I’d like to piggyback off @T3ddy4’s point that “If they are too fake for some people, they are too fake for everyone”.
Had they never been added in the first place, I wouldn’t ask for their addition nor expect it. But they’ve been part of the game for around half its life with little issue and removing them outright for anyone who joined in the game’s latter half strikes me as unwarranted.
I understand your point of them being too ahistorical to add, but I believe making once widely-available tech tree vehicles completely unobtainable in any form is far too drastic. In my opinion, making them recurring event vehicles would be a comfortable halfway point between removal and leaving them in the tech tree.
I want to say that tastes and favourite vehicles change. When I started playing my only interest was American air, I didn’t care a fig about German tanks. But had I known they were being removed, I would certainly have gone up the tree to ‘reserve’ them for future me in case I ever developed an interest in them. I’m working my way up the Japanese air tree now for that very reason.
It should, considering the Zerstorer (likely butchered that) has four barrels of full HVAP and is a better antitank platform by a large margin while still being decent enough as an AA.
I don’t agree since a BR gap of 1 (3 steps) is not that jarring. I also don’t see the necessity of needing a vehicle at every possible BR. As long as enough vehicles can adequately cover a BR range, I feel like that is sufficient. This is why the Kugel needs to move down. The linup that it would support right now would cause efficacy issues.
They were added so that Germany could have competitive tanks of what was top tier at the time. No more, no less. They were known fabrications from the start, but forgiven since they were at the time needed.
As I had responded to another here, they should have been outright removed from inventory as well. I couldn’t care less about their exclusivity, they are not required. I feel the same about all vehicles that fall under this, like the F-16AJ, Ho-Ri Production, and R2Y2s when adequate replacements are available. I’m less critical about minor ahistorical issues, such as the Sturmtiger reload speed or Yak-141 equipment load discrepancy. My stance is firmly against completely ahistorical vehicles as an entity.
So, in essence, FOMO. Something that I despise as a business practice but can’t really do anything about. For those wanting to at least drive them around, using the wiki to load up otherwise hidden vehicles can help scratch that itch in a test drive.
You are correct, right now it is 7.0 and needs to be moved down.
A very subjective opinion and something I heavily disagree with. The Corelian has both worse AT capability and arguably worse AA capability due to turret rotation and shell speed. All it has going for it is a Panther hull. It’s a fantastic vehicle (for the waste bin).
Sorry, but I think no vehicle belongs in the bin. I spaded the french conehead Tank with its atrocious low caliber APCR round and wouldn’t want to miss it, I thought I would never get the Churchill AVRE Petard to work for me, but I have found myself plowing right into the enemy spawn with it and having a blast.
Just because a vehicle is not to your liking (maybe there is also a skill issue at play) doesn’t mean it belongs in the bin for everyone.
I beg to differ. As far as I know, the Chinese PT-76 underwent testing but was rejected in favour of other projects. (And I’m parroting a five-minute Google search here, so I’m open to correction.)
This seems similar to the Kungstiger, which went from undergoing trials to being a range target. If that gives it grounds to exist in the game, I think the same can go for the PT-76.
They are actually slightly different vehicles, though. Heck, if I can be slightly pedantic for the fun of it - maybe there are people out there whose favourite vehicle is the early model unstabilised PT-76 with the multi-slotted muzzle brake!
I imagine the guns are devastating, but it’s one of the least protected vehicles in the game. Anti-tanking on the front lines leaves you susceptible to stray arty strikes and MG rounds of any calibre.
I believe it’s enough to make adding a lineup in the middle something to be considered.
We can agree to disagree on this note. I respect your opinion on wanting a completely historical game without a player divide (removed for one, removed for all), even if I personally see little harm in having ‘cool’ vehicles that are at least somewhat grounded in reality.
If only that were possible. You can preview them from the wiki or your wishlist, but you sadly can’t test drive them because they’re technically unresearchable tech tree vehicles. I’d like to see someone create a user mission for them, I assume that’s the only way we’ll get a taste of what they’re like.
The Coelian’s turret traverse is 51°/s with an ace crew, which is on par to the degree with most of its contemporaries and certainly very capable of tracking aircraft. It is less than the Kugelblitz with its 60°/s (which excels in that area, being second only to the Skink), but I highly doubt you’ll find a situation where the extra 9°/s makes all the difference.
As for shell speed, the Kugel’s HE shells have a muzzle velocity of 920 m/s. The Coelian’s HE shells have a velocity of 914 m/s. Perhaps you’ve been running the slower stock belt?
