Redesign the navy's targeting system to be different from WT Mobile

[spirtous]

@Kweedko

@spirtous

2.AI gunners and A/A gunners changed with the patch, given that so far there is no responce from GJ I am not so sure that this was not intentional.

They change it cause they changed rewards for bots and that is right, cause bots require same amount of time to kill if you waste time to kill bots you not killing the players, in that time you become vulnerable, ыщ why should you get less rewards .

Players A/A , auxiliery and AI gunners changed because of what?
What rewards have to do with this?

Also why did they changed the bots rewards and how did this benefit the player?
Now how is a bot that insta snipe me not an immetiate threat?
If I don’t kill the bot it will laser kill me, correct?
I guess more deaths for me more repair costs,GJ logic not Kweedko’s.

@Kweedko

@spirtous

Yes prior to the patch they could shoot you but 99,9% they would miss.

That’s not true 1 sec reangefinding give you ability to get green circle/“v”, all you need just aim at it and shoot.

This was also a major nerf for coastial but it was not game breaking, 1sec should only be valid for an aready ranged target and maybe like 3 or 4 max. Actually this is more realistic than both old and new system, crews can track many targets and newer ships can track even more.

@Kweedko

oh come on, even before that, killing a strait sailing boat never been a problem if you know what to do. Not near 99% of misses as spirtous stated.

I said Destroyers insta killing coastials at spawn, I have also shared photos of that in the other posts.
Again please stop twitching my words to fit your perpective.

ps1->your sugestions are links to the Russian forum, we don’t speak Russian and also don’t have account. They seem intresting so if you want to talk about them make a suggestion in these forums.

[Kweedko]

@spirtous

ps1->your sugestions are links to the Russian forum, we don’t speak Russian and also don’t have account. They seem intresting so if you want to talk about them make a suggestion in these forums.

You can login there with your account it always been that way it all the same ecosystem, so go vote support naval changes. Or you can replicate them here in suggestion section if you really need it. Redesign the navy's targeting system to be different from WT Mobile - #90 by Kweedko

@spirtous

Players A/A , auxiliery and AI gunners changed because of what?

You mixing different changes that use the same mechanic it could not be the same but dev choose this way.

@spirtous

I said Destroyers insta killing coastials at spawn, I have also shared photos of that in the other posts.
Again please stop twitching my words to fit your perpective

Before patch i always instakill boats on spawn if i can see them and reach them.

@spirtous

Also why did they changed the bots rewards and how did this benefit the player?
Now how is a bot that insta snipe me not an immetiate threat?
If I don’t kill the bot it will laser kill me, correct?
I guess more deaths for me more repair costs,GJ logic not Kweedko’s.

Cause high risk high reward. Play smart, do not respawn or sail strait and solo vs bunch of bots which got better ships(i bet you don’t do that if there are real players), imagine them like not very intellectual players.

[spirtous]

@Kweedko

You can login there with your account it always been that way it all the same ecosystem. Or you can replicate them here in suggestion section if you really need it. Redesign the navy’s targeting system to be different from WT Mobile - #90 by Kweedko

We don’t read Russian, either way its your suggestions.

@Kweedko

Before patch i always instakill boats on spawn if i can see them and reach them.

For the last time, spawn to spawn laser killing was not easy, now is.

@Kweedko

Cause high risk high reward. Play smart, do not respawn or sail strait and solo vs bunch of bots which got better ships(i bet you don’t do that if there are real players), imagine them like not very intellectual players.

Again the same assumption that we play stupid? really m8?

Also I have no idea what you mean by “high risk high reward”
I don’t need more SL if its to brake my game or fun, it not an online cazino.
Either way thisis not related with the new aiming, it just changed with the same patch.

[Kweedko]

@spirtous

We don’t read Russian, either way its your suggestions.

Man there is 21 century outside the window, translate it with AI or google translator which installed in browser if you really interested.

@spirtous

For the last time, spawn to spawn laser killing was not easy, now is.

Always was.

@spirtous

I don’t need more SL if its to brake my game or fun, it not an online cazino.

You don’t need i don’t need, but i do need RP why you deciding that nobody need. As i say before bot TTK same as player especially on big ships why should it give 10x less reward. Besides that bot kill you planes and boats efficiently now.

[Rupert64]

@Kweedko

Always was.

NO! At least not for us noobs ;-)

[Kweedko]

Reload on HE + main and secondary simultaneously shooting option enabled and no problems. Btw after major patch looks like coastal boats got increased survivability for compartments i waste more shots to kill one.

ps. over obstacle aiming finally fixed

Planes still viable too. But they break zooming after you leave a plane lol (Update 2.45.0.76 - #15 by Kweedko)

[Rupert64]

did you test the aiming fix? I saw another post in which it was claimed not to be fixed…
I can test it by my own in a few hours

[Kweedko]

yep for me it seems fine

[FuegoTigre]

@Kweedko

If you know what you doing you always choose easy prey no matter of aiming.

If you’re losing LOS to the boat from your ship because it:

1. Isn’t visible at 5km (or 3km!)
2. Is small and maneuverable
3. Has terrain to use to its advantage

Then you’re absolutely not firing on it with your slower firing turrets because the time to target is likely going to equate to a miss, and your time is better spent putting rounds into something you’re FOR SURE going to hit. Like a slow moving blue water.

NOW… you can just lazily target and click and catch someone trying to move from spawn. It’s lazy design.

[Kweedko]

@FuegoTigre

• Isn’t visible at 5km (or 3km!)
• Is small and maneuverable
• Has terrain to use to its advantage

Nothing changed in this with the patch. Shells not homing don’t you know?

[Josephs_Piano]

@LeMorbidDeath

That is a great suggestion! or at least give players the choice?

