"renewed" United Korean Ground Force Tech Tree(2024/March/08) - Revising irregularly

[Noveos_Republic]

Originally, I did not particularly care if SK was added as a subtree to Japan, and I say this as someone who is Korean. However, the OP @보지사냥꾼 makes a very good point in stating that any subtree would kneecap the further development of Korean vehicles in this game, and would otherwise dilute the Japanese tree. If you look at my activity history, I play Japan vehicles the most. I’m only interested in seeing Japanese vehicles/prototypes fill the gaps in the tree, not in Gaijin putting in any half measures to be lazy. I’m rather sick of copypastes being used to fill gaps, even if they come under the guise of a subtree addition.

While I am sure others have done so already to an extent, I’d like to more substantially refute the claims made by some like @ChieftainWarrior , in a more civil manner. Claims that he is racist are rather ridiculous

1. NK and SK only have geographical relations
   Obviously the OC admits that they have historical relations. However these relations go on for thousands of years; NK and SK are both descendants of a single nation that existed on the penninsula for several centuries: Joseon. Just because attempts at reunification have not materialized thus far, this should not negate the historical connections. NK and SK have infinitely more in common with each other than any neighboring countries. I don’t know why the fact that the countries not have reunified yet should be seen as countering their cultural relations. No one here is saying that East and West Germans are a completely different peoples after being split for several decades.
2. He also goes on to list UK-South Africa, Sweden-Finland, and Italy-Hungary. He insists that there is a formula where subtrees “are given to nations with at least 1 of these traits”. I fail to see how NK and SK fail to satisfy the close, geographical and historical relations metric he uses for Sweden-Finland and UK-South Africa. I would argue that the relations of NK and SK are exponentially stronger than those two relations, let alone Italy-Hungary. For example, the Swedish language is an Indo-European language whereas Finnish is Uralic.
3. Just because nations are not allies does not mean they should be precluded from a tree. This is a facetious argument. Why are Czech vehicles in the Italy tree, even thogh Italy was a member of the Axis which supported the invasion of Czechoslovakia? That argument makes no sense.
4. There is already precedent. The Chinese tree exists as the sum of two constituents: PRC and ROC. Whether he likes it or not, this tree is already is the game, so it should not be surprising if there is a United Korea tree. And, PRC and ROC succeed in the formula he set forth; they share both historical and geographical ties.
5. The US and USSR do not need any subtrees. This should not be up for debate. These are nations that have( or had) immense military-industrial complexes. The different variants and protoypes made by each nation means thousands of possibilities for each.

My problem is that OC claims to be a purist and is following a formula for which nation gets which subtree, yet refuses to follow that formula when it checks out for NK and SK

[ChieftainWarrior]

Thank you @Noveos_Republic for responding in a bit more of a civil manner.

I still think you’re wrong though, and you might have misinterpreted what I was saying.

@Noveos_Republic

NK and SK only have geographical relations
Obviously the OC admits that they have historical relations

Yes, my full quote was “NK and SK only have geographical relations, as well as (obviously) historical, but we all know both of them are not pushing significantly for reunification (actively threatening to go to war with each other) and neither have any shared technology.”

I was referring mostly to the modern day. North and South Korea once being united doesn’t mean much in game-terms, as they weren’t united at the time the tank was even invented.

I am not negating the fact that they have a long, deep history. Of course they do. But it is irrelevant in terms of technology in game.

@Noveos_Republic

No one here is saying that East and West Germans are a completely different peoples after being split for several decades.

No, and I am not saying North Koreans and South Koreans are a completely different peoples either. I just don’t think they fit well together for a tank (or plane) tech tree.

@Noveos_Republic

He insists that there is a formula where subtrees “are given to nations with at least 1 of these traits”

I don’t know if Gaijin has a formula but it’s how I perceive it. It seems to be the most logical set of 3 traits, at least to me.

@Noveos_Republic

I fail to see how NK and SK fail to satisfy the close, geographical and historical relations metric he uses for Sweden-Finland and UK-South Africa. I would argue that the relations of NK and SK are exponentially stronger than those two relations, let alone Italy-Hungary. For example, the Swedish language is an Indo-European language whereas Finnish is Uralic.

