Spitfire IX fight bf109k4, 100% win rate
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Time to make a big effortpost to get ignored 😎
Game mode for all of these is ground realistic only, though I imagine most of these would transfer to ground arcade. I’m focusing on WW2-era ground RB.
tl;dr is buff rank I and II Italian medium tanks, nerf various rank II vehicles that are too strong, nerfing certain SPGs, and addressing a few other problematic vehicles.
Vehicle: M13/40 (all types), M14/41
BR Change: 1.7, 2.0 → 1.3 all
Reason: These tanks are practically the same as a T-26, but trading much of its penetration for gun depression and some armor. The armor, while good hulldown, is otherwise not particularly impressive and the mobility is quite poor as well. With their weak guns, they struggle against tanks of the same BR and are hopeless when uptiered. Even here, they will be mostly outclassed by the Pz. III F, only holding an edge in their superior turret layout.
Vehicle: M15/42, M14/41 (47/40)
BR Change: 2.7, 2.3 → 2.0 all
Reason: Totally outclassed by their peers and struggle massively in uptiers. These suffer from the same issues as their earlier counterparts, but with only marginally improved penetration and mobility. Realistically, the extra 50mm thick frontal patch on the M15/42 does nothing to make it tougher. They compare very unfavorably to other tanks at 2.3 and 2.7 like the Pz. III J, Chi-Ha Kai, and T-50 with firepower, mobility, and armor.
Vehicle: C13 T90
BR Change: No Change
Reason: This is just a fat AUBL/74 that doesn’t get shredded by .50 fire to the hull (but still has the 8mm thick turret). It is already unpopular as it is; please leave it alone.
Vehicle: T-34 (1940)
BR Change: 3.3 → 3.7
Reason: This tank is a monster, combining excellent mobility with very strong armor and firepower. The only real weakness is its penetration, though the tank gives you the tools to make it work. The KV-1E at 4.3 already works great with effectively the same gun.
Vehicle: Chi-Nu II
BR Change: 4.3 → 4.0
Reason: Basically just a late model Pz IV with even less armor and uncapped APHE, but you get a lot more explosive filler. It being higher than a Pz IV is fine I guess, but 4.3 is too much.
Vehicle: Chi-Ri
BR Change: 5.7 → 5.0
Reason: Sure, you have an autoloader, but it’s not meaningfully quicker than other 75mm guns at this BR and you are also the size of a barn. Especially with the uncapped ammo, this is a free kill for most 6.7 tanks and is currently massively overrated in BR.
Vehicle: Pvkv IV
BR Change: 3.0 → 2.3
Reason: Mediocre mobility, mediocre gun, pathetic armor, horrible turret traverse speed. This tank will struggle regardless of what BR at is at, but at 2.3 it will at least not constantly struggle to penetrate enemy vehicles and can play a proper sniper role.
Vehicle: Sherman III/IV
BR Change: 3.7 → 4.0
Reason: It has the best Sherman hull and engine, yet sits at the same BR as the slower M4 and M4A4s. While BR 2.7 tanks still have a chance against the M4 and M4A4 with their numerous frontal weakspots, they have no real options against a Sherman III/IV. It is much more comparable to the M4A2, but sacrificing the addon armor and .50 for a higher horsepower engine and wet ammo stowage.
Vehicle: VIDAR
BR Change: 8.0 → 8.3
Reason: Parity with suggested PzH 2000 change
Vehicle: AMX-13 (FL11)
BR Change: 4.3 → 4.0
Reason: This tank has no business being at 4.3. It is a sidegrade to the Chaffee, not an upgrade. It has better h.p./ton to enable flanking and scouting, but lacks the reverse speed, gun depression, .50, and stabilizer for skirmishes and knife-fighting. The AMX-13 hull with the chaffee’s flexible turret sits at 3.7 just fine already.
Vehicle: AMX-13-M24
BR Change: 3.7 → 4.0
Reason: To maintain parity with the suggested AMX-13 (FL11) and M24 changes.