Excellent idea - I won’t select the old system and would be delighted if all my opponents did.

[LeMorbidDeath]

@Josephs_Piano

Excellent idea - I won’t select the old system and would be delighted if all my opponents did.

<3 Love it

You believe the suggested fixed system would make things less painful for you if they did?
I’m sure when the current broken aiming system is fixed it might need balancing, Gaijin will surely handicap what is necessary accordingly!

[Josephs_Piano]

There is no current broken system - there is a current system that people have said they do not like.

I am not one of those people.

And no balance would be needed - if you choose to use the inferior* old system then you get to live with the consequences! :)

*-inferior in the sense that people say the new system makes hitting your target much easier, so it must be harder to do so with the old system

[LeMorbidDeath]

Ah okay gotcha,
Thanks for your opinion!
Don’t forget to tell all that care to vote :)

[spirtous]

@Josephs_Piano

And no balance would be needed - if you choose to use the inferior* old system then you get to live with the consequences! :)

It does not need to be fixed, it could be like planes were you can bind key to go from mouse move to mouse joystick or even better something hybrid s like the one in the G limiter on JETs.

Ofcourse for 100% use you would be clearly be at disadvantage but when you need you probably can free aim much better

Regarding the “broken system” the fault here is that by making the AI calculating the shots the player can now always shoot at max range and make succesfull hits.
This way they “broke” the weapons effective range by make it equal.

So before for weapons we had

a)effective range while maneuvering
b)max effective weapons range
c)max weapons range.

This creates situations like this,

a 2cm/65 c/38 mount can make impossible shots and land not one hit but 4 beyond its effective range, actually beyont its max range…

Funny thing is that even in their wiki it reads

https://old-wiki.warthunder.com/2_cm/65_C/38_(20_mm)

The effective range of the 2 cm/65 C/38 is approximately 2 km with the 20 mm HET belt, though if using the 20 mm APT belt, the effect range can be increased to roughly 2.3 km. Even so, hitting moving targets at such ranges can be difficult because of the relatively low muzzle velocity and the small mass of the rounds. Boats armed with 2 cm/65 C/38 should aim to close the distance where they can overwhelm enemy boats with their firepower.

[Kweedko]

@spirtous

This way they “broke” the weapons effective range by make it equal.

It’s a bug, report it.

[Mc_Intire]

This is just my opinion, of course, but the current system should be changed, or reverted back to pre “Hornets Sting”. In my experience, in coastal battles at BRs between 2 and 3, especially on the smaller maps where engagements occured between 500m and 1,5km, it would become too easy to aim for weak points.

Since the sway of the waves and maneuvering your boat had no influence on your aim anymore (ignoring that you could not see if your guns were properly aimed at your desired target, i.e. if you had obstructions on your deck that could limit the aiming angles of your guns), you could easily aim for ammunition racks, torpedoes or mines, dealing massive damage in a short time.

This would especially devalue ships that would otherwise be considered “sturdy” for having a larger body with lots of “free space” inside or having a large crew complement.

[Kweedko]

So you telling that now even small boats playing vs big boy costals or even DD damaging them become easier cause you much easy aim at their weak points and disarm them, isn’t that good for balance?

@Mc_Intire

Since the sway of the waves and maneuvering your boat had no influence on your aim anymore

That’s not true you can test it in test sail with rough weather. Besides that lots of guns were stabilized before patch. And on that distances there was no problem aiming before patch cause you basically see the target on third-fourth of the screen and weather in the maps of this BR is usually still.

@Mc_Intire

This would especially devalue ships that would otherwise be considered “sturdy” for having a larger body with lots of “free space” inside or having a large crew complement.

You know that there was HE damage changes with the patch and now HE kinetically penetrate hull a bit and then explode, before path they exploded on hull not doing any damage and this what make big difference in survivability.

[Mc_Intire]

Okay, first off, this is again my opinion based on my experiences.

I am sorry about causing confusion. Of course waves will still influence your aim and send volleys overshooting the target by several meters. It is just that your aim indicator, as in the marker that predicts where your shots would land, is now missing.

Pre “Hornets Sting”, if you had a turret with slow vertical traverse rates, it would not just send the shot or volley flying if you hit a wave, but the aim indicator would jump as well. For one this gave you valuable information, as you knew that even if you were pointing at the target, the guns were out of position. On the other hand it sometimes permitted (and required) to adjust your aim to compensate.

Same when you maneuvered and the gun turned into an area where the aiming angles are restricted, i.e. by superstructure on the boat. This gave you an indicator that you need to turn your ship so you could aim at the target again. And permitted certain boats to do strafing runs using small “free gaps” between different parts of the superstructure.

As far as I know, this kind of information is now missing altogether. So even if the old aiming system would not be completely rolled back I would really appreciate some sort of indicator showing me if the barrels of my guns are aiming at the point where my crosshair is.

HE damage change: If this happened, great. One of my biggest beefs in Naval AB was how low to mid caliber HE shells felt incredibly underwhelming.

If this is working as intended, this change alone would have been more than enough for me to have a better chance against corvette or frigate class ships (while using coastal vessels).

That being said, I said in another thread that one of the things I like about naval combat was the change of pace. Instead of everything being paper that died in one shot, you had to consistently take apart your opponent and take out multiple vulnerabilities. If even bluewater ships become one-shot territory for gunboats, it kills part of what made naval game play stand apart.

[FuegoTigre]

I don’t think keeping the current broken system, while allowing the more skill based system to exist, would be a solution. The current system is essentially the aim bot that Gaijin was banning people for using. We all got to be on the same page. That’s the whole point of competitive games like this. It’s a test of skill.

So, no one would not use the aimbot method. They’d either use it or quite playing due to frustration.

We all got to be on the same page.