Ah, but you’re conflating cultural similarities with technological ones. Yes, South and North Korea are culturally a lot more similar than, say, white British people and black South Africans. But, again, this is irrelevant for the game.

Sweden and Finland have had military cooperation and co-developments, and are part of the same geographical and political area, and are close allies. This makes sense.

Britain ruled over South Africa, but, in the late 70s-90s from which South African vehicles in game are from, Britain and South Africa cooperated in their development. For example, South Africa’s Olifants are from exported Centurions, and the Rooikat prototypes used the 17 pounder. Etc etc.

North and South Korea have not cooperated on anything militarily. They have no joint technology, nothing. Their vehicles are radically different from each other. They have genuinely zero similarities. This is my main point of contention.

I also only said this: “ either a) close technological relations or b) close international/geographical relations.”
I specified international (by which I also mean political)/geographical relations, a mix of both. They also don’t have this, as they’re de jure still at war.

@Noveos_Republic

Just because nations are not allies does not mean they should be precluded from a tree. This is a facetious argument. Why are Czech vehicles in the Italy tree, even thogh Italy was a member of the Axis which supported the invasion of Czechoslovakia? That argument makes no sense.

Which Czech vehicles? The М53/59 is in the Soviet tree, the S-199 is in Israel, the Moderna is in the Soviet tree (granted it’s Slovakian, but they were united during the period you’re talking about), etc. I could be missing something but I was under the impression there aren’t any Czech vehicles in the Italian tree?

@Noveos_Republic

There is already precedent. The Chinese tree exists as the sum of two constituents: PRC and ROC. Whether he likes it or not, this tree is already is the game, so it should not be surprising if there is a United Korea tree. And, PRC and ROC succeed in the formula he set forth; they share both historical and geographical ties.

Yes. I agree. I don’t like this but it is how it is. I can’t argue with that.
They do share historical ties, and geographical, but they’re quite similar to Korea in that regard. They’re hostile to one another and don’t share technology. Like I said, if trees were expanded (to have more than 5 lines), I would prefer if someone like the US got Taiwan. But that likely won’t happen for a while (and ideally also requires lots of minor trees to also be expanded so it’s not so unfair).

@Noveos_Republic

The US and USSR do not need any subtrees. This should not be up for debate. These are nations that have( or had) immense military-industrial complexes. The different variants and protoypes made by each nation means thousands of possibilities for each.

To some extent yes but see my above answer. I’d like massive trees but that’s unlikely. Perhaps a new mechanic could be added for sub-trees outside of main trees, but that require main tree progression (i.e. to research Taiwanese vehicles in their own separate UI section, you need US rank IV or something). But that’s not part of this discussion really.

@Noveos_Republic

My problem is that OC claims to be a purist and is following a formula for which nation gets which subtree, yet refuses to follow that formula when it checks out for NK and SK

To my knowledge, I am following my formula pretty well.

[GildyMenn21]

I know you created the suggestion, however yes the suggestion went downhill as many players as you mentioned where against it (still remember the voting) but didn’t know you requested that.

[KrypTanko]

i’m all for adding a south korean tree if you can get enough vehicles to actually make it a full tree (by the looks of it you have).

However it is done, as a standalone tree or a sub tree of japan, I don’t care, it’s a video game.

I just want the vehicles added with a large enough pool of supporting vehicles to make playing them worth a damn. i don’t want Israel 2.0 with nothing but MBT’s and no support vehicles.

[UnknownVariable]

I agree with your assessment. Korea being a subtree of other nations will only limit what Korean vehicles will be added to WT. There is still a bunch of Japanese vehicles that WT refuses to add to Japan that may just be prototypes but we just all collectively somehow ignore the completely fictional Ho-Ri Series.

[Alan_Tovarishch]

We came up with very similar proposals. Hope Gaijin does something similar as well.

[UnknownVariable]

Now hear me out…

TURKEY
as a subtree for the United Korea Tech Tree
Kore–Türk kardeşliği

South Korean military attache in Ankara, shakes hands with two Turkish Korean War veterans

How and Why?

