What are you even talking about?
So what?
Nobody because the game would have less players than AW’s about a dozen players.
More realistic does not mean it is better.
Now if you mean that making them as realisitc as the current balancing rules dictate, then pretty much nothing would change, or NATO would be even stronger.
Jet fuel dosent melt steel, heat does
:Clueless:
The exact reaction I wanted
I suggest you go try it yourself maybe for seeing better picture
aren’t capable, aren’t you?
Maybe if everyone getting their realistic performance, we wouldn’t have to argue about this sht it going to be about who makes better sht wins
I don’t care who stronger than who i just wanna see funny sht.
You just said some nonsense, no evidence, proof, or even argument…
Just because i dont have that one it does not mean i cant talk about it.
I am sure that there is a high chance that you have talked about something in this thread that you dont have…
Do you actually think that deluded players that are in the russian bias cult would just stop and not call russian bias anymore?
Last december people went to the south pole and made an experiment that literally disproved flat earth, yet flers are still around, and the number of people that stopped believing it was just a handful.
probably higher chance than this if it happens everyone might have to accept who makes sht better than who then they win
for example,
T-64 beat M60 around 1970 that mean soviet made better tanks then they win
That is not how cults work.
How Russian bias or NATO bias work I don’t care
but it can reduce if not end this argument by doing what i just said
now everyone gets their real-life speciation if not the closest one
how are they going to complain? when no overperform or underperform everything is realistic speciation
who make stuff better then it performs better that should be end of the story.
you can easily end this debate by awnsering the following question:
Well I’ll have a crack. You seem a bit more thoughtful than Mr PROOOOVES NOTHING.
How long has it taken for them to FINALLY do the modules for the Kamovs, Su-25s, etc? A cynic might say that they’ve sold enough Ka-50s, Su-25Ks that nerfbatting them now doesn’t matter.
MiG-29 FM just stinks of Gaijin incompetence. No argument there. They can fix the Scimitar rudder while they’re at it.
However, are we going to forget that USSR was ruling the roost with the MiG-23s able to blyatt people out of the sky before the Fulcrums came along? I was trying to spade the British Phantoms - I remember…
Again, it took a LOOOONG time for the UFO flight model to be nerfed - in the last year or so - probably after Gaijin had sold all of the 23MLs they could ever wish to. Cynical mode off.
Now - as to the bias. Do I think that Gaijin Devs wake up each morning, twirl their moustaches in a menacing manner and swagger to work with an intent to do a dirty on all the other tech-trees? No. There is no financial sense to piddle off the non-Russian audience, who have a considerable spending power many times that of the RU market.
Do I believe that there is a leaning, a bias, a favouritism towards the Soviet stuff that the devs might have grown up with, have immediate access to via archives, museums and other sources right on their doorstep without language or geographic barriers? Yes.
Just look at the tech trees - the RU tech tree is massive, positively doted on. They have full lineups at virtually every BR, lots of toys that come to them before the other nations and yes, quite a few vehicles that are plainly powerful when released for seemingly a long old time before they are nerfed.
If I were doing a British version of WT - I’d probably have a subconscious bias towards the British stuff. Full disclosure - I like British planes particularly and I’d make damn sure I gave them a glowing virtual appearance.
Because it’s what I’ve grown up with, I speak the language, I can read all the documents and can go into 100s of museums within an hour’s drive of where I live. I see some of them fly right over my house weekly. I’d probably not be too fussed if the Russian Object 294834023 had a few inaccuracies - who cares? - not if I could spend that time working to squeeze another Spitfire into the tech tree. I’d get around to fixing that French thingy some other time, because it’s not my passion so it can wait.
So, combined with the factors I’ve listed above. I DO believe there to be a bias (conscious or otherwise) in War Thunder - particularly among the Russian Devs and Russian members of the tech reporting team. Like a car with dodgy tracking - it always seems to wander to one side of the road…
So we just going to ignore F-4J and F-14A ?
Interesting how long will take to finally nerf F-16 flight model.
And liar is ingoring other nerfs.
