Redesign the navy's targeting system to be different from WT Mobile

[Kweedko]

Aiming in War Thunder is terrible because it was designed for small boats with ranges of 3-5 km. The current arcade mode, while not perfect, actually addresses and mitigates some of these issues — such as constant target visibility on fast speeds and distances, dependence on weapons for some ships aka useless main guns, simultaneous aiming of secondary and main guns considering their ballistics, close-range aiming, parallax bugs when closing in, and other quirks. It also makes many underperforming ships (like those without rangefinders but with large guns) playable, which were previously hardly used or only played with AA guns ignoring the main caliber. Yes, the developers could have done this more elegantly; they could have implemented a dependency in accuracy for aiming and repositioning the guns with different delays as modern vs old ships difference, kept the information about barrel directions intact, and not broken everything with shooting through obstacles for a week. But unfortunately, we have what we have.

Full return to old aiming will bring all its problems back.

At least camera shaking bug being accepted.

[FuegoTigre]

@Kweedko

Full return to old aiming will bring all its problems back.

The “problems” we have NOW are MANY magnitudes greater than the “problems” we had before. They took the core mechanic of the game, and they broke its back. They obliterated it. They turned it into something untested, unfinished, and largely unwanted.

I get it. You didn’t like not being able to shoot ships 10km away while both of you are moving full speed in opposite directions. The ship was way out of frame. I’d experienced that too. But it wasn’t worth making Arcade Naval the hot mess it is now. A mobile game version of skilless aimbotting.

We could have done maybe a Picture-in-Picture solution for that when zoomed in. [shrugs] We didn’t have to destroy Naval Arcade to “fix” that pretty niche issue.

And yet… here we are.

With a nice chunk of us beating drums, begging to be heard, creating forum posts and trying to refute the gaslighters.

One of your arguments, Kweedko, is that happy and content people aren’t here making noise.

A LOT of people, myself included, didn’t think we had to come here and make noise. We were content. We didn’t think we had to police the forums to protect our favorite game from being shoved into a running garbage disposal.

Now, you see people who have never posted (me) or haven’t in years, logging back on to be heard.

One of my concerns is that, those of us who can’t stomach the hot mess the game is right now not being able to be heard because you lose the ability to post after a week of inactivity. It’s a convenient way to make voices disappear.

And that means, a lot of these disgruntled voices are so passionate about the game, and seeing it fixed, they’re playing 3 matches a day just so they can be a part of the discussion.

That should say alot.

[Kweedko]

I bet they won’t change anything, except bugfixing, before the next naval marathon or maybe even next major patch, and if marathon shows good results in new players online and engaging in the mode, they keep it for long .

[LeMorbidDeath]

I predominantly played Navy and for that reason 90+% of my friends list in-game are Navy players.
Since the automatic aiming blunder system the bare few that bother to still log in are there only to wait and hope it changes back/changes to something better and/or:

@FuegoTigre

they’re playing 3 matches a day just so they can be a part of the discussion.

And they are playing air or ground while waiting - not Navy.

[Kweedko]

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

[BlackSmithNZ]

That is me.

I wanted to contain to play Naval, but it is so broken that it is simply not enjoyable.

Used to have a line up for every nation that included ships with float planes and coastal boats to take caps as well as BBs for the circle matches. Now with auto-aim, it is pointless using anything but the heaviest ships and pretty much just boring point and click.

Gaijin must have data showing before and after; I do wonder what it shows for Naval, as the odd time I have tried it recently, seems to be the usual small group of players just are not there anymore.

[FuegoTigre]

@BlackSmithNZ

Now with auto-aim, it is pointless using anything but the heaviest ships and pretty much just boring point and click.

100%

Every Nation had a low tier coastal, a mix costal and blue water, then I had a end tier blue water line up.

Every Single Nation that had Costal, I’d ground out completely. That’s how much I loved Naval and Coastal.

Now… no point in playing anything but BBs and there ain’t NOTHING exciting about that.

[sigh]

[SD_Harmonian]

4000+ battles here, I can confirm that
The top tier right now is worse, no need for any strategy, just point and click like using aimbot
Shimakaze with 15 km torpedoes is not a threat anymore, cause you can snipe her right on sight
All you have to do now is spawn with the heaviest armor ship you have, with the fastest reload main gun you have, and spam every shell you have to any target you have on sight. What is the point of playing naval on top tier anymore?
I would rather play on 4., where there are at least some strategies, like hide and seek with SRK-7 and her rocket launcher (that fun at shit, for both the SKR-7 and her enemies)

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

Every Nation had a low tier coastal, a mix costal and blue water, then I had a end tier blue water line up.

Every Single Nation that had Costal, I’d ground out completely. That’s how much I loved Naval and Coastal.

Now… no point in playing anything but BBs and there ain’t NOTHING exciting about that.

So what a have both costal and bluewater tops for all nations. And enjoy playing them both. And i can see that battles become more tactical. And all ships have their niches now cause of this:

@Kweedko

It also makes many underperforming ships (like those without rangefinders but with large guns) playable, which were previously hardly used or only played with AA guns ignoring the main caliber.

