Shh!!! my wallet might hear you, im gonna buy it ;)
Would be fun to watch.
First spawn vehicle locking down half of the map while killing things across the map that dared to show a few pixels of their antennas.
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Yeah, that definitely wont turn lots of maps into absolute dumpsterfires. And then theres people that ask for the spike launchers on the ground to get loal as well. Yeah man. lets all sit in spawn or on the cap, behind cover, launch missiles somewhere and lock onto an enemy when the missile is in the air. And plllllsss dont make them unreliable. 75% chance for a kill is the smalles amount we r settling for, otherwise you would actually have to leave spawn and play the actual game to get into cas -.- like, do ppl sometimes think about what the consequences could be of the stuff they are asking for?
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Tactical smoke and modern SPAAs are a thing.
Its a bit weird that its always like “too unbalanced” for a new mechanic. Same for Brimstone and MMW seekers. But when Russia or US get a new feature, its never like “too unbalanced”.
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mhm. yeah. let me pop one set of smoke for each 20 m moving on the whole eastern half of sands of sinai. or automatically die for being spotted just for a split second early match. and thats not to mention the tanks that dont even get smoke. or being stock. or maps where you can lock down caps from hull down positions and endlessly replenish. i see how some passive andys might celebrate something like that forever, because they dont want to put themselves in danger and rather sit in the back of the map forever, racking kills without risk while 3 guys of the team have to do the heavy lifting to keep the whole enemy team off the map. i know that bc i played with absolutely abysmal german teams enough that dont know how matches are won so 80% sit in the first 1/3rd of the map and never move up, until they are surrounded from all sides and getting shwacked by cas bc the enemies got all caps early. but sure, lets all just sit on the edges of the map, thats good for gameplay.
the russian stuff being this broken while mavericks do shit all is bs as well and needs changes, but that doesnt justify killing ground to ground gameplay on half the maps.
besides we can talk about this all day, it wont change how gaijin put it in the game anyways fortunately
Spikes are rather slow. I’ve seen it intercepted by Pantsirs and I also manage to neutralize them with Iris from time to time. Long arcing shots from spawn to spawn like you suggest should be no issue to intercept.
Where is the difference? We need to deal with obligatory LMUR and KH-38 volleys the same way. No SPAA = instant team death.
Its the same, just 4mins later in the match. But you’re ofc right. Such a mechanic won’t be ever introduces, since Russia / US don’t use this kind of ground capability on their IFV. Just Germany, Italy, Israel have several ground vehicles using (Euro)Spike.
ok so since wer talking g2g gameplay, how do i reliably intercept those in a mbt. do i send a text chat to that guy that might be in spaa at the start of the match who then tries to intercept a spike thats 50 m above ground? wtf
for air, sure, they are abysmal. 0 damage, 0 lofting, no iog, slow af. but for g2g they get quite a lot of kills early when everyone is running to the sides /flanks or later when hull down. its just a major problem on tanks where the main gun is also rather (too) abysmal like puma. once youre out of spikes youve got a problem. those tanks should get more spikes and maybe a longer reload so they cant infinitely hold whole parts of the map down. or an ammo crate. i rly dont know whats speaking against kf41, boxer and puma getting these.
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Dunno. No one ever asked this question, despite whole teams get effordlessly dismanteled again and again and again. Guess you need an aware SPAA or you just get deleted. Since we suffer this every match agains Russia. So, I don’t see any problems if others suffer possible Spike issues.
At least Spike can be just reloaded at dangerous cap zones, while Suchois safely RTB for another run.
Edit: Spike also can be spoofed by smoke. Russian stuff cant be smoked off.
Also, without knowing how that match went and without judging your or other ppls playstyle (play however you want, but u cant tell me that 80% of the team never even moving anywhere close to the middle of the map aint a massive german team problem) and russian cas at that br being absolutely broken as i said already (pumas spikes are not cas but anyways) that certainly is an interesting position there. did you try to prolong a long lost battle from there? or was that your first spawn? pls tell me it wasnt
it can you just have to move in the smoke. and a bit further since its got iog, gnss (in game at least-lol) and lots of tnt. but in case of kh38s u barely will be able to do so bc while the whole missile is probably fantasy (as is the pantsir sm svs missile’s 0 drag), its guidance and speed might just be as well. who knows. you dont have enough time when static exept for if its coming from 20 km. but u wont see that from the ground anyhow.