So thats why it’s needed to bang door for 2 damn years to fix Su-27 flight model it’s incredible favoritism. And who knows how long it will take to fix MiG-29 and R-73
you ever heard a word “don’t make it too ugly?” if they are absurdly too strong to be obvious it can have more backlash
strong enough to make them money (within realistic reason) but not too strong to make them money
same things happen to Apache, but KA-52 have better weapons than Apache even they add modules to both apache still worse than KA-52
What? no planes having modules (at least yet)
what? I have both German mig-29 i didn’t feel struggles or anything when it first came out last time i fly MiG-29 probably around a patch before Fox3 can’t remember and i still don’t feel struggle what you are talking about? if that was nerf you talking about then Gripen also got nerf multiple times than MiG 29
Strong enough to make them money but not too strong to make them lost income
at the end of day Russia is a bank for them Russia is the most played nation in the game, so they had to take care their bank but not too much for making them lost money
now look back a little
why they need Pantsir that being best SPAA for two years while Italy still stuck with Otomatic and Japan and Israel don’t even have SAM and 2S6 was enough for them (on far with ADATS same range before nerf) and what they do to 2S6 they nerfed the sht out of 2S6 make it justified for Pantsir and become the only SPAA that capable of intercept air munition for two years while no SPAA can’t do the same combo with ugly KH-38 (only to got beat by IRIS-T recently)
KH-38
after the Leopard 2A7V (yep tank that still have unfinish armor until now) beat the sht out of them because they don’t get used of aiming weak spot on horde of uparmored Leopard 2 made their win rate bad enough and what turn ties after that?
yeah KH-38 AGM that no one can intercept except pantsir (which ofc on Russia side) then follow by SU-34 and SU-30 to the point that the only way that can stop them is to spawn jet fast as possible and air spawn camping them even that you have less than 10 sec after they spawn to kill them before they kill your team tell me that normal? i been playing this game since before this game even have tanks have seen BS this game has to offer a lot, but nothing compared to KH-38 incident game that only chance you winning against them is air spawn camping them on GRB??
here look at this
so they wanted money and not a strong russia
so no russian bias there
and the US was able to terrorize everything with the F-14 for a while, so there is US bias?
so again money and not them wanting to keep russia strong
russia is a major tree just like the US and germany and all of those have lots of vehicles at every br
there are quite a few other examples, for example the continuing rafale buffs, even tho it is already without argument the best plane in the game
a few months ago it got falsely buffed through a bug report and it took multiple months until it was nerfed
and again it was buffed on the recent dev server, yet here nobody is claiming french bias
most stuff i have seen are the result of gross incompetence or neglicence
i dont belive that the devs themslefes are biased, but it was shown before that certain tech mods might be, but that is malice from a few individuals and not from gaijin as a whole
gaijin over the years has implemented multiple game mechaics that mostly affect russian vehicles and nerf them like the helicopter modules which were added after ppl complained about the Ka-52 damage model, which they wouldnt have if they want to keep russia strong
another example for russian bias that people bring up is the Kh-38MT, which was more than likely added so that russia has an IR guided AGM as well, which the US had before them (yet no US bias)
big missile has long range and a big warhead what a suprise but the other option they could have added instead that is certanly 100% real and has even more range would be the Kh-59 with ranges over 80km iirc
but they didnt for obvious reasons
also the US still is uncontested in the mid BRs regarding guided A2G weaponry
and in the coming update the AH-64E will get 16 JAGM MRs which will be without a doubt be the best FnF missile on a heli and it is also one of 2 helis in the game that are able to carry that many FnF missiles
i could go on like this for a while, which i wont, i hope you get the point
there were certainly biases observed with them before, but if you think your report got unfairly closed you can ask a technical moderator, like gunjob, to reopen it or to forward it
Well come on - have there been historic biases within Gaijin or not? Would these not have a bearing on how players view them company even if they are ‘only certain people within the company.’
I use your own words.
“i dont belive that the devs themslefes are biased, but it was shown before that certain tech mods might be, but that is malice from a few individuals and not from gaijin as a whole”
and
“there were certainly biases observed with them before, but if you think your report got unfairly closed you can ask a technical moderator, like gunjob, to reopen it or to forward it”
Now, we can agree to disagree as to how much of a bias there is/was/will be.