Vehicle: E.B.R. (1951)
BR Change: 5.3 → 4.7
Reason: This vehicle would be a menace if it were too low of BR thanks to its excellent forward and reverse speed, but it is currently too high for such an anemic gun on such a weak and unstable platform. Its gun is still poor by 4.7 standards, but will be more usable.
Vehicle: AMX-50 (TO90/930)
BR Change: 8.0 → 7.7
Reason: This is just a slower and larger Char 25t without scouting but still at the same BR. While the frontal hull can still bounce cannon fire, the turret is the same as the Char 25t’s, so you can never truly rely on your armor ever. Dropping this to 7.7 would give you a reason to pick it over the Char 25t and it would fit in nicely with the existing 7.7 France lineup.
Vehicle: PzH 2000
BR Change: 7.7 → 8.3
Reason: An oppressive menace with its blistering rate of fire, massive damage, high shell velocity, and LRF. Fighting this in slow lumbering WW2 vehicles just isn’t fun and it has all the tools it needs to do fine in higher BRs. The 5 second reload is often too fast for those tanks to work around.
Vehicle: Turm III
BR Change: 8.3 → 8.7
Reason: The combination of extreme mobility, full stabilizer, fast autoloader, good gun depression, and powerful 30mm coax brutalize the lower BR tanks it sees and gives it the tools to compete fine if raised slightly in BR.
Vehicle: T18E2
BR Change: 3.0 → 3.3 or 3.7 (depending on M24 BR)
Reason: The combination of armor, good turret, good reverse, and rapid fire cannon make this brutal against low tier tanks, though its poor h.p./ton and accuracy mean it should not be placed at too high of a BR either. Higher than it currently sits but lower than a Chaffee would be appropriate.
Vehicle: T25
BR Change: 6.3 → 6.0
Reason: Decent gun and reverse speed, but mediocre otherwise. It would be more appropriate at 6.0 alongside the M4/T26 with its stronger turret. This would give space for the M26 Pershing to move down too.
Vehicle: M26, M26A1 (all nations)
BR Change: 6.7 → 6.3
Reason: While the 90mm is good, it struggles frontally vs many other 6.7 vehicles while also struggling to flank like a medium either due to its heavy-like mobility. It does not belong at the same BR as the T26E1-1, M26E1, and T26E5 that have the armor or firepower to compete at 6.7.
Vehicle: AS90
BR Change: 7.0 → 8.0
Reason: Same deal as the PzH 2000, but without a LRF and a little more squishy.
Vehicle: M24 Chaffee (all nations)
BR Change: 3.7 → 4.0
Reason: A godly tank with decent size, a .50, decent mobility, a stabilizer, a good gun, and a good reverse speed. This tank is incredibly versatile. While perhaps not necessarily overpowered, bringing this up in BR would help decompress lower tiers without having too much impact on how effective this tank itself is.
Vehicle: M4A3 (105) (all nations)
BR Change: 3.0 → 3.3
Reason: Great armor and mobility with good firepower and no real frontal weakspots. It would still be very effective at 3.3, but the smaller tanks would have more of a fighting chance now.
Vehicle: M44 (all nations)
BR Change: 4.0 → 4.7
Reason: Extreme mobility and firepower make this a real menace that totally outclasses the M55 it shares a BR with.
Some other artillery like the Type 99 and PLZ05 probably could go up in BR slightly as well, but my post here is long enough.
12 Likes
Holy moly, I just noticed something. Gaijin thinks the Tornado GR4/SLE are equal in performance to the Mirage 2000 C-S5. They really didnt think these BR changes through at all
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It certainly doesn’t deserve 9.7.
One Vehicle Per Post, not an entire SA.
It gets ignored because you are ignoring the posting rules stated in the OP.
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each BR suggestion needs to be listed individually. You can’t dump em all in one comment.
The date they are made is irrelevant for balance. All that matters is how they perform. If the date they were made mattered that much for balance than the concept 3 would be moved from 4.7 all the way up to 10.7 since it was made in the late 70s even after the m1 went into service, and having that 70s vehicle fight ww2 vehicles is so unfair according to you.
