TLDR: Add an option like the “Join already active battles” toggle that prioritizes the old style historical matchmaking in Realistic for low-mid Rank/BR vehicles.
Obviously there is a love/hate debate over the old style of historical team matchmaking in RB, but hear me out on this one: As someone who prefers playing in the WWII era vehicles (under 7.0BR) I really miss the historical matchmaking and the subsequent gameplay aspect/team strategy of playing to the strengths/weaknesses of the opposing teams vehicles. Apart from the very rare matches like Air RB USA v Japan in the Pacific, every game is mixed. This has lead to RB feeling much more arcady, less teamwork, and more reliance on vehicle metagaming. I know Sim is there, which is fun at times, but I much prefer that middle ground RB used to provide.
I suggest adding an option like the “Join already active battles” toggle that prioritizes historical matchmaking like it used to be. Thus the players who want the historical team matchmaking back and are willing to wait longer for a game can do so at will. This may also be better/easier implemented if there’s a BR or Tier cutoff at which it would no longer have an effect, for obvious reasons.
Although i like the idea you might consider to rephrase your suggestion as imho there is a need to clarify some terminologies:
Historical MM: Vehicles that actually fought each other like in WW 2
Semi-historical MM: Basically the old “axis vs allies” world
Mixed MM: Certain nations are in both teams
Your proposal looks like option #2, so in order to avoid confusion, it looks like you should clarify this.
On top of that:
Your statement (=quote) is technically seen not correct, as matches on Pacific maps are always JP vs US/UK. Depending on daytime and server (=very few players) the MM is still creating axis vs allies lobbies - so in very small lobbies (like 6 vs 6) you have GER & IT fighting US & UK. The whole Ju 288 “black hole” issue is & was based on this…
It’s basically air sim style lobbies rather than BR changes.
So axis vs allies, axis vs commies, the like. Sweden is prolly gonna cause confusion/controversy since finland is axis, sweden is neutral. Idk how to deal with israel.
If this might mean more frequent appearances of pacific carrier maps, I’m down. I came back hoping to do carrier landings and stuff fighting zeros, not what ARB currently is.
I would definitely like to see the historical match making, but only up until the end of WW2. Afterwards having historical match ups does not make sense, since we can then have completely lopsided games favoring one side vs another.
Post WW2, there is no real major conflict that can generate the same level of game play as WW2 has done.
Mhm - i am not sure if you have considered the workload for gaijin of an actual historical MM (see differences here).
A few things to think about:
Instead of BRs you would have to create time frames. Like dividing a year into quarters as certain aircraft appeared only at specific times. So at least in theory a LW prop might have fought vs a Meteor FMk 3 above the Netherlands in the last 5 months in Europe. Spits Mk 22 would face Me 262s, 109 K-4s & G-10s and Fw 190 Ds. JP pilots would be allowed to use the Ki-100 just from mid 45…
A hell of non German props at WW 2 BRs are actually post war stuff - so no Hornets, F2Gs, Spit Mk 24s,Wyverns, Yak-3Us, etc.- whilst others saw service, but no combat like P-51 D-30s, Bearcats, etc - and others like the YP-80A or the Tigercat saw very limited use as photo recon aircraft. You have to determine which shall be allowed and which not.
Certain nations like Sweden (excluding Finland) and Israel would be out.
Finland itself was forced/encouraged to fight the Germans (Lapland War) from September 44 to April 45. So in this time frame they had to fight exclusively German aircraft.
A large bunch of French aircraft were bought after the war - same as with Chinese aircraft whilst they used also most of captured JP aircraft just after the war. Chinese aircraft would have to face exclusively JP aircraft whilst USSR aircraft would face before August 45 exclusively German and Finish (until September 44) aircraft.
Italian planes would have be split up in 1943 in planes used by the Royalist ACI air force (=allies) and the RSI air force (=axis) and you have to determine who had which aircraft.
Just with these few topics you might agree that a “real” historical MM would produce a hell of workload for gaijin.
Besides that the whole game play set up would need an overhaul as the conceptual disadvantages of certain nations (US: Lack of good climb, bad turners) or the USSR (lack of high alt performance, slow dive speeds) would increase.
As long as gaijin would not offer asymmetric lobbies (with number advantage for allies) there are imho way too large technological gaps between some nations.
If you acknowledge that the US and USSR players are cash cows as they dominate top tier (and buy premiums) it seems very unlikely that gaijin would nerf their way through the prop ranks with an implementation of such a mode.
On the other hand the large amount of undertiered and/or post WW2 non-German prop fighters at WW 2 BRs just reflects the massive hand holding for certain nations in order to earn money with their player base and to avoid costs for updating the outdated game play for Air RB.
A semi-historical MM (basically just axis vs allies with current BRs and game play) looks way more realistic to implement.
The things that I don’t really like is the addition of artillery, heat firing vehicles and atgms vs ww2 tanks. The points you have mentioned above are accurate and you hit a point about the major tech differnces among nations. This is why you have br brackets as you have mentioned.
The Ratels, all the M109s, E.B.Rs, Akatsia and so on, are the ones I don’t want to see vs ww2 tanks. In my opnion war thunder should never have added them to the game since they don’t fit anywhere, too underpowered at higher br, yet they cause too much chaos at lower brs. They are easy to get ride of but they mess ww2 tanks badly.
Historical was bad every time it was attempted. IT doesn’t play well and almost noone wanted to play it and that was when there were good rewards for doing it
I think a lot of people are mistaking this for the shoddy sherman vs tiger 2 suggestion, which is not what it is. Probably the reason for so many No:s, people don’t even read the suggestion.
The allies vs axis matchmaking should come back. Hopefully in one way or another. I really enjoy those matches more when they rarely happen with the slight immersion it adds.
To get around the party que issue they could just fair squads up against each other. For example if you had a squad with a USSR and German player, then they both go to separate teams. If that’s not enough there could be an alternate history mode like in airRB it just affects the nations that fight with each other.