I disagree.
It massively increases hit probability in most scenarios by making sure the missile stays on desired target. Sure IOG+DL does nothing for Sparrow kinematically wise but they dont wander off and its harder for them to go for chaff etc.
7M/Fs cant even compare in that regard.
is it? never had any more trouble notching 7Ps than 7Ms
I said harder, not impossible. You can still chaff them but it has to be once they stop recieving DL updates.
considering FOX1 defense is started by chaffing the launch radar, that missile will be long trashed by the time the launch radar can see me again
Sure but then you use the DL to relock, and AN/APG-65 has extremely narrow notch angle.
Like man, sure whatever, i dont particullary feel need to convince you, im just saying how most of my games with Hornet went.
as i said, by the time the radar can see me again the missile is already trashed. you can relock, but you’ll have to throw another sparrow.
Good for you.
It’s actually impossible to notch a AIM-7, because you don’t notch the missile itself, but the radar of the aircraft that launched it, but yes.
The point is that both are speaking from personal experience, just like everyone else on this forum. The thing is, when it comes to the AIM-7P, M and F, the only advantage is launching the AIM-7P into the stratosphere and re-locking after the notch, apart from that, they’re all the same . none is any harder to notch than the others. Ultimately, if a player is good, none of the three will hit the target, the situation will come down to cannons or IR missiles.
In practice, for radar-guided missiles to work, the enemy must always make mistakes, such as positioning errors or poor notch, amongst other things. The most effective air-to-air weapons are short-range IR-guided missiles, which is why Gaijin is reluctant to add new-generation missiles.
Yes, im aware, its SARH. Figure of speech.
Sure but my point isnt just subjective personal experience, i have also a rather large sample size of hard data in form of my performance with 18C early/7P AND i can compare how it performs to something like 15A (and once my bank account recovers from SL gambling i can compare it to 18A as well - same radar, sparrow without IOG and datalink).
Issue is that unlike notching non DL SARH i can, in some instances, salvage the attack if im far enough from the target. Same with chaffing. If i see missile go for chaff i can try to retarget it.
That makes its hit probability much higher and makes it harder to defat.
Thus my point stands.
And thats precisely why i talk hit probability. Obviously in perfect scenario sufficiently skilled pilot will defeat any missile thrown at him. Following this logic - Congrats no missile is worth using as they all can be defeat.
Makes for rather shitty talking point no?
In realistic scenario youre not always in position and or energy state to succesfully perform neccesary defensive action to defeat the mssile. 7P having that extra IOG+DL further eliminating random facotors is what makes it good when compared to 7F/M (like the notorious “wandering off” of a missile in completly different direction of the intended target).
Hell its precisely due to IOG+DL i almost never teamkilled with them - and one time it did happen was due to IOG continuing to leg it towards friendly F-16 even if i did turn off the guidance. Yes im still mad that it happened how could you tell?
You don’t need a perfect scenario you just need the player to play well.
That’s true, but it’s tricky it only works against players who won’t play defensively, otherwise, you’ll rarely manage to keep the lock
Actually, I hadn’t thought of that advantage
Yes and my point with probability still stands despite this.
The chaotic nature of ARB cannot be predicted with 100% accuracy.
That means even a good player can be caught with his pants down as they say in situation where he is at disadvantage and i, as an attacker, im in advantageous position.
The edge IOG+DL gives me over non IOG+DL sparrow, however small it is, can thus be precisely what tips the scales over to my side.
Again im not saying 7P is godlike missile, but you cant deny the hit probability theory doesnt hold water.
I went from 1.6 KD to 2.2 KD lifetime on Hornet ever since i started playing it again proper and i currently sit at around 3.0 KD with it since march 22.
I wouldnt be saying this stuff if i didnt have hard data to back it up.
I find the AN/APG-65 to be good even agaijst defensively flying enemies. Not sasing it cant be notched but if i recall the radar datamine it has really narrow notch angle compared to something like F-15A radar.
Again, im not talking certain hits, im talking increased hit chance.
Its minor but I never had to “waste” a missile since it decided to wander for entirely different target.
Really?
I’ve had the r-27r/er many times just head off
To no where for no reason after launch
Modern SARHs being changed to PD would fix this as xeno has said, would be a very nice buff and make the unlock/relock trick even more powerful.
Well maybe not never but certainly not to the same extent as non IOG+DL sparrows (the were notorious on F-4S a while ago) since the IOG sends it in proper direction when first launched and DL tardwrangles it as long as i have proper lock.
This issue of heading for the wrong target and in the wrong direction also occurs with missiles using DL+IOG. It’s a problem with the simplicity of the radar modelling in War Thunder
I can tell from the afterburner
Meanwhile my aim7 pulls aim9x for a teammate that’s not even in my pov or going for the chaff even tho my radar is locked on to target or just going into a random direction
Ehh aim7m can relock too but not like the aim7p does and aim7p are definitely are more reliable than aim7m
relocking refers to relocking your radar onto the target
Yeah ik I have lost lock with planes in the f14B but I relock them and the aim7m continued to follow
You guys can relock with Aim7 too?
'‘Crying in my Phantom FGR2’*