Simply put, the J-7E for China is severely lacking in air to air prowess. For some reason, despite being 11.3, the J-7E has nothing that properly fits an 11.3 jet. You see, most jets by then have all aspects, or at the very least, has radar missiles. Historically, the J-7 has used PL-8s and PL-9s, both all aspect missiles, and it makes zero sense that a high BR jet that is basically China’s answer to the MiG 21 Bis should continue to carry only rear aspects at a BR where they are having to fight radar missiles from Phantoms (AIM 7s and Skyflashes), MiGs (R3Rs, R-23s, and R-24s), and Mirages (Matra 530s and 550s), and All-Aspects from Harriers and other strike aircrafts (AIM 9Ls and 9Ms), MiGs and Sukhoi (R-60Ms and MKs, R-23Ts, R-24Ts, and R-73s), and Mirage (Magic 2s and Pythons). All those planes are well within the 11.0-12.0 battle range that the J-7E will be fighting. The J-7D makes sense to use rear aspects since it is at 10.7, but the J-7E is at a higher BR, therefore should be held to a higher standard and given weaponry that can defend and fight at 11.3. On top of that, the sources I’ve found on the J-7 has supported the fact that the J-7 has historically had the ability to use all-aspect missiles: PL-8 (Pythons) and PL-9s (upgraded Pythons).
The same can be said for the J-8B, but at least the J-8 has an upgraded platform in 13.0 (albeit a very forgotten jet) that allows China to finally utilise all aspect missiles.
At the very least, Gaijin could put in a Rank VII Chinese premium or event vehicle for the J-7 that allows it to use all aspect missiles.
J-7E faces the same problem zero does: everybody can’t stop turnfighting it. by the end of the year it will be at 12.0 with PL-5B and people will cry “it can turnfight anything” and “PL-5B is OP” all day.
its not even 10 minutes and someone just did everything that I said. Someone please initiate me to Avalon because I did what merlin did without 9000 years of lifetime and experience.
A-10A is 10.3 and has AIM 9Ls, so I hardly see the problem with allowing it to have PL-8s, or at the very least, PL-5IIs.
“But but it can turn fight” cool, so it’s a good plane if I ever want to 1v1 in Rice Prairie. Unfortunately you don’t exactly turn fight at 11.0, because in my experience from playing the MiG 23, the F4S, the MiG 21 bis and bison, and Mirage F1C, no one turn fights. It’s spam your missiles (R3Rs, R-23Rs, R-24Rs, R-24Ts, R-60Ms, Matras, and Magic 2s) and then run back to base and restock. No one turn fights, and of you do, you get fifteen missiles on you, with most of them being your own team.
And as I said, the J-7 should have all aspect missiles. I don’t care if it’s a premium or folder, historically the J-7 has carried those missiles and should have them.
It’s already one of the strongest 11.3 jets. As I said earlier, any buffs would have dramatic effects on its BR.
It can avoid any missile that it sees in matchmaking very easily, enter into a merge, and then kill them if they do anything other than run away.
You can easily force fights in the J-7E by avoiding said missiles then simply killing the other guy. It doesn’t take that long to do so and you don’t have to bleed a ton of speed to do it.
PL-5Bs are also excellent ambush missiles currently, being extremely fast and having some basic flare resistance because of it.
Cool! you will now play it at 12.0 instead of 11.3 tho
12.0 is where all aspects generally start. We’ve been over this.
What rank VII China needs is more planes based on the already existing airframes. Right now, nothing needs a BR change or new weapons besides the F-104G.
There are upgraded J-7E and J-8 variants that can be added, but there’s also stuff like moving the JH-7A down to 11.7/12.0+adding a later variant with IRCCM at 12.3/12.7, or Gaijin could give the Q-5L its PL-5Bs at put it at 10.3. There’s also the F-7PG (Pakistani J-7 variant) that can carry Aim-9Ls or Ms
J7E may not be so strong, but still a playable one with unique playstyle. A popular strategy is hiding yourself in 5km height, and kicking ground-stickers’ ass stealthly, because your double-delta wing makes J7E very easy to get an attack opportunity, and the PL5B’s energy makes it fast enough to get a frag without being noticed.
Another one is to make use of PL5B’s rigidity. You should get close enough to enemy’s rear(like 0.8 km), and when rigidity PL5B didn’t see flares(that’s why some says it has flare ressistance). But this requires skills.
The problem of J7E is, when you try other strategies, like joining team fight directly, you may not feel so good. My suggestion is, avoid doing things that your plane’s not good at, or just switch to other planes.
Yeah, what other plane? The F-104 or the Q-5? All I’m gathering is Rank VIII China is not worth playing, and I may as well just use the JF-17 to grind out of it.
