s about the only plane I know of that has an irl limitation in game.
For example the MiG-21 would shake and vibrate violently at about .95 Mach below 15,000 feet. So they were effectively limited to below this irl “the Q limit”
In game it’ll blast straight past that.
Oh i meant on the flankers directly
Not currently but they should be
The flanker should also not recover from post stall maneuvers as easy as it does.
The manual goes over that as well. And the sink rates from doing it are very high.
Maybe against a hornet but anything else that has aim 120d like the f15 ge
Pl12a just dont do good
Pl12s were better pre patch snd theyre still better, meta hasnt shifted so much were now range triumphs maneuverability. If you can notch you will have a better time with pl12 by virtue of having to commit less, the main problem here is the ouny cm count which is not competitive at 14.7
Its not a matter of notching
Its a matter that my pl12 is unable to hit past 20 km and even within those it just runs out of energy
You can barely put early pressure on people at a br where everything has good enough missiles to reach you at range
Yes its better at close range than the aim 120 because its more maneuverable but everything else is quite bad
They do, at trade shows and trade shows only, but people don’t go to trade shows like zhuhai airshow just to grab catalogues and upload them to WT
Enough energy to reach you if youre flying straight, jf youre getting hit in the early game you have more things to worry about than your missiles, the meta isnt bvr, whilst the ranges were pushed further with the proliferation of aesa the average engagements still happen st 15/25kms, notching is marginally harder because of the aesa buffs they did, not hard enough that you should struggle if you could before the update, aim120ds are not the missile you should be working about theyre still the same crap you were fighting before just with a marginal maneuverability buff.
Low k makes all the difference, started taking all aim 120 c 5s and man, honestly I think they’re now the most meta missile in game. Insane range and because of the changes to aesa most people jsut explode.
Now I think best planes are->
30sm2
Aesa euro
Rafale
Grippy
F15c
30sm/mkm
18e
I dont agree really. Maneuverability is still crap, and whilst aesas are stronger it doesnt really change how you defend against them compared to before, i havent noticed any hits that i would have otherwise missed pre patch, ive tried using the new extended launch limits but the missile takes so long to pull that it stops burning by the time its on target,
any buff is better than none and aesa pushing ranges a but further is good for the aim120 as it is ingame, but its not enough for it to be a meta missile on anything that isnt ef2k aesa(which was true even before aim120d was a thing) thats more because of the insane flight perfomance of the ef2k paired with the radar rather than aim120d.
Too little too late, r-77-1 and Mica are still the best missiles bar none.
have you even played the j10 or any plane that use pl12
Because if not you dont know how poor the performance of that missile
The only good thing about it is it maneuverability and all the rest is either bad or ok
And the platform that can carry it aren’t even that great against what it faces at the br
Even with the j15t going at mach 1.5 at high altitude pl 12 barely reach mach 4
Its literally just a slightly better r77
Pl12a since it has no drift its always pin point on the the target and somewhat improves a little bit its energy retention but its marginal at best
I would rather play with aim 120D on the f15ge if i had one
I don’t want to dwell too much on the range of the PL-12 anymore. The PL12 is just an old Fox 3 missile with an 80 km range, the PL12A, apart from the seeker update, has no other changes… There’s simply no way to compare its range with the 120C or R771. The reason they achieve 120 km is due to improved thrust and reduced drag—it’s not just a result of extending the seeker’s battery life. And the MICA, with its unique seeker and 50G overload capability, is not easily evaded. Furthermore, the Rafale can launch it with exceptional energy. Clearly, neither the J-10 nor the J-15 at BR 14.3 and beyond possess these advantages—you lack an improved missile and an aircraft capable of launching older Fox-3 missiles with that kind of exaggerated velocity.
And your target isn’t a bot flying straight in a test range. Your real opponents, as long as they don’t make mistakes, can maneuver to evade most missiles. I don’t deny that the PL12 is quite excellent compared to other older Fox 3 missiles, but it is insufficient at BR 14.3. Within engagement distances of 2–30 km, the PL-12’s energy bleed is significantly worse than that of the 120C/D and 771. Your opponents can launch Fox 3 missiles at you much earlier, while the PL12 cannot. You can only leverage the PL12’s strengths in close engagements.
The fact that the PL-12 appears at BR 13.0, alongside missiles like the 120A and R77, indicates that Gaijin does not consider it an overpowered Fox-3. It is not like the R771, 120C/D, or MICA, which are reserved for jets at BR 14.0 and above.
Stop shooting at target 30 kilometers out, the meta hasnt shifted to such an insane degree that pl12 went from one of the best to one of the worst. Most fight still happen under 20 kilometers, pl12a is a bigger upgrade to pl12 than ain120d is to aim120c5 by virtue of having use for the expanded launch limits