When the Korean War started, Turkey sent the 15,000 strong Turkish Brigade to South Korea with a cable to the UN: “Turkey is ready to meet his responsibilities.” Under the joint UN Command, it fought valiantly most infamously in the Battle of Wawon on November 28, 1950 when the Turkish Brigade who neither understood or spoke English or Korean, and combined with false intelligence - were made to do a long march to the Korean countryside where they met with a retreating column of ROK troops and fired upon them. This tragic mistake was soon rectified however as they met with the advancing North Korean and Chinese forces that were chasing the ROK troops and repelled the attack at the cost of around 400 Turkish casualties and an estimate of 3000 casualties on the Communists’ side. The Turks withdrew but were soon encircled but with a timely air strike, the battered Turkish Brigade was able to come back to Allied lines. Controversy surrounded the Turkish Brigade’s competency during the war but as one historian puts it - Turkish Brigade was the only UN force present between Wawon and Kunu-ri, the Chinese inability to capture Kunu-ri before the US 2nd Infantry Division made their retreat (which the Turks were not informed) meant that they had successfully covered the withdrawal of Allied troops.

Post-war, the sacrifices of the Turkish Brigade was not forgotten and the sentiment of both Koreans and Turks regard each other as blood brothers. The participation of Turkish Troops also made the door open for Turkey to join NATO. With it’s entry to NATO, South Korean defense industry firms have been in close cooperation with the Turkish defense industry with the purchase of KAI KT-1 Woongbi Trainer Aircraft and K9 Thunder Artillery Systems. This has directly or indirectly led to the development of the TAI Hürkuş (which looks a lot like the KT-1 Woongbi) and the T-155 Firtina (Based on the K9 Thunder). Joint ventures were also undertaken with the Altay MBT (based on the K2 Black Panther). Korea also planned to co-develop the TAI TF Kaan, which is slated to be Turkey’s replacement for its entire F-16 fleet but this was rejected as the then-Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu announced that the TF-X program will be a completely independent domestic platform, not in partnership with Korea. In 2013, MIKTA was formed where both Turkey and South Korea have made their ties closer together with the other Middle Power Economies.

In-Game

Turkey sits in a weird spot where they operate NATO and Western Military Vehicles but are politically getting closer to Russia and its sphere. This makes Turkey quite the hermit in its region as it cannot join other countries to form a comprehensive tech tree with. However in a United Korea Tech Tree, it might just find its home and make the United Korea Tech Tree a lot more appealing than just another C&P tree. This would however require a 6th Branch in the TT or it could just be interspersed within the TT but anyways these are the vehicles:

Vehicles
Light Vehicles:

ACV-15 Dragar

Spoiler

FNSS developed the ACV-15 based on the AIFV to meet the Turkish Land Forces Command’s (TLFC’s) operational requirement. The first production vehicles were delivered in 1992. The basic AIFV has a one-person power-operated turret armed with a 25mm cannon and 7.62mm co-axial machine gun. FNSS Defense Systems’ latest development is the Armored Combat Vehicle – New Generation which has an additional roadwheel each side. This can undertake a wider range of battlefield missions as it has greater internal volume and load-carrying capability.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: GIAT/Nexter M811 25mm Dual-Feed Auto-Cannon
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V-53T Diesel Engine, 300 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Allison X200-4 Fully Automatic Transmission, 4 Forward, 1 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 20.6 hp/t
• Protection
  • Hull Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV
  • Turret Armor: STANAG 4569 Level II or III
  • Smoke Grenades: 6x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Rangefinder
  • Dual-Axis Stabilization
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)

Otokar Tulpar

Spoiler

There are 2 main variants of the Otokar Tulpar, a 30mm autocanon IFV and a 105mm canon equipped light tank variant.

Tulpar - 30

Tulpar is a Turkish heavy infantry fighting vehicle designed by the Sakarya-based automotive manufacturer Otokar. Tulpar was designed for the dual role of providing fire support to friendly main battle tank and safely transporting troops in a high-threat environment. Resistance against IEDs, small mines and high ballistic protection for its crew were among the high priority design criteria. Tulpar is also fully networkable with the Altay MBT and other units.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: Mk44 Bushmaster II 30mm Dual-Feed Auto-Cannon
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Scania DSI V8 Turbocharged Diesel Engine, 810 Horsepower
  • Transmission: SAPA SG-850 Fully Automatic Transmission, 32-Speed
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 70 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 24.1 or 25.3 hp/t
• Protection
  • Hull Armor: STANAG 4569 Level II Up To Level IV
  • Turret Armor: Unspecified
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
• Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Dual-Axis Stabilization
  • Automatic Target Tracking System
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)