We have already had this exact conversation before. The ones that get them lower than 12.0 are using either A. Really bad all aspects (R60M) or B. bad flight models to excuse it (A10) or C. The F-5s.
I’m saying Rank 7 isn’t worth it. There is literally nothing worth using.
We have the F-104 which has to be the worst jet in history.
The J-7E where you are forced to do a niche playstyle that literally no one will ever fall for. Because surprise surprise, no one does dogfights. They either missile spam or purposely crash so then you can’t missile spam them.
The F-5 which is a somewhat decent dogfighter, except again, if you are uptiered you’re not dogfighting. You got weak missiles and are slower than most.
Q-5, oh boy, what are we going to do with 12 countermeasures, no speed, and no missiles? Oh yeah, use the 23mm cannon that you cannot use since people are smart enough not to head on.
J-8, congratulations, you get radar missiles! After you do a minimum of 115,000rp using only rear aspect missiles. So worth it, especially since Apsides missiles are… well, I don’t think I have met anyone speak highly of them.
So yeah, I am literally better off getting to Rank VII and either A: base bombing in Sim with the A-5C or B: getting a talisman on my JF-17 and grinding my way until I get the F-16A, where I have to get 50,000rp for an engine modification.
Yes, the R-23Ts and R-24Ts are truly the worst all aspect missile. Yep, totally. Also, the AJS37 gets all aspects (RB74s are AIM 9Ls) at 11.0. I still don’t see why you’re hell bent on all aspects having a boundary at 12.0, China just sucks at Rank 7 unless you are doing 1v1s, I literally cannot think of a single redeeming thing for China at Rank 7. Oh wow, it can dogfight, cool! No one dog fights at Rank 7, I have rarely gotten any eliminations from my cannons, and all I have ever been eliminated by have been R-24Rs, AIM-7s, R-24Ts, AIM-9s, and Magics. I cannot think of a single time I’ve been properly shot down.
23T is garbage outright full stop and 24T is never used because 24R is just better
Falls under “shitty FM”
Even if I didn’t think that GAIJIN (see: GAIJIN) wants all aspects to be at 12.0+ (see: F-104S.ASA, JH-7, etc) I’d still think the idea of buffing one of the strongest 11.3s to be insanely silly.
J-7E and the F-5s are both very good. F-5A is incredible even.
You’re right, if you hate J7E’s style, F5’s uptier, or Aspide’s spading, CN rank 7 sucks. I’m not sure if you tried aspide, I can tell you it’s similar to F4E’s dogfight-sparrow. Yes, not as good as MiG23ML’s R24R.
It’s normal for everyone that some specific rank of specific nation is not playable because of personal preference. I don’t like French rank 5/6, finally I paid for the premium MF1C200. All I can do is to hope you can get JF-17 quicker.
Oh I’m SUUUUURE you get plenty of dogfights, I truly believe it. I do too actually. I usually press “Y” on my controller, go down to “Custom Battles”, then I press “Y” again to “Create Session”, go to Duels, [Tournament] Duel 1x1 - Rice Terrace (or Ireland), and I get into dogfights all the time. I see where we get mixed up. I get plenty of 1v1s at 11.0 when I do that. You must do the same, because no way are you actively getting into dogfights on Air Realistic “all the time” in public servers. Sim I can buy, Arcade I also buy, but not Realistic.
Also, I used R-24Ts for Sim with the MiG 23. R-24Ts so they don’t get a tracking blare, and napalm to make the grind easy.
Literally just stay high below contrail height and launch pl5s at unaware targets. You have insane energy retention so you can stay fast very easily, and you have a top tier rwr to easily deal with any threat.
I have the JF-17, I just haven’t really had much use for it apart from Ground Battles (and even then it is practically worthless compared to F-16, F-15, or the Su-30 and 34).
I usually hate early jets to begin with, the MiG 21s and 23s made it somewhat bearable for Russia and Sweden, and the MiG 21 made grinding the rest of Britain a lot better than it should have been. I figured I’d give Rank VII another shot due to my good luck with Russia. Yeah no, big mistake. At least China is almost done, it just sucks that I don’t get any planes that I like, because I love Chinese ground for the most part. Which is also hilarious since I absolutely hated tanks for the longest time.
I see why people are obsessed with Russian bias: Russians have the most consistent “good” stuff. I don’t really think there is a single BR where I don’t have a bad time with tanks and/or planes. Maybe early jets, but I just hate those regardless, but even they aren’t as terrible.
The F-5A is undertiered, and the E is good.
The J-7E is very good.
The J-8B is like a mig-21 mixed with a mig-23. Aspides are good radar missiles, and the J-8 is very fast too. Play it like a Mig-23.
The Q-5A and L will be overtiered very soon, right after getting an unfair and undocumented nerf.
The F-104G is garbage.