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I admit that I like to rack up kills from safe distance. Moving is dangerous in slow tanks. The speed difference is too big.Here we’re about to drive towards the action zone. Not far into the match and still near the spawn base. Already a sideshot camper M18 perfectly set up. He would have smoked the Tiger, I just picked up his engine noise inside the ruins and got him just in time.
But its exactly this what makes german teams horribly bad. They have nothing to counter this kind of gameplay. Own fast movers ambushing enemies and thinning out the horde. Just Tiger and Panther, 35km/h more or less. Dunno what to do. Its mostly this. Fast mover taking caps at match start and then set up on rediculous spots and troll Tigers.
i mean if thats not what youre doing in a m18 what else are you gonna do? frontally brawl with them when u literally cant pen a tiger 2h anywhere from the front? you need to rat and get into their sides. play careful, do what you did, keep eyes and ears peeled and PING if you suspect an enemy there (or heard him). go slow, 3rd person freelook check or go carefully go through the ruins urself. a congaline rarely is the best battle formation. and overconfidence is lots of arrogant team’s downfall like that tiger 2 carelessly pushing that far ahead when no one controls his sides, opening up angles for stuff like m18s thats absolutely helpless in a 1vs1 vs a king tiger frontally.
As i said, im not judging players playstyle and people holding long range sightlines and countersnipe (and restrict enemy teams movement) and do good at it are as essential to the team winning as are the frontline brawlers. It only gets a problem if half the team is doing it and is only passive waiting for something to drive into their gun. Which is like the german disease: My tank excells at long range, ok to do good clearly i should ONLY do that. If you watch really good players, thats almost never what they do (at least not only that). Theres a point where you will need to switch if your team starts losing the caps? Lots of other nations just have faster tanks, so they hold larger portions of the map even before you can get there. so usually it goes like, how can you use your way better armor and guns to claw it back? and its not by all sitting in one line frontally brawling in breslau until everyone gets picked apart from the sides or back… I admit it sucks that other nations have more light tanks at some brs, still at 6.7 germany gets the amazing m41 bulldog, but u rarely see those. KrT_KnspL ofc needs to run into the enemy team in a kingtiger being absolutely clueless…
you can sit in your comfy sniping spot the whole match and kill absolutely everything you see with the first shot. Unless you r absolutely sure you get enough before your team vanishes and the tickets are gone to 100% bring the nuke to the ao that wont win a single match. ever. (or lets say the probability would be probably 10% success. even if you were cheating and lasersnipe everything as soon as you see a glimpse of them) if the rest of your whole team cant manage to hold 2 caps in 40% of the rest of matches the win rate will still be below 50%. with one guy that lasersnipes everything as if it was arcade.
If youre fighting for the important power positions or the caps, a lot of times it can be a 50/50 if you win an engagement, sometimes you win sometimes you lose, the reward is you hold a cap and very good positions somewhere at the middle line of the map. If your whole team doesnt even try to fight for these youve basically lost before doing anything and your whole team is on the clock now having to take way more risks to push back. Its just the logic how this game works on a competitive level. Whether thats always very fun or works well with how some tanks work is another question.
Whenever im matched with or playing with germany i can immediately tell the match will be lost or at least a very rough one, judging by where the players are going, how many are going there etc…and its maybe not even bc they might lose there or get overwhelmed. its bc they pick the wrong tools for the job or fight for parts of the map that, even if they win, are pointless while the whole enemy team is pushing and outnumbering 2 players where it actually matters in the long run. (A cap on mozdok domination is such an example. Yes you can go there, yes you will get 50 sp for the cap together with 10 other players. Enemies get c and b for free and to get b back while they snipe into your spawn has a 80% lethality rate to even get there. i have literally ended matches vs german teams that didnt want to contest positions that matter with a good team in less than 3 minutes on that map layout. they all went to A, like a congaline of lemmings and you get a corner to sit behind and a pumpgun to shoot them from the side)
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Some do and some just want their preferred toys to dominate. Anyone supporting that FnF missiles fired from first spawn vehicles should be extremely lethal (without major changes to the game and modes) either doesn’t care about balance or have limited understanding of it.
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And yet they didnt outranged anyone or the heli had a fantasy forcefield which makes then immune to IR stuff…
Helicopter that didn’t have to manually guide missile after missile was a game changer. It was literally impossible to shoot it down from the ground in certain situations because of that.