Tulpar - 105

Otokar’s Tulpar Light Tank with Cockerill 3105 turret system armed with autoloader 105mm cannon. Currently not in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: Cockerill CV HP 105mm L/51 High Pressure Rifled Cannon
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 7.62mm Or 12.7mm Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Unspecified 16L V8 Turbo Charged Diesel Engine, 720 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Unspecified Fully Automatic Transmission, 6 Forward, 4 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 70 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Maximum 22.5 hp/t, Minimum 17.1 hp/t
• Protection
  • Hull Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV Up To Level V
  • Turret Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV Up To Level V
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • CITV
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)

Kaplan MT

Spoiler

Kaplan MT or Harimau is a light tank jointly developed by Turkish manufacturer FNSS and Indonesian manufacturer Pindad. The development program name for the tank is Modern Medium Weight Tank . The tank itself is called Kaplan MT by Turkey and Harimau by Indonesia, both meaning “tiger”.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: Cockerill CV HP 105mm L/51 High Pressure Rifled Cannon
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 7.62mm Or 12.7mm Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Caterpillar C13 Diesel Engine, 711 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Allison X300 Fully Automatic Transmission, 4 Forward, 2 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 70 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 22.2 hp/t
• Protection
  • Hull Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV Up To Level V
  • Turret Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV Up To Level V
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: PULAT
• Accessories
  • CITV
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)

Main Battle Tanks:

M60T

Spoiler

Extensive modernisation of Turkish M60A1 with the cooperation of IMI and 2nd Main Maintenance Center Command. M60A1 received IMI MG253 120mm L/44 cannon, a new armor package and more powerful engine. Currently in service, upgraded to M60TM standard.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: IMI MG253 120mm L/55 Smoothbore Cannon
  • Secondary:
    • Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine-Gun
    • M19 Cupola Mounted 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: MTU MT 881 KA-501 Diesel Engine, 1000 Horsepower
  • Transmission: RENK 304S, 4 Forward, 4 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 55 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 16.7 hp/t
• Protection
  • Armor: IMI Hybrid Armor Package
    • Reactive Armor
    • Passive Armor
    • Slat Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder

M60TM

Spoiler

M60TM Main Battle Tank is further modernization of M60T with the experiences gained from Operation Euphrates Shield (Fırat Kalkanı Harekatı). Under the modernisation, M60T’s received numerous ASELSAN made sub-systems including; LWR, Close Range Surveillance System, SARP Remote Controlled Weapon Station and TEPES Telescopic Periscope System. Some units received PULAT APS while some not, both versions are in service and used in operations.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: IMI MG253 120mm L/55 Smoothbore Cannon
  • Secondary:
    • Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine-Gun
    • SARP Remotely Controlled Weapon Station Mounted M2HB 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: MTU MT 881 KA-501 Diesel Engine, 1000 Horsepower
  • Transmission: RENK 304S, 4 Forward, 4 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 55 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 16.7 hp/t (Likely Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: IMI Hybrid Armor Package
    • Reactive Armor
    • Passive Armor
    • Slat Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Automatic Target Tracking
  • See-Before-Seen Capability
  • Telescopic Periscope System
  • 360° Close Range Surveillance System

M60TM (PULAT)

Spoiler

M60TM Main Battle Tank is further modernization of M60T with the experiences gained from Operation Euphrates Shield (Fırat Kalkanı Harekatı). Under the modernisation, M60T’s received numerous ASELSAN made sub-systems including; LWR, Close Range Surveillance System, SARP Remote Controlled Weapon Station and TEPES Telescopic Periscope System. Some units received PULAT APS while some not, both versions are in service and used in operations.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: IMI MG253 120mm L/55 Smoothbore Cannon
  • Secondary:
    • Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine-Gun
    • SARP Remotely Controlled Weapon Station Mounted M2HB 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: MTU MT 881 KA-501 Diesel Engine, 1000 Horsepower
  • Transmission: RENK 304S, 4 Forward, 4 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 55 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 16.7 hp/t (Likely Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: IMI Hybrid Armor Package
    • Reactive Armor
    • Passive Armor
    • Slat Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: PULAT
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Automatic Target Tracking
  • See-Before-Seen Capability
  • Telescopic Periscope System
  • 360° Close Range Surveillance System

Altay T1

Spoiler

First serial production model of Altay Main Battle Tank. Two units of T1 delivered to Turkish Armed Forces and being subjected to test. It is estimated two T1 will be extensively tested 2 years before further orders.

