If you cannot create a realistic, technically accurate model for LDIRCM, then remove it from the game . Fictional, passive shields have no place in this game. Remove it until it is actually simulated, instead of being a broken placeholder for high-tier Helis.
19 Likes
It’s a bit powerful, yes. But that isn’t enough reason to remove it entirely. Just requires some fine touches.
Facts.
The FnF munitions and low radar signature already makes the helis strong
7 Likes
Jets still reign supreme.
The new Pantsir also just demolishes them as well.
They should nerf LDIRCM (perhaps one or two IIR missiles at a time) and move them to 12.7.
The 13.0 / 12.7 non-LDICRM helis should go to 12.3 - 12.0.
Increase the max BR to 13.0 and move up both Pantsirs to 12.3 and 13.0 respectively.
IRIST and Mamba should also go to 13.0.
1 Like
If IRIS-T has no problem killing helicopters with LDIRCM, then yes, otherwise it will just be the worst SPAA in the game as it is currently.
Neither the IRIST nor MAMBA can deal with the helicopters reliable and this is because of the afore mentioned fact that LDIRCM is overperforming basically in a short manner none of the end of the line SPAA should struggle to kill a helicopter period all the IR missiles to my knowledge should be able to ignore LDIRCM, and radar returns should always be possible on the helicopters. The New Panstir does feel a little pointless as Russia is the dominant CAS nation in both Helicopters and Airplanes so Ironically the biggest offender of the cas problem is the only one who has a good counter for it.
3 Likes
I already said that LDIRCM should be nerfed.
IRIST and Mamba are still the best when it comes to dealing with aircraft.
The new Pantsir is just the new best, while also being able to kill LDIRCM helicopters relatively easily too.
If RADAR missiles would be able to go against helicopters even while multipathing then they should move down the LDIRCM helis all the way to 12.0 or 11.7.
IRIST isn’t the worst SPAA in the game. It’s just as usless as any other non-SACLOS SPAA against LDIRCM helis at the moment besides the TAN SAM KAI.
FNF munitions on the heli even if the heli can be killed by ground spaa decently easily, should retain being top tier the advantage of these helicopters should be the duck and shoot ability not being able to stand in the open with relative immunity. Spaa should always have the advantage over CAS in ground rb.
Well my initial idea was to make sure that they can’t counter many IIR missiles at the same time… so that they can’t just keep ballooning and shooting F&Fs at targets.
Completely removing multi-path effect for helis AND completely removing LDIRCM effectiveness against IIR missiles would just nullify any practicality of duck and shoot. They would just loft over whatever hill or tree foliage you are hiding behind.
The only case where it may work well is if you have mountains for cover, but that barely exists other than on few maps like Red Desert, Campania, and Vietnam.
8.3 - 9.0 Helis typically outrange / dodge the enemy SPAA’s guns to stay alive (besides a few like the WZ305 and M247).
9.3-10.0 Helis start facing IRCCM missile SPAA with guns, so they typically pre-flare to avoid getting locked on by IRCCM and then outrange their guns to stay alive (besides a few like the Rapier and Type 93).
10.3 - 11.0 Helis typically are able to outrange them again (think about 8km Hellfires, 6km ATAKAs / BA-9s / AKD-9s, or can just pre-flare again to stay alive (besides a few like the Stormer HVM, and possibly the Tunguska).
11.3-12.0 helis start to rely more on IOG (hellfires, AKD-10s, AKD-9s, Mokopas) and enemy missile interception (beam-riding ATAKAs, Vikhirs) to stay alive (besides the Pantsir and possibly the ADATS)
12.3 - 13.0 helis start to rely on F&Fs and LDIRCM. They completely dominate most teams because it doesn’t take any real effort to balloon and fire F&Fs at enemies (unlike lower BR helis). They rarely can be killed by IIR missiles / radar missiles but the new Pantsir completely obliterates them and their missiles if they go close spawn helipad.
If they go far spawn heli-pad and launch when they get within range, it’s really easy for SPAA to just hide or intercept all of them, and it takes some time to get back to the helipad (if the far helipad is too far away from the battlefield).
The chance that your F&F also gets obstructed by cover increase a lot more too.
You’re effectively forced to balloon up to have a good view and clear LOS on enemies in a lot of maps besides some like Red Desert, Campania and Vietnam.
If you remove their ability to stop ALL IIR missiles and Radar missiles then their only real use would be on maps like the ones I stated earlier (Red Desert, Campania and Vietnam).
I think 11.7 may be too drastic but 12.0 / 12.3 would make more sense then – especially if they decide to increase the max BR to 13.0 and move some of the better SPAAs up.
Also competent jet players still mog LDIRCM helis too, as with all helicopters at each BR.
I think it should be a fair fight.
SPAA that are too underwhelming and then you get GRB becoming CAS lobbies.
SPAA that are too strong and then you get planes and helis that cost ~500-600 SP just to be a glorified RP pinata while SPAA only costing 70 SP.
If it’s balanced then retards with LDIRCM helis and KH-38 spammers can’t just get 6 kills every game in them without any thought, but good players would still be able to earn a good number of kills in them and have the SP it takes to spawn them be worth it.
No to any weird nerfs, just make DIRCM jam as many missiles as there are jammers on the aircraft.
1 Like
never
if anything all cancer-cas should go higher
1 Like
Haha, gaijin would never do that because it would make the mi28nm less powerful. But hey, it isn’t like the iog and dl magically turn of if the missile gets blinded by dircm, right? right gaijin? And lets not forget the fact that missiles like the iris t don’t really care about dircm irl.
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AH-64E (all) and Z-10ME all have it
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This could sadly be said about a decent number of missiles too. Gaijin is too busy throwing in nerfed version of stuff because so many people keep demanding to see the name of a missile in game.
They really need to stop adding new weapons and system and work on bringing the current stuff to their irl performance.
4 Likes
The problem is that a lot of existing aircraft / SPAA in-game would probably be too overpowered if they weren’t nerfed by some capacity. You’d have to remove them from the game (which isn’t a good idea since we’re long past that point – especially with vehicles), or keep them in a nerfed state until new / more modern SPAA / Weapons / Aircraft get added.
This is the corner they have painted themselves into. They will continue to add new stuff in a nerfed state which in turn will worsen the impact of un-nerfing stuff.
I wish they just waited to until the game was ready for stuff to be added in its regular state.
1 Like
Lmao.
Did I lie? The IRIS-T is efficient against jets, but all it takes is a single helicopter with LDIRCM to neutralize it. Or even a plane with rocket pods saturating the radar, which lacks any filtering unlike in real life, where AI prioritizes targets. Here, the IRIS-T radar is a complete mess. Not to mention it’s the largest SPAA in the game; on many maps it’s useless because tanks can easily hit the radar. It also has no cannons to defend itself against ground threats, unlike the Pantsir. If it’s not the worst, it’s definitely one of the worst SPAAs in the game. It is also terrible at intercepting enemy missiles or bombs. You almost always need two or more missiles to destroy a single piece of incoming ordnance, and even then, they sometimes still manage to hit you.
The IRIST is the most used SPAA in top tier Squadron Battles after the Pantsir and Mamba amongst Top Squadrons.