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Yet, it was ultimately killable to SPAA’s, to jets with their IR missiles, and it could barely fight back. Funniest thing was, that the PARS didn’t help it to dominate, the Ka-52 was still vastly more lethal due to Gaijin’s fantasy implementation of it being able to guide multiple missiles at once, hence allowing it to overwhelm any and all SPAA’s - technically they usually lived for shorter periods once spawned, but they’d usually dish out vastly more damage, considering PARS has always been anemic in terms of damage, and due to its IR seeker it would confuse dead and alive targets. It was a crutch that allowed it to be viable in GRB, not like LMURS and LDIRCM are today, where they absolutely dominate.
PARS’s biggest use was its ability to take down Ka-52s without detection. But even that was taken away once nations got LDIRCM, as it completely blinds the seeker (wow forcefield), and today it’s basically an SP lolcow.
Back in the day, in squadron battles, it was basically just Leopard 2A5/6 + Ka-52 teams, with M1A2 making an occassional appearance as people deemed the 2A5 and M1A2 to be broadly identical, not 2A5/6 + UHTs.
So sure, try to make an argument (though obviously your opinion is very uninformed), but @Dontkev-psn is absolutely right.
Some do and some just want their preferred toys to dominate.
You mean… like you defending the BMPT and Kh-38MT? You also defended Pantsir, the MiG-27K, and some others that were very clearly dominant. Never saw you defend the 2A6, the 2A7V, the 2A7HU, or Western vehicles that were dominant though, I wonder why.
either doesn’t care about balance or have limited understanding of it.
Man, never seen a more ironic statement, maybe ever.
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Funfact, up to this day all EC-665 are still missing there HIRSS…
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/3eH60xwffiTV
Yeah? And the same applied to the Ka-52, surely as such an advocate for balance like you, you must realise the KHT was never even present in high enough problems to cause issues, meanwhile the Ka-52 caused a whole era of imbalance.
If by defending you mean being totally fine with BMPT moving up even further from 11.7, then I’m afraid it’s your own problem at that point.
Then arguing BMPTs are apparently fine because T-58 and TURM III also performed well (while BMPTs were 10.7 and obliterating a whole BR range… this book is truly writing itself.
Some more gems:
Defend them from what exactly ?
Lets see… about how they’re not actually dominant cause they went up in BRs by only 1 step, with whataboutisms, of course. That’s your whole shtick after all;
“X vehicle is really OP”
“But did you look at this unrelated to the topic Y vehicle, which also performed extremely well and therefore vehicle X is okay”
On the other hand, if those vehicles were in the USSR TT I’m confident shrieks from the usual suspects would echo in this forum for months on end.
People made whole threads about the Leopard 2A5, the 2A6, the M1A2, the Type 90s, the 2A7V also had threads dedicated to itself when it was by far the most dominant vehicle at top tier, Puma had a thread of its own, so did the M3A3.
Now, what did all of these get? Nerfs.
What have the BMPT/LMUR/Pantsir/SM-SV/38MT not gotten? Nerfs.
I wonder why RU threads are so much more prevelant then, maybe cause their gamebreaking hand-outs/issues last vastly longer.
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Oh look, you found me expressing my thoughts a week after BMPT was added, must be that I’ve retained that thought till this day, right ?
Thanks for supporting my point lol.
I never expected you to be so kind but you never know these days.
Oh look, that’s me admitting BMPT was dominant back at 10.3 and totally agreeing with it going to 11.3.
It’s also me admitting BMPT is still strong at 11.3 which is why it’s moving up to 11.7 without me objecting anything lol.
It’s also me saying that premium BMPT is nicely balanced at 11.7, considering it’s stats are far from intimidating.
Dominant vehicles have crazy stats which makes their BR skyrocket very quickly.
Strong vehicles have good stats which could make them go up in BR a bit.
Although, I’m sorry for not entertaining your delusional ideas that are based on a whim.
Searched through the forum for topics regarding 2A7V and best I could find were threads with ID 56810 and 58302, with former being much more popular. The most liked comments in there basically were in line of: “well, deal with it”.
So when 2A7V was, by your own admission, by far the most dominant vehicle it got very limited attention with massively conflicting views.
Or this forum is inherently biased towards the west due to it being a mostly west-oriented place to moan ?
Loads of western vehicles will fly under the radar for months and years, while every single USSR addition for which it isn’t glaringly obvious it’s DOA will be talked about and discussed like it’s second coming of Jesus.
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I found you defending it by bringing up other just as OP vehicles, can’t even remember your own words?
Oh look, that’s me admitting BMPT was dominant back at 10.3 and totally agreeing with it going to 11.3.
“If BMPTs at 11.3 were indeed so dominant”
The same laddie that seemingly said he’s apparently fine with them moving to 12.0 now, after weeks of getting demolished by people in the BMPT threads, of course.