Brief Specification

• Armament
• Main: MKE 120mm L/55 Smoothbore Cannon
• Secondary:
  • Co-Axial PMT-76T 7.62mm Machine Gun
  • SARP Remotely Controlled Weapon Station Mounted M2 QCB 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Hyundai Doosan Infracore DV27K Diesel Engine, 1500 Horsepower
  • Transmission: SNT Dynamics EST15K; 9-Speed, 6 Forward, 3 Reverse
  • Suspension: Non-Active In-Arm
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 27 hp/t (Likely Less)
• Protection
  • Armor:
    • ROKETSAN Boron Carbide Armor Based on KSAP
    • ROKETSAN’s Explosive Reactive Armor
    • Slat Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 16x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: AKKOR
• Accessories
  • CITV
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Rangefinder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Mobile Camouflage System
  • 360° Close Range Surveillance System
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)
  • Ability to Fire Gun-Launched Anti-Tank Guided Missile

Altay AHT (Asimetrik Harp Tankı)

Spoiler

Altay AHT is the Urb-Op version of Altay and one of the last prototypes ever developed by Otokar. It received additional armor, smoke launchers, passive protection system and a dozer blade. Although it lacks AKKOR APS it said to have passive protection system and it also appears to be even more heavily armored than BMC’s T1s.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: MKE 120mm L/55 Smoothbore Cannon
  • Secondary:
    • Co-Axial FN MAG 7.62mm Machine Gun
    • KESKIN Remotely Controlled Weapon Station Mounted M2HB 12.7mm Machine Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: MTU MT883 KA-501 Diesel Engine, 1500 Horsepower
  • Transmission: RENK HSWL 295TM, 10-Speed, 5 Forward, 3 Reverse
  • Suspension: In-Arm
  • Top Speed: 70 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 27 hp/t (Likely Less)
• Protection
  • Armor:
  • ROKETSAN Boron Carbide Armor Based on KSAP
  • Hybrid Armor Package
    • Reactive Armor
    • Passive Armor
    • Slat Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 24x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: Multispectral Smoke System
• Accessories
  • CITV
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Rangefinder
  • Laser Warning Receiver
  • Signal Jamming System
  • See-Before-Seen Capability
  • Telescopic Periscope System
  • 360° Close Range Surveillance System
  • Hunter-Killer Capacity (Commander’s Override)

Anti-Air Vehicles:

Aselsan KORKUT

Spoiler

KORKUT is a Turkish self-propelled anti-air gun with twin-35mm auto cannon. KORKUT is combination of FNSS’ ACV-AD platform and ASELSAN’s turret system. It has ability to fire 35mm ATOM Airburst Rounds. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: Oerlikon/MKE KDC-02 35mm Linkless Feed Twin Auto-Cannon
  • Secondary: None
• Mobility
  • Engine: Unspecified Diesel Engine, 600 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Unspecified Fully Automatic Transmission
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 20.3 hp/t
• Protection
  • Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • 3D Radar
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Automatic Target Tracking with AKR Radar and Electro-Optical Integrated Tracking Platform

ZIPKIN PMSS

Spoiler

ZIPKIN is Defender 130 with ASELSAN ZIPKIN Pedestal Mounted Stinger System. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: FIM-92 Stinger MANPADS
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 12.7mm Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Land Rover TD5 Turbocharged Diesel Engine, 122 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Unspecified Manuel Transmission, 5-Speed
  • Suspension: Coil Spring
  • Top Speed: 129 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 34.8 hp/t (Likely a Little Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: None ˀ
  • Smoke Grenades: None
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Dual-Axis Stabilization
  • Passive Target Searching
  • Automatic Target Tracking
  • Automatic Target Acquisition
  • Optional Fire On-the-Move Capability with Additional Stabilization Systems

