Played a little bit of 12.7 bro 70% vs ru
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hahahaha, no.
Russia was stupid strong in top ground during the patches before the new AA(Iris and co) were added. You could spawn the Su-25SM3 and the Su-34 both with KH-38MT with reduced SP cost since they didn’t share a common SP cost increase by reason of being different category of planes. KH-38 slingers were straight up unkillable by any NATO AA and KH-38 was almost impossible to intercept with stuff like ADATS or Flakrad.
Winning pretty much required spawning a super costly dedicated ASF.
Gaijin later changed that but even then, KH-38 before the new AA was stupid broken, especially since they were on the same side as the Pantsir, the best AA in the game at the time.
And now Russia has a steady 70% winrate in top bracket ground sim for months due to how overperforming their air support is.(Thanks LMUR/KH-38 combo)
Last I checked JAGM as a missile is still significantly less effective and reliable than LMUR
with it having no aspects where it outperforms LMUR
and I know neither have been changed since then
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Man I stopped reading at “oplot is the best t80 with 6sec reload” while the bvm has exactly 6sec reload as well, particularly when I read “tiger helicopters are a lower br than the others” while they’re literally at 12.7 VS 13.0 for the others, which is literally the same because you fight 95% of the time the same vehicles, as it is at top top tier.
Another russian main speaking non sense just to not admit Russia is clearly advantaged in the game, I’m tired of this
For the record :
- nato mbts don’t have “over-lapping plates” because they have butter armor penable from anything from anywhere
- there are ammunition in the russian autoloaders which are supposed to explode when hit but simple don’t 90% of the time (yes, when I hit the autoloader with a 500mm dart, I expect it to pen the autoloader then the ammunition of the other side of it)
- won’t argue the pantsir thing, pantsir is op, pantsir 2 will be even more
- try fighting a 279 with a lower br tank, good look with that you wont pen from any side
- same with is-7 ; Pe-8 was op back in the days because it was the only plane with the big bomb capable of killing the entire team with 1 single bomb, as if it was a troll plane more than anything (as I stated, pls read me before making me say the same thing over and over again) ; “yak-9k is rarely used, hard to use, not op because needs to be used by skill players” ok ragebait
- “Soviet MBTs are inferior to Abrams and Leopard 2A5 at the least, partially due to global mobility being incorrect” => already explained t series had +/- the same mobility at top tier in mid fight and how, please read up there
- there are even more nato mbts without irst / proxy / atgms, look at the french
- “Fire rate in IFVs isn’t as useful as people argue.” ok ragebait, that’s literally why the bushmaster is garbage compared to russian counterpart (not the only reason, but the main reason). I mean look at how much time you need to destroy a light of russian mbt from the side with that crap autocannon, it’s like 4-5 seconds and you shoot everywhere (half the time, the eras eat the darts like 3-4 times for no reason at all). With russia autocannons, it’s simple : hold the click 0.5sec, the ennemy is dead (sometimes even from the front wtf).
- “All artillery can” => PLEASE you’re comparing 5sec reload artillery vehicles VS the bmd which can fire super quick with the he round AND the drone (not all arti vehicle has a drone). BMD is literraly better in every way. Try killing someone with the french arty vehicle, which doesn’t even have a drone and shoots extremely slow. Just look at loner videos to understand what I mean man.
- already said what I thought about tiger helicopters : 12.7 is way too high for them. 12.0 would be good. Worst scenario, 12.3.
- “Soviet high-caliber heavies are among the most difficult to use for players.” ok ragebait, guess having a very good pen heavy is bad in ur head
- already said what I thought about the oplot as well
Bottom line : Russia has all the advantages on purpose, and we all know why.
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6.4 while using 3BM60. What is told you numerous times.
Nope, just no room for any F&F helo on 12.0, and after those dropped to 12.7, used my german 12.7 lineup and it was 80% games 12.7
yeah sadly abrams is missing that, and it got best proxy shell for job.
Yeah, tell us how many USSR mbt’s have IR track and ProxyHe shell or timefuze?
And I can allready tell that it doesnt have good enough gunhandling to use it , unless facing slowmoving/hovering helo.
I can tell that merkavas won in that update when they got that ir track
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1 : Who cares about 0.4s. With the enormous servers ping, the latency from your monitor, gpu rendering the images, keyboard + mouse, your own body responding +/- faster, the time you need to spot an ennemy if this is a long range fight, your own ping depending on your Internet and localisation and sometimes even the latency of upscaling + framegen for the people using them, 0.4sec is absolutely nothing and unoticeable. 6.4sec = 6sec, period. It’s not like it was 6sec vs 8 sec. Beside, for other rounds, it’s still 6 sec.
