I disagree. The Panzer IVs are pretty good in a downtier, but are mediocre at best in an uptier / slight uptier.
Most maps require you to play close-range, which is not good for Panzer IVs, as you mainly rely on your gun.
An M4A2 (assuming same skill level) curbstomps them like ease, as well as the Ram, since they have a lot of benefits over the Panzer IV, including the short-stop stabilizer.
If anything, the M4A2, KV-1E/B, and RAM should all move up in BR, or even decompress the whole BR range.
There is no reason why the B1 TER should be facing KV-1s and Panzer IVs, whereas there is no reason why the Panzer IV should be at the same BR as the RAM, nor the M4A2 (if it were to move up in BR). It’s too squishy, and this is coming from a person who aced their M4A2 for free, and has played the KV-1 (L-11) a fair bit.
Maybe it’s just me, but I think the Chi-Nu II is fine at 4.3.
The gun is much better than the Panzer IV’s, not only because of the extra penetration (although sometimes it’s quite negligible), but also because it gets 84.8 grams of tnt, instead of just 28.9 grams. This makes 1-shotting opponents much easier, which somewhat reduces the drawback of having a 6.5s reload instead of a 5.9s reload.
The Chi-Nu II also gets slightly better HP/TON over the Panzer IVs, and has better turret traverse speed, although the armour is quite similar between the two.
They both have similar reverse speeds.
Maybe a 0.3 BR difference makes more sense than a 0.7 BR difference, but I don’t seem to be doing too badly in it, despite it supposedly being overtiered.
Hmm, maybe I’m misremembering it, but always felt faster than the Pz IVs.
The gun has quite a bit better angled pen than the german one, armor is only comparable to the Pz IV F2 and inferior to all later models.
All that you mentioned just proves that it’s not really worthy of 4.3 IMO - slower reload especially.
Neither am I, but clearly I’m better than the average ground player.
I dunno if they’re directly comparable. I was a slightly worse player when I aced its crew, and it has stats back from when I was a noob. I’ll check it when I’m back home in a few days.
You can perhaps play 10 matches of each, record how you do, and see how they feel.
Although, a lot of other things can affect how well you do, like whether or not you have both of them aced / experted, and what crew level they have (as well as what you spent your crew points on).
10 matches isn’t a lot to go by either, as one match can be statistically significant (out of 10), but I think it’s generally enough to have a sense of how you do with them.
Well, your KPS for your Panzer IV H is 1.97 while your KPS for your Chi-Nu II is 2.31 KPS.
So you are doing better in your Chi-Nu II than your Panzer IV H, but I guess we don’t know how much of that is because of gained experience or not.
I played the Pz IV H a lot when I was a noob, so I’m blaming that lol. I aced it before even buying the Chi-Nu II if memory serves me right, so I’m not surprised that I’m doing better in it. I wish you could filter stats by time period, or get a graph for each vehicle.
This is also obvious if you check my stats for the german 109 E-4 and japanese 109 E-7. They’re completely identical, but I’m doing way better on the latter.
Move up nerfed is a complete nosense. This old Gaijin tradition with germans tanks need to be stoped.
If ausf. H is moved to 4.0 need the rank 3 change yes or yes.
Leave ausf. F2 in 3.3 rank 2, ausf. J in 3.7, update ausf. G to KwK L/48 like italian one to 4.0 and rank 3 foldered with ausf H. with the same same BR and rank.
Pz VI is hot garbage. Irl it was a good tank, thx to alot factors which won’t matter ingame.
Since I got hands on the German KV-1 and the German Churchill III, I never used this tank anymore. Also consider rank II a waste of time. I’m doing battle pass tasks all day and surely won’t play rank II tanks. Add all this together and you probably know why just few new players play Pz IV.
It was different in the past. Maps were usually better and bigger. Cal50 were less nasty. A simple fighter with cal 50 default belt nowadays guns down Panzer IV teams. P47 with 3800 rounds and that was it, its enough to kill the whole team. Buffalo is also sufficient, though. Gajin won’t care.
Still remember as alot vets played Panzer IVG (was rank 3 back then) on open sniping maps. It was a fotm vehicle (I know, hard to believe). Panzer 4H was also liked by alot players. Today both are rank II and both fail on all these close quarter combat maps. And yes…suffer badly vs. air guns. While other teams require precise bomb drops, Panzer IV’s can be wiped out with air plane MGs.
Like I said, they’re pretty good at their current BRs (especially in a full downtier), but yes, they struggle even in a slight uptier.
The armour is quite useless against most things – with the UFP being the most armoured part and only being worth ~85mm.
The gun is the only reasonably good thing about it (though the TNT equivalent isn’t that great).
I think they are mostly fine at where they are, though the 2.7-3.7 area is somewhat compressed.
There isn’t much a B1 Bis / Ter can do against them… but the Panzer IV easily kills them.
I think the Chi-Nu II should be moved down to 4.0… as it’s only a slightly better Panzer IV H (and somewhat worse in other aspects).
The japanese guns have uncapped shells which perform drastically worse against angles/slopes. It does do more damage than the German 7.5cm but its actually worse against armor in practice.