ATILGAN PMSS

Spoiler

ATILGAN is an M113A2 with ASELSAN ATILGAN Pedestal Mounted Stinger System. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: FIM-92 Stinger MANPADS
  • Secondary: Co-Axial 12.7mm Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V-53T Diesel Engine, 275 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Allison TX100-1 Fully Automatic Transmission, 3 Forward, 1 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 67.7 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 20.2 hp/t (Likely a Little Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV
  • Smoke Grenades: 8x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • Dual-Axis Stabilization
  • Passive Target Searching
  • Automatic Target Tracking
  • Fire On-the-Move Capability
  • Automatic Target Acquisition

BURÇ Mobile Air Defense System

Spoiler

Designed with Roketsan’s expertise, Burç is specifically tailored to protect mobile and fixed units, as well as strategic installations on battlefields and rear areas. Its main armament consists of eight Sungur anti-aircraft defense missiles housed in two quadruple pods, complemented by a 20mm caliber three-barrel cannon as an auxiliary weapon.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: 20mm Three-Barrel Rotary Cannon
  • Secondary:
    • None
  • Missiles:
    • FIM-92E Stinger Man-Portable Air-Defense System ˀ
    • SUNGUR Short-Range Air Defence Missile System
• Mobility
  • Engine: Unspecified Diesel Engine, ? Horsepower
  • Transmission: Unspecified Fully Automatic Transmission, 6 Forward, 1 Reverse
  • Suspension: Double Wishbone Fully Independent Hydropneumatic
  • Top Speed: 100 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 20 hp/t (Likely A Little Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: Classified Modular Armor
  • Smoke Grenades: 10x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight ˀ
  • Thermal Sight ˀ
  • Laser Rangefinder ˀ
  • Dual-Axis Stabilization ˀ
  • Automatic Target Tracking ˀ
  • Automatic Target Detection ˀ
  • 4 Retinar Active Phased Array (AESA) multi-Mission Radar With 360° Coverage

SPG & Anti-Tank Vehicles:

T-155 Firtna

Spoiler

T-155 Fırtına is localised version of Korean K-9 Thunder self-propelled gun. Currently in service

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: MKE 155mm L/52 Cannon
  • Secondary: Roof Mounted M2HB 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: MTU MT881 Ka-500 Diesel Engine, 1000 Horsepower
  • Transmission: SNT Dynamics X1100-5A3, 4 Forward, 2 Reverse
  • Suspension: Hydropneumatic
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: 17.8 hp/t
• Protection
  • Armor: STANAG Level IV
  • Smoke Grenades: None
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight

T-155 Firtna II

Spoiler

T-155 Fırtına II is modernised version of Fırtına I. It received fully electrical turret system, new fire control system and ASELSAN made RCWS. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: MKE 155mm L/52 Cannon
  • Secondary: SARP Remotely Controlled Weapon Station Mounted M2HB 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: AVDS-1790-9A Diesel Engine, 1200 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Allison X1100™-5A4
  • Suspension: Hydropneumatic
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 21.4 hp/t
• Protection
  • Armor: STANAG Level IV
  • Smoke Grenades: None
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Rangefinder
  • Automatic Target Tracking

ACV-19 LGM-V

Spoiler

FNSS ACV-19 with ROKETSAN Dual-Cirit Pod armed with 8 CİRİT missiles. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: ROKETSAN CİRİT 70mm Laser-Guided Missile, Dual Pod
  • Secondary: None
• Mobility
  • Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V-53T Diesel Engine, 350 Horsepower
  • Transmission: Allison X200-4 Fully Automatic Transmission, 4 Forward, 1 Reverse
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 19.4 hp/t (Likely a Little Less)
• Protection
  • Armor: STANAG 4569 Level IV
  • Smoke Grenades: 6x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • See-Before-Seen Capability
  • Telescopic Periscope System

Kaplan 10 (TMLS)

Spoiler

FNSS’ Kaplan-10 platform with ROKETSAN TMLS (Tactical Missile Launching System). TMLS, unlike ARCT, is a modular system and offers different armament options and combinations. TMLS has ability to carry and fire Cirit, OMTAS, UMTAS and L-UMTAS missiles in different configuration. System could be configured to carry 8x Cirit Missile, 4x Cirit & 2x OMTAS/L-UMTAS/UMTAS or 4 OMTAS/L-UMTAS/UMTAS. This vehicle also has same problem with ARCT platforms, fire-and-forget missiles. Solution is similar to above, Gaijin simply could lock fire-and-forget missile and allow system to be configured with only Cirit and L-UMTAS missiles. Currently in service.