However, are we not at least in agreement that Gaijin have fuelled the impressions of myself and others by their inconsistency in the treatment of certain trees over others, certain issues over others, etc?
so there is a bias towards money and not russia
thats why i used the future tense
cough cough XP-50 XP-55
still inadequate to deal with the CAS at the time, not saying that other nations shouldnt have gotten better AAs sooner, but the Pantsir certainly wasnt enough to deal with CAS
so they nerfed the 2S6, so that ppl have to grind the Pantsir, which makes it more likely for them to buy premium and/ or accelerated research
so please give me another russian weapon sytem they could have gotten instead, that is IR and FnF
41 death on blue team and 47 deaths on red team you didn’t got dominated you simply got outlasted.
At 11.7-12.0 they are also still pretty solid (not the best but still pretty easy to do well in) and the BUK is probably the shared best AA when the update releases.
But yeah there are more bad BRs than good BRs for Russia high-top tier.
Trial’d vehicles?
HSTVL, every Object, Vickers Mk7, Type 87 RCV P, RAH-66, STB-2, WZ1001… I can go on.
@Crazed_Otter
Is the double standard in the room with us? Cause no one can see it.
1- Which had nothing to do with Russia or Soviets.
2- A-10 and Su-25 being extremely durable disproves Russian bias.
3- Wow, APCBC/APHE gives slope modifiers for USA, Germany, Soviets, China, Japan, Italy… Disproves Russian bias.
4- Merkava Mk4 LIC had this issue as well. Not Russian bias.
5- Japan, China, France also use autoloaders.
6- Soyuz has average armor for the BR, and its guns share performance with Iowa, Yamato, and Roma. No Russian bias.
7- HSTVL, RDF-LT, etc. Thanks for disproving Russian bias.
8- Pantsir itself disproves Russian bias.
9- Russian manufacturers have never been taken as gospel. Hammer and Kh-38MT both use incorrect seekers because LOAL is not in War Thunder, especially programmed target LOAL that Hammer and Kh-38MT’s seekers use IRL.
10- Relikt protects 54mm against kinetic rounds when “flat”. That’s obviously not over performing.
K1 has never absorbed kinetic rounds in the history of War Thunder, it’s the 2nd worst ERA in the game only behind Blazier.
The pattern is Gaijin trusts NATO sources over Russian sources on average, and Mig-29 is the worst modeled plane in War Thunder 2nd to none. Gripen, Typhoon, and Rafale came in over-performing. The last time a Soviet aircraft came in over-performing it was Mig-23MLD, and that was fixed when they went back to fix older flight models. It also wasn’t over-performing as much as Mig-21SMT and Mig-23M/ML/MLA.
Mig-29.
Su-27.
2S38’s fictional first stage when all sources stated there was no first stage [HSTVL-like misunderstanding].
Su-30SM.
Pantsir came into the game with a 13km effective range and was only fixed in late 2024 to 16km making even Tornadoes survivable in ground battles when Pantsirs were up until then.
3BM25 is at a BR 0.7 higher than NATO equivalents.
Yak-28B still fuel starves too easily when pitching down.
R-73’s spinning.
R-77’s drag during turns.
I might not get angry about bugs that don’t directly impact my ability to play the vehicle, but even I will admit when vehicles are incorrect when they are.
If T-90M’s turret protection is incorrectly too low, I’ll admit that too.
I might criticize Soviet and Russian equipment in War Thunder, but my desire for more correct information is above any biases I have against equipment.
And Hull break was removed in part due to Soviet players using HE, K1 correctly nerfed, Vikhirs correctly nerfed [Vikhrs and Starstreaks were the weapons of PVP helis, and both were over-performing due to old SACLOS missile physics].
Mig-23s and Mig-21s correctly nerfed.
Instead of focusing in on only select information, seek all information.
Oh, and Mig-29 is the worst treated aircraft in the existence of War Thunder.
Even F-104 is treated better, especially since F-104s came into War Thunder vastly over-performing.
the biggest incedent showing bias was probably gaijins chinese coouncelor whose job it was to find documents for chinese vehicles
from the stories i heard, he purposfully witheld documents that would buff chinese vehicles and blocked some bug reports
there are also some rumors floating around to why alot of the rafale reports get accepted so fast,
some of them not even containing proper sources