@Kweedko

simultaneous aiming of secondary and main guns considering their ballistics,

@SD_Harmonian

Shimakaze with 15 km torpedoes is not a threat anymore, cause you can snipe her right on sight

That’s total lie, 10+ km manvuering shimikaze is still a big treat to slow BB, and you can only catch good player by luck or when he on torpedo launch maneuver. But if you sail strait you are dead meat, but that was prior patch, after patch players just not afraid to change targets anymore, that’s why they focus you more often and that is good and that’s right cause dumb DD always lose to BB. Heavy ship vs light ship problem appeared way before patch and should be resolved not by aiming tweaks. How, you can read in my tread - Набор идей к обсуждению для улучшения игрового опыта в морских боях, aka Make Naval Great Again - #178 от пользователя Kweedko - Обсуждение игры - War Thunder — официальный форум some of the paragraphs is about that .

[Rupert64]

@FuegoTigre

Every Single Nation that had Costal, I’d ground out completely. That’s how much I loved Naval and Coastal.

Oh yea, coastal tree is the only one which I grinded full in every nation

[FuegoTigre]

@Kweedko

And i can see that battles become more tactical. And all ships have their niches now cause of this:

NO ONE here has found the “Battles more tactical”. How could they have become more tactical? Why would a more simplistic mobile gaming auto-aiming system create “more tactical” matches?

@Kweedko

t also makes many underperforming ships (like those without rangefinders but with large guns) playable, which were previously hardly used or only played with AA guns ignoring the main caliber.

There was never anything wrong with these ships. The Arras is one of the best performing 3.0 boats in the game to the player who knew how to use it. The issue wasn’t about AIMING. You learned that. It was about how damage models responded to rapid fire weapons. ANY of those boats are NOT going to fair any better against an SKR or 206.

No one is learning anything about aiming now. There’s not enough information to do that. The current system is unabashedly and objectively worse. You have no awareness of where your guns are. No lead indicators to give you an idea of how fast your guns swing. Nothing.

It needs to be reverted and reconceived.

[Kweedko]

Perfect example how costal can outplay bluewater atm .
https://warthunder.com/ru/tournament/replay/332846273085093393?public_key=UOWlwLc8M1wOUKRPSEy9

[FuegoTigre]

You keep taking screenshots of end match standings. That means nothing to anyone. It doesn’t prove anything, or illustrate anything. Cool. You wrecked a bunch of bots. Of which this match is half full of. This doesn’t make any point. Except you’re good at half empty matches.

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

NO ONE here has found the “Battles more tactical”. How could they have become more tactical? Why would a more simplistic mobile gaming auto-aiming system create “more tactical” matches?

Because gameplay is not all about aiming and shooting, if you don’t wanna play smart it’s your problem.

@FuegoTigre

There was never anything wrong with these ships. The Arras is one of the best performing 3.0 boats in the game to the player who knew how to use it.

Arras is bad example. And you know why.

@FuegoTigre

ANY of those boats are NOT going to fair any better against an SKR or 206.

Yes they do now, cause they can hit them with first shot easily if SKR and 206 are dumb.

@FuegoTigre

No one is learning anything about aiming now. There’s not enough information to do that. The current system is unabashedly and objectively worse. You have no awareness of where your guns are. No lead indicators to give you an idea of how fast your guns swing. Nothing.

If you don’t wanna learn that doesn’t mean nobody gonna learn.

@FuegoTigre

It needs to be reverted and reconceived.

Just to please some imba abusers? SL farmers ?

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

You keep taking screenshots of end match standings. That means nothing to anyone. It doesn’t prove anything, or illustrate anything. Cool. You wrecked a bunch of bots. Of which this match is half full of. This doesn’t make any point. Except you’re good at half empty matches.

You could check that fight and learn something .

[FuegoTigre]

@Kweedko

Because gameplay is not all about aiming and shooting, if you don’t wanna play smart it’s your problem.

I’m sorry. Can you point on the War Thunder where gameplay has not been all about aiming?

Which mode of War Thunder, historically, has not had aiming as its primary component of gameplay?

What’s left? Manuvering!?!? In a BB? in a Heavy Cruiser? On an open water map? What are we talking about here. I don’t understand.

@Kweedko

If you don’t wanna learn that doesn’t mean nobody gonna learn.

• The information to learn from has been stripped.
• The gunplay/mechanics CHANGE, without explanation, when you’re targeting a boat, versus NOT targeting a boat.
• You have NO WAY to adjust your fire manually so that you can actually apply knowledge to skill shots.

@Kweedko

Just to please some imba abusers? SL farmers?

What do you think a “no brains” aimbot ai aiming system is doing right now? You don’t even have to man your guns. …comeon man. You don’t even have to actively use your guns for them to target and fire.

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

• The information to learn from has been stripped.
• The gunplay/mechanics CHANGE, without explanation, when you’re targeting a boat, versus NOT targeting a boat.
• You have NO WAY to adjust your fire manually so that you can actually apply knowledge to skill shots.

That’s not true

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

What do you think a “no brains” aimbot ai aiming system is doing right now? You don’t even have to man your guns. …comeon man. You don’t even have to actively use your guns for them to target and fire.

so why then i am on first place in that match with big gap if all so simple now, and bottom players done 10X less impact ?

[Rupert64]

maybe simply due to fully grinded ships and crew?

[Nostalgistic]

Chill out, guys, you should take this to DMs. Nobody wants to scroll through personal arguments that barely contribute to the topic.

I want to say something about the NAB’s targeting system, but seeing this has killed the vibe.