Brief Specification

• Armament
  • Main: ROKETSAN TMLS, In Different Configurations; CİRİT 70mm Laser-Guided Missile, OMTAS Medium Range ATGM, L-UMTAS Laser Guided Long Range ATGM, UMTAS Long Range ATGM
  • Secondary:
    • Co-Axial 7.62mm Machine-Gun
    • Roof Mounted 12.7mm Heavy Machine-Gun
• Mobility
  • Engine: Unspecified Diesel Engine, ? Horsepower
  • Transmission: Fully Automatic Gearbox
  • Suspension: Torsion Bar
  • Top Speed: 65 km/h
  • Horsepower-Per-Ton: Around 21 hp/t
• Protection
  • Armor: Classified
  • Smoke Grenades: 16x
  • Active/Passive Protection System: None
• Accessories
  • Night Sight
  • Thermal Sight
  • Laser Range Finder
  • See-Before-Seen Capability
  • Telescopic Periscope System
  • Fire On-the-Move Capability

Conclusion

As you all can se Turkey has quite a lot of vehicles to offer. I basically cherry picked and copied lLiberté’s Turkish Ground Forces Proposal so please go ahead and check it out. I only picked the ones who were either interesting or had something to do with Korea so there were many more vehicles I left undiscussed here. Now, people might say that this is way too far fetched of an idea but honestly - I think this the perfect place for Turkey. Not only would it make a United Korea Tech Tree one of the most diverse ones, but it can make it competitive enough to deter those who insist that Korea should be subtrees of Japan and China. This would also allow an otherwise empty Turkish Air Force (if they become an independent tech tree that is) to actually have planes from the United Korea Tech Tree, since the Turkish Air Force doesnt exactly have the variety in it. Turkey’s UCAV’s can also be quite an interesting addition to the United Korea Tech Tree and fill something unique in a mostly C&P Air Tree of the United Korea Proposal.

Sources:

Turkish Ground Forces Tech Tree

poll [KKK 50x] Turkish Ground Forces Tech Tree [TSK 50x] Thunder in the Sky, Tanker on the Ground We have been working on finding a proper solution for the implementation of Turkish Ground Forces Tech Tree to War Thunder and now with the addition of Israeli Tech Tree Gaijin gave us best possible way to work on. After the initial release of Israeli TT, I have started working on my own project but it was rather sloppy and nowhere near of being a proper tech tree. After sometime finally found p…

South Korea–Turkey relations

Turkey and South Korea: A friendship built over a war

Turkish Brigade

Kabatas High School East Asia & World Project

TAI TF Kaan

GSD-23-Art-5-042016.pdf

MIKTA

https://old-forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/576061-turkish-tech-tree/page/2/

[MXY7_Ohka_when]

I think a Turkish subtree should go to Israel instead, they have much better need for it
even if Gaijin were to finally add unique Israeli vehicles (not Merkava/Centurion/Magach), they would still be behind a lot of trees

[UnknownVariable]

Arguable but possible. For me though, Israel and Turkey rarely cooperated with each other and are often times at each other’s throats. The alliance of periphery isnt all that stable as well and I would argue is not that much better than MIKTA.

Also aside from modernizing Turkey’s fleet of F4’s and F5’s and missile contracts, their defense industries have rarely crossed paths with one another. South Korean defense companies though have had multiple technology transfer deals with Turkish defense companies although these are more recent events.

And I dont think Turkish players would even like the thought of having their tech tree as a subtree of Israel and it would be too ironic if Turkey was added as a subtree to Israel while having United Korea when in the first place United Korea was done to not upset Koreans over their tech tree being a subtree in Japan.

Anyways, I think India is a potential subtree for Israel. They are after all the largest importer of Israeli military products. They have an exhaustive list of military cooperation and codevelopment. This is a very nuanced alliance though, but it definitely exists.

