Cool story, you must have forgot the context. They are powerful for the F-4s in Warthunder. The thing I was discussing wasn’t the real versions at all.
So having 4 Aim9s of various models (P/J/H) on the F-4s and two on the F-5E isn’t good enough? Let alone the aircraft with Aim9Ds and Aim9Es. There are plenty of options.
As already stated, the issue with giving lower BR jets AIM-9L (or near equivalent) missile would be to radically alter their balance. They’d need to go up. The F-5E might survive such a BR increase, since it’s already very strong at it’s BR, but the F-4E likely would not. The flight performance is only OK at 11.0, push it higher and you’re ending up in F-4EJ Kai territory, where the second something gets on your six you might as well just J out, because you aren’t winning that dogfight. The F-4J might do a bit better since it at least has a PD radar and AIM-7Fs, but still, you’d be putting it up against an objectively superior EJ Kai at 11.7, and even that isn’t doing great due to the aforementioned flight performance issues.
All aspect missiles aren’t everything anyways, just being able to get a front aspect shot means nothing when any enemy with the slightest bit of spatial awareness can just one flare it. The biggest advantages the AIM-9L brings are it’s superior rear and side aspect performances, combining better range, better pull and moderate flare resistance. It being all aspect is honestly the least of it’s advantages.
The point was that all implemented US F-4s can be armed as needed to fit their BR without producing issues as a move upward allows for more variants to be implemented with similar characteristics, at the old BR. Further this can be supplemented with changes to available ordnance to fit, and lacking performance can be supplemented with advanced ordnance or as CAS / SEAD role where appropriate.
The F-4B & F-4D are missing entirely so there’s no early F-4 with CMs.
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So now you cherrypick a quote and then try to make it reference something else? Also, I don’t really care about your point just like you didn’t care about my point when you quoted me to make that point. I have not been, nor do I wish to discuss things not in the game, otherwise I would have started there.
Well, UK doesn’t get a non-CAS jet with all aspect missiles except for the Gripen at 12.7.
They have three of the worst phantoms in the game, having the worst IR missile at 11.3 and one of the worst SARH.
Tornado F.3 is also 11.3 with 9Ls, but has a flight model worse than most CAS.
US isn’t alone in suffering.
Why was I replied to this?
Sorry, the app must have pulled you over from another reply. The forum app gets weird. Again, sorry about that.
Np, all good.
Simply untrue, both platforms did armed and used Aim-9L’s in real life.
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If consider the A-10/A6 result as fighter,… then you have one below everyone else.
Also 9L is far more superior missile than R60M or R60MK which is an Export R60M.
Every aircrafts lower in BR to use MAGIC-2 or 9L have terrible flight characteristics aswell.
US variants of F-5E or F-4E never recieved 9L/9P-4 and later, AFAIK.
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In different countries than USA, not in USA.
Same problem than F-5C flares,…
The F-4E did.
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Didn’t knew,… anyway : 9L/9P4 means a change of BR too ^^"
So i don’t know what is the best.
Both Us F4’s and F5’s armed All-aspect missiles in their service time which includes Aim9-P4-5 and Aim-9L, you might want to check your source.
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You should probably recheck that.
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(Sad A-7K, A-10a early, and A-10a Late sounds)
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Except the airframes are not the same.
Take Britain. The Sea Harrier FRS1e at 10.3 with 2x Aim-9Ls. Replace the 9Ls with 9Gs. Its now a 9.3 alongside the Harrier Gr3. Its sub-sonic and not the greatest turn fighter in the world. The Tornado F3 might be too low. But it would literally never ever use rear-aspect IR missiles. It doesnt have the flight performance to dogfight anything at its BR. If those were replaced with 9Gs, it would never use them. It would stick with the Skyflash 100% of the time. If it moved up, it would have to recieve Aim-9M.
In fact, every single listed aircraft is vastly inferior to the F-16A, The only aircraft in the game that can actually defeat the F-16A is the Gripen at 12.7 currenntly. and most of those aircraft listed would need a notable BR reduction if they lost all-aspect missiles.
So whilst maybe the US could get an 11.3 with all-aspect IR, it is entirely dependent on whether any of the airframes need all-aspect IR or if a suffeciently weak “fighter” exist to justify it. Adding Aim-9L on a high performing platform for the sake of “fairness” would just result in it moving up significantly in BR.
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I actually have no issue with the F-5C having flares. They just need to increase its engine temp significantly when on reheat and it will be a lot better
We need a total IR/Heat rework.
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Literally every helo in the games gives off a 3rd of its IRL heat relative to heat seekers and IRSTs.
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Literally every IR missile in the game has like half its IRL lock range (R27ET even worse because they didn’t simulate its funky seeker)
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Many missiles are missing partial all-aspect capability
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Velocity is irrelevant to aircraft heat when in reality skin temperature is what most IR missiles past like 1970 were designed to detect
Gaijin pls after yall break the game with ARHs fix the IRs too.
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