Oh look, that’s me admitting BMPT was dominant back at 10.3 and totally agreeing with it going to 11.3.
“They don’t look really indimidating”
Downplaying much? :)
Searched through the forum for topics regarding 2A7V and best I could find were threads with ID 56810 and 58302, with former being much more popular. The most liked comments in there basically were in line of: “well, deal with it” .
I found a bunch, it was usually grouped with the 122B+ on top.
So when 2A7V was, by your own admission, by far the most dominant vehicle it got very limited attention with massively conflicting views.
Funnily, I was there for it, so I know it didn’t get “very limited attention” lol.
Or this forum is inherently biased towards the west due to it being a mostly west-oriented place to moan ?
Thank you for your opinion, it’s wrong.
Loads of western vehicles will fly under the radar for months and years, while every single USSR addition for which it isn’t glaringly obvious it’s DOA will be talked about and discussed like it’s second coming of Jesus.
Nobody is trying to claim non-OP vehicles are somehow OP, in other news, cars found crossing a bridge.
Su-27/SM were not really talked about, Tunguska was to a degree back on the old forum, when it could see through time itself and lock targets through the ground, T-80B/U and a bunch of others aren’t being talked about as OP either, and they’re not DOA either - BVM is sometimes brought up from what I can see, but i feel it’s PTSD from its days of dominance back in 2021 & 22.
On the other hand, the vehicles/addition that are genuinely broken/OP, are talked about - THAT’S LOGICAL (maybe not to you). Mi-28NM w/LMURs, LDIRCM (across the board), BMPT(s), SM-SV, the Kh-38MTs which ruined ground RB just as much as many other things, if not more.
We had SLM threads before LDIRCM helis made it irrelevant, for example, it didn’t fly under the radar. T58 (which you really liked bringing up every time you were defending the BMPT) didn’t either, TURM III had its fair share.
I don’t play air much so I can’t speak for how “West” vs “East” is exactly performing there currently, but Rafale for one was VERY TALKED ABOUT, so was the EFT, so were the F-16s, F-15E, the GR.7, even Tornado’s w/LGBs were a pretty common topic before Pantsir made them redundant (well it was mostly rusmains complaining about them tho).
So, I don’t think you, of all people, should be bringing up “biases”.
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That’s not defending it, that’s just exposing some double standards in this community.
Even in the thread you’re taking screenshots from I’ve said it’s a good thing they moved to 11.7 and that TT one could go to 12.0 if needed. Not my fault you forgot about that one because you were too busy raging, considering I haven’t really agreed with your delusional idea.
How am I downplaying anything by just describing one of my first encounters against it, like a week after it’s release ?
Seems like someone is grasping at straws and need to use people’s first impression posts as some sort of a gotcha moment lol.
So what thread was bigger than ID 56810 ?
The only one I found is 68716 and haven’t seen rivers of tears about them either.
Yeah I saw you there playing it off.
I mean you can believe whatever you want, not my issue.
Just saying that this forum is mostly for western, English speaking players and people are easily biased towards their own country. Nothing to be seen here, am I right ?
I’ve seen a lot of threads about vehicles like Object 775, BUK or the new BTR where they were praised as divine creatures ready to took over their BRs while being “totally untouchable”.
What ?
Su-27 was the subject of so many moan threads due to the so called “27ER dominance in the day and age of 100m MP height”, all the while Gripen was flying under the radar just clubbing everyone in furballs.
27ER fearmongering was probably one of the most common things you’d find on the forum back then.
Considering not one but two 122s existed at the time of BVM’s addition really puts a question mark over that whole dominance. But I guess forum has to complain about something.
Most of the SLM whine threads ended up with 10-15 replies and died two days later.
Considering the crazy numbers it was pushing out, T58 definitely hasn’t got enough “credit” for that. It even received several “defend” threads along the way.
It got moved up in BR recently but it’s still doing better numbers than Terminators of the World, which is a fun little story.
As for Turm III, in the past several years there were like 5-10 threads about it (mostly dead after 20 replies) while being the undisputed king of it’s BR for years. What I found to be funny is how T-72B3 Arena received similar amounts of attention in the month around it’s release as Turm III did in literal years.
This forum simply isn’t that keen to go on months long screeching runs about western vehicles, even if situation is right.
Sorry that I’ve burst your bubble of believing this forum is some sacred place of utter knowledge and understanding, where balance and fairness are the only things that matter while those pesky “rusmains” are plaguing it with their biases. Riding your high horse per usual, I guess therapy is taking it’s toll.
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