[MXY7_Ohka_when]

@UnknownVariable

I think India is a potential subtree for Israel.

India is pretty much already confirmed to go to Britain (Viayanta (although it’s a British tank) and the Bhishma)

[UnknownVariable]

I mean it could still change but oh well. I really cant understand what Gaijin is thinking adding India to Britain when it has ANZAC, Canada, and hell Singapore as potential additions to Britain. India’s Soviet Vehicles wouldnt even sit well with British players.

[Confrade]

China and Taiwan share the same tech tree and it’s fine.
Don’t think how it would be a problem for the Koreas.

[UnknownVariable]

I agree. Korea is in the same spot as Germany and China where they all are technically one unified country. Germany got their unification but China & Taiwan being in one TT really sets the precedence for a United Korea one. After all both Koreas claim sovereignty over each other and just like China - only has signed a ceasefire agreement.

[ByEmirReyiz]

Yeah lol what’s up with people trying to bend reality as much as they can to fit a possible Turkish subtree to their nation proposal.

Let’s get the reality first: Turkey by itself as an independent nation would be more larger and more original than Israel or an United Korea.

Yeah, we are more related to S. Korea than Israel but still this does not make much sense.

We get armor and body schemes for Altay from K2 and license/modify the K9. What Korea Tree can get from these are an Altay variant (which literally exists as the same performance and role with K2) and a Fırtına variant (which literally exists as the same performance and role with K9 as well) and wouldn’t really add much stuff.

Just because we fought together in 1950 and licensed a vehicle and another vehicle’s parts cannot mean you can just gobble up the entirety of domestic/another-nation-related vehicles Turkey use for this tree which can clearly exist without a foreign subtree.

Korea Tree can benefit from an early-prototype Altay variant and Fırtına II’s prototype version as Premium/Events at best, but the rest is not related to Korea and literally overshadows the tree itself.

@UnknownVariable

Turkey sits in a weird spot where they operate NATO and Western Military Vehicles but are politically getting closer to Russia and its sphere. This makes Turkey quite the hermit in its region as it cannot join other countries to form a comprehensive tech tree with.

Not to get geopolitics in here, but Turkey is not close to Russia and it’s sphere just because it is having problems with other NATO countries. Turkey is one of the top suppliers of Ukraine and our possible Turkish Tech Tree proposal has barely any Russian origin vehicles (those who exist are from other Turkic countries) and even if it did it would not really affect Turkey’s position in game.

I appreciate the effort and dedication, but as the leader of WT Türkiye Tech Tree Project, we oppose and do not support this idea.

[花谱_kaf]

LMAO, if Korea were to be added to Japan, would indeed add France to Britain (after all, based on the history of the former’s World War II history: the Free France after France surrendered to Germany was established and recognized by the British-backed Charles de Gaulle and headquartered in London).

[UnknownVariable]

I mean understandable, I was just throwing random stuff lmao. Honestly Turkey might work best as random bits and pieces scattered across tech trees. If Japan ends up getting Thailand (and the rest of SEA with it) as a subtree, it could get the ACV-15 and Kaplan. United Korea could get the Altay and Firtna as premiums, Israel could get the modernized M60s. USA could get the ATILGAN as its based on the Stinger.

However it would be a shame for Turkish prototypes to not have a home so…

Anyways, I said that Turkey is getting closer to Russia because it still has a military relationship with them today despite being in NATO. Turkey still hasnt sanctioned Russia and have become one of Russia’s biggest customers as of recent. Still I do believe that Turkey is not really within the Russian sphere of influence, its just that its not fully committed to either one hence why I suggested going to a safer third-party choice (even if it makes as much sense as adding Peru as a subtree to Japan)

Thank you for checking it out though. Its not really a proper proposal moreso than just a suggestion on what could be.

[ChieftainWarrior]

@Sensei3643

Type 62(6.7)

Very much not important but these are Vietnamese Type 62s in a parade in Hanoi.

Below are the only photos of Type 62s in DPRK service that I’ve found online.

[ARK_BOI]

Independent TT I agree with this Idea like East and west German in the same TT

[UnknownVariable]

Was the M2020 considered to be placed as NK’s Top Tier MBT?

[Alan_Tovarishch]

Yeah it should be added but we know even less about it than other NK tanks.