Rwr is kind of meaningless at this rating and while 2 missiles is an upgrade it fits 9.3 more than 9.7 to me at least
(Repost because I accidentally deleted the original post)
Vehicle: G.55S, G.55 Serie 1
Gamemode: Air RB
BR: 5.3 → 5.0
Reason: At 5.0, where these planes are currently located, their flight performance is already somewhat below average. In fact, they have slightly worse performance than the 4.3 G.55 sottoserie 0, which at its current BR isn’t exactly OP. Yak-3P, a 5.0 fighter with 3 20 mm cannons (comparable armament to upgunned G.55 models), is better than those planes in top speed, climb and turn rate at ARB-relevant altitudes. Furthermore, being moved to 5.3 would allow G.55 to face planes such as P-51H, which enjoys an advantage in top speed of 150 and 130 kph at sea level and 5000 meters respectively, as well as 40% (!) higher power-to-weight ratio and almost 2 deg/s better sustained turn rate. Such a matchup would be hilariously one-sided, so I propose refraining from increasing G.55’s BR.
5 Likes
It only lasts that short of an amount of time if you sit at 100% throttle all the time, and that is not how you are supposed to use rocket planes.
It does it completely stomps in full down tiers
While its a common theme in top tier this one is worse
You are faster than everything else good gun and 4 missiles
So there is noting 8.3 can do besides waiting for mistakes
Ima be honest, ALL the Mach 2 capable fighters (F-104, F-106, Mig-21) should move up to 9.7 minimum. Trying to fight them with 8.3 aircraft is pointless.
Ok if comparing it to the best prop in the game and its 6.3 BR is the wrong way to go about it…
We are left with global stats. Which means the yak15 and yak17 and bi all have better than the spitfire. So any reason at all you got that justifies it going to 7.0 to fight in the 7.0- 8.0 hole while the yaks are chilling?
I dont even fly it that much but its one of the only props I jump back in here and there. Not anymore. Another easy to see pattern of fun detected vs minor nations to protect the cash cows is where the logic goes
Looking at the mk 22s terrible stats then it should be going to 6.3… it wont. Cant remember any GB vics going down in the year iv played. Plenty of nerfs though OFC
Taking it up 0.3 BR’s but not fixing any of the core issues
I was aware you guys were ignoring it but damn
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Where in the OP does it say that? I know an older thread like this that I replied to had that rule, but I do not see it listed now.
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Wtf, why are the zeros nerfed, they suck balls
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F104a only has two aim9b so less than some 8.3
Also no rwr and flares would completely kill it in an uptier given it would also lose its only advantage which is speed
Mode: Air Simulator
Aircraft: Mirage 2000C-S4
Change: 12.3->12.0
Reasoning: The generally low missile count of 2 Radar missiles and 2 IR guided ones combined with the 16 Flares and 18 Chaff make this plane extremely difficult to play as at 12.3 you only see uptiers to at least 12.7 and when going up against ARH slingers (F-14A, F-14A IRIAF) the dumping of chaff to fool the missiles is impossible as you would run out of chaff before leaving the square of the Airfield. At 12.0 the plane would still face the Tomcats in certain brackets but they are not included in the “best case scenario” brackets.
4 Likes
When I say 1980s, I don’t just mean date of production. I mean a vehicle made with 1980s technology, to 1980s standards. This should be obvious to anyone with any meaningful understanding of human communication.
1980s IRCCM SAMs produce by global powers have absolutely 0 business facing WW2 and Korean war planes.
No, not even in the slightest. F-104s are just slightly annoying misquitos now.
Absolute shit turn
meh, it’s alright. Even if it was the best gun, that wouldn’t make much of a difference.
Four 9Bs, exact same as some 8.3s.
That’s how all A2A combat works. Whoever messes up first loses
Aircraft: Bf-109 F-1 and F-2
Mode: Air RB
BR: F-1 2.7 → 3.0
F-2 3.0 → 3.3
Reason:
the airframe and engine are way to strong for its br
2 Likes