Regardless of performance, not being the ‘best’ vehicle shouldn’t mean it’s excluded from the game. I agree with richthofen in saying that no tank belongs in the bin, and I’m sure many players’ favourite vehicles are unconventional ones. My second-most played vehicle is the FV4005, hardly the most competitive tank at its BR.
It doesnt tell me who rejected it, you just have to message any of the suggestion moderators to find out why
It doesnt show in the profile until it gets accepted, it only appears for me under the pending tab, though the resubmission was rejected earlier today anyway so now i am waiting for a response on why.
Unless Gaijin has changed it recently, the Ground Forces Tutorial give you the Panther II for the duration of the mission. But it is locked to Arcade Mode and very limited.
Which once again baffles me, the Panther II is oh so fake to Gaijin and cannot be allowed to be enjoyed by everyone, but it is acceptable enough to teach new players the Game? Not very (new) player friendly when Gaijin lies to them in the Tutorial…
That turret is also its weakness. While admittedly not as vulnerable to aircraft compared to the Kugel, it’s a larger and easier target to hit for ground vehicles. Compound with its issues with targeting and lackluster performance against ground vehicles, it becomes quite obvious why this tank sits lower than the Kugel.
It was owned as China immediately made their copy of it (classic). Considering the shift of what is being allowed, it seems I am too harsh here as it does fall into line with a nation at least owning said vehicle.
I can’t argue against this because it’s absolutely true for any historical vehicle.
Right, the major drawback is crew exposure. But even despite that it was a fun AA to use at its bracket since it was quite reliable at destroying nearly any vehicle it comes across. I wanted to point out that the Kugel should get more HVAP, at least half of its belt if nothing else.
I’m saying there doesn’t need to be. When it comes to ground, Germany has most BRs pretty well covered. For air, they do have a capability gap just above that BR for jet fighters.
Fair. I can’t force an opinion.
If I could bother to learn to use the mission editor better, it’s possible. I’ll have to check for myself, but I was able to test drive vehicles after loading them in such as the UAVs, although they are “premium”.
I use the HVAP, obviously. Volume of fire also greatly assists the Kugel.
Just look at Gaijin’s hypocrisy, we are not allowed to obtain any vehicle of the German Trinity but for the Tutorial that can be accessed by EVERYONE at literally ANY TIME the Panther II is fine? Decide, Gaijin. All or nobody. And you stated that you won’t remove content from player accounts, so…
Not having played the Zerstörer, I’ll take your word for it.
Here’s to hoping that gets filled in soon.
On the topic of jets: if you want to fly the Schwalbe, Jabo or Horton 229 without uptiering them, the only tanks that fit their BR are the Panther II and Tiger II 105 (not counting the Kugelblitz, which we’ve agreed is overtiered). All in all, I think that makes for a well-rounded lineup.
Keep me posted if you ever do, I’d love to check them out.
Just to clarify, do you mean against tanks? I assumed we were talking about performance versus planes, as muzzle velocity means a lot more when leading an aircraft compared to engaging something on the ground. And at a distance where muzzle velocity does start to play a role, 3/4 of your belt hits the dirt due to travelling 160 m/s slower than the single HVAP shell.
As @PercussionCap mentioned, not having to reload is quite a boon. I’ve been revisiting the Kugelblitz partly for the sake of this discussion, and having a 10 second reload (with an ace crew, which most don’t have) is a significant downside when fighting both planes and tanks.
I came across a post on Reddit where the poster had obtained test drives of the three vehicles. Are non-content creators eligible for this under any circumstances?
I am not sure about this, what if it is a Photoshop? Because I remember that CC’s said that Gaijin is very stingy with the German Trinity and does not even make them aviable as Test Drive. But do not ask me about any exact sources. So far every Content Creator I know had those vehicles obtained before the blockade.
It is quite easy to Photoshop War Thunder content:
I was dubious too, being under the same impression that Gaijin wouldn’t be willing to give test drives for these three. So I followed him up on his post, he said they did indeed grant him the test drives on request for being in the CC partnership program. Here’s the discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/1fbig2a/completely_normal_lineup/
If you head to his channel (which seems pretty decent for a budding YouTuber), he has published a short video on the Panther II. So it’s not hogwash, as far as I can see. https://www.youtube.com/@BarrytheBT-5/videos
By the way, where did that photoshopped news announcement come from?