2 : First, 12.7 top tier vehicles = +/- 13.0 top tier vehicles, they’re the same, no one cares.
Second, as a reminder for everyone :
Tiger helicopters, if BRed at 13.0 as a base, should go :
- -0.3 => 12.7 because their FnF missiles go 7/8km max range VS 16km for the AH/Mi/Z10 (Z10 even has 25km range atgms lol)
- -0.3 => 12.3 because they can only cary 8 FnF missiles max VS 8 or 16 for Mi/AH/Z10
- -0.3 => 12.0 ONLY for the EC-665 Tiger HAC and EC-665 Tiger UHT because they don’t have a 20/30mm main gun (hell, the EC-665 Tiger HAC isn’t even able to carry the 12.7mm of the UHT)
- Debatable, but +0.3 because Tigers are more mobile than AH/Mi/Z10, even if meh because they climb slower than them.
So overhaul, they should go to 12.0 or 12.3.
3 : Russia has numerous vehicles with IRST : MBT + light tanks + IFV. They also have HE shells, proxy and ATGMs shells. Numerous NATO MBTs have none of those HE shells / proxy / atgms (none has atgms if I recall). So Russia has them all throughout the BRs, and some NATO nations simply have none. Unfair, unbalanced (hello France).
Please, quit DE-FEN-DING Russia at all costs, because objectively, you will never find the good arguments to say NATO is better than Russia, because it is simply not. Stop trying to justify the unjustifiable
NATO is not flat out better than Russia, but Russia is also not flat out better than NATO.
Russian MBTs are still at best middle of the pack, meanwhile all of the best MBTs are NATO.
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No.
70% of your >= 60% winrate games are from the use of Leos/T-series, remember ?
Puting Leos/Strvs aside, NATO MBTs suck (NATO nations are not only Germany and Sweeden).
Abrams is easily better than the T-series, Merkava and Leclerc arguably as well, Type 10 as well.
The only Russian MBT that gives some competition is the BVM, the other T-series are just mid or mediocre.
EDIT: let me rephrase. The Abrams, Merkava, Type 10 and Leclerc are better in the hand of decent players, since said decent players can get more out of them than they can get out of the T-series.
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@SadRIPer I get your posts are to defend Russian equipment, but this is funny…
Leopard 2s, Type 90s, Abrams, etc all have overlapping plates. And that’s just the quickest off the top of my head.
Charges* are supposed to explode, which they do when loaded. However, at the top end there are players that only half load their tanks which leaves one half empty, and sometimes the server doesn’t show that in the shot replay.
I can lolpen the Object 279 using M60 [8.0], which I and thousands of others have done. 279 armor is ~250, where pen of the M60 is 400mm with its best round.
If you’re arguing Pantsir is OP, you’re arguing that F-111F is OP as well. They’re counters to each other’s teams.
A higher fire rate against something that bounces rounds is just a higher amount of bounces per minute.
If you think IS-2 is as easy to use as Tiger 2 and M26E5, I have a bridge to sell you.
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Yeah… There’s enough nations that lack vehicles or even whole classes.
Players are asking for new vehicles - Gaijin adds new Russian vehicles and some tanks for other nations which are either an already existing one just as premium or a vehicle that useless that it literally just gets added for Gaijin to say “We added something new”.
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On close quarters , it really makes a difference, especially when you are on shot trade situation.
Been there plenty of times , and having 5s on abrams has made a difference plenty of times.
It was allready enough when EC was 11.7 and was only helo having f&f , so no more that S**** again, 12.7 is fine, and lowest is 12.3.
Still didnt answer my question.
And please, like nato doesnt have MORE lights with proxys/spikes compared to soviets?
We were talking about MBT’s , not lights.
So let me remind you
And if you get killed in anything flying by barrelshot missile, is seriously skill issue or bad luck when having max 6km range and manouverability of…
Not defending, just calling out that BS you claim about USSR vehicles, while you rage mouth foaming like having rabies about that bias you see everywhere
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At this point in time I believe the main issue with Russia is the unmatched CAS options along with unmatched Anti Air options, next update they are just getting even worse. Goes a long way to say how much good CAS is influential in top tier.
I also think that aside from the obvious disadvantages T-series have, one of the advantages is that they are very player friendly, armor goes a long way to help someone clueless and it’s a lot easier to shoot an Abrams and cause internal damage than it is to shoot a T-series and avoid getting your shell nullified by a piece of ERA; this coupled with the amount of wallet warriors in top tier makes up for the perfect combination to cause a lot of the success Russia sees at higher BRs. But again I guess that is a bit more of a skill issue, my main complaint remains CAS and AD.
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Abrams can get frontally pened by the wind itself if it hits the enormours and visible turret ring.
This is Leclerc and Ariete front armor, as well as Abrams, Merkavas, Chally, Types and TKX. They all have the same patern : paper armor.
We already saw here the t-90m and bvm have +/- the same 0-30 time acceleration (the acceleration you need midfight) than NATO MBTs. Russian MBTs has less firepower than NATO MBTs, but doesnt mater because NATO MBTs have paper armor. Russian MBTs have way better armor than NATO MBTs (need to aim for the weakspots for russian mbts even if NATO have better firepower, not for nato mbts). Some russian MBTs have 6sec reload, equal to most NATO MBTs. Russian MBTs have usefull shells like HE/proxy/atgms some NATO MBTs don’t have.
So to sump up, Russia has :
- Better armor (hence the better NATO firepower doesn’t mater )
- Less firepower but doesn’t mater because NATO MBTs armors are paper
- +/- same mobility
- +/- same reload speed. Moreover, concerning the 7sec reload speed russian MBTs, I already stated :
With the enormous servers ping, the latency from your monitor, gpu rendering the images, keyboard + mouse, your own body responding +/- faster, the time you need to spot an ennemy if this is a long range fight, your own ping depending on your Internet and localisation and sometimes even the latency of upscaling + framegen for the people using them, 1sec is absolutely nothing and unoticeable.
So basically, 6sec reload = 7sec reload, more or less.
- More shell diversity
So we can all see russian MBTs are actually the best out there.
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Name 5 technologies [though at least one] that only exists on Soviet vehicles in-game.
All tech trees “lack vehicles”, that’s game development.
Gaijin adds new vehicles to all tech trees, yes. Welcome to War Thunder.
USSR went over 1 year without a tank equivalent to the top end tanks, pretty much exactly what happened with Japan even though Japan’s was a tad worse having to wait while stuck with Type 90.
And while T-90M is equivalent to Abrams SEP, in War Thunder T-80BVM is more useful due to the mobility meta that honestly is the biggest issue I have with ground RB.
MBTs universally over-performing makes Leclerc and Type 10 less attractive when in reality all tanks that aren’t Leclerc and Type 10 should be notably reduced in acceleration.
Type 90’s acceleration over-performs in-game by at least 20% based on comparisons with IRL videos posted by Nameless on YouTube, which makes Type 10 in-game seem slow despite its own acceleration being slightly faster in-game than IRL.
US MBT lineup is definitely better than USSR one at top tier as well.
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And it’s widely known that good players don’t rely on armor. The increased ROF, depression , reverse and overall mobility/handling that the Leclerc/Merkava/Abrams/Type 10 has just makes them much better to play as a good player.
Armor is good, but not good enough to compensate for bad firepower and mobility. Armor is best when combined with mobility and/or firepower.
However I can see why the T-90M looks good to you, a more average player that only has top tier in 1 nation.
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They do have over-lapping plates, but they don’t work. You pen NATO MBTs like butter. Either they’re not present, or they’re broken.
The spall should destroy the whole autoloader and hits everything inside of it, not simply 1 specific region of the autoloader lol. Beside, the russian autoloader has the right to be filled at 180 degrees let’s say, but the nato autoloader has to be filled equaly from left to right, what kind of bias is this lol.
Pantsir is op, Pantsir 2 is even more op, whatever cas you’ll take you’ll get boned.
The garbage bushmaster bounces everywhere as well as the russian autocannons.
IS-2 can turret shot everything including tigers and t34, the contrary is not that simply, because depending how weird the is-2 turret’s angle is, even tiger 2 shot can bounce (people know what I mean). It even happens with those weird medium t34 tanks.
Oh and when showing protection map, please try to use current state updates. Seems like there is some kinda remodelling done to armor after your screenshots have made
And on first pic , range has been set to 0… just noticed
And those were against leo A7.
It is little bit sadder looking from 3BM60 view.
I don’t know why people are still engaging with this.
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