Naval mode is finally dead

Game Discussion Arcade Battle
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1698

I don’t report bugs nowadays because I’ve wasted a lot of time on it in the past, and I’m really tired of dealing with bug moderators in this game. I have much better things to do with my life.

In the game, these HEI-T shells have a 3 km auto-destruct range. War Thunder doesn’t use a realistic time-fuzed system, only distance fuzes. It’s unrealistic, but it is what it is.

This means the game ignores the time after firing and only counts the straight-line distance the shell travels. Once it reaches 3 km, the shell simply explodes. In reality, shells use a time-fuze, as tracking distance is too complicated.

Because War Thunder’s devs set the HEI-T shells to self-destruct at exactly 3 km, it’s impossible to hit targets beyond that distance with these shells, regardless of the belt. But the truth is that due to their high drag, I wouldn’t even use them above 2 km. They’re effective against targets 1-1.5 km away, but the farther the distance, the worse they perform - they simply travel too slowly.

I don’t see any videos from you. I just checked, and the default belt works fine in the test drive. In battle, however, it can feel like the belt isn’t working at all for the reasons mentioned above. HEI-T shells are too draggy to hit moving targets even at mid-range (2-3 km), and APDS tracers flying off into space can be confusing as well.

But once you understand the issues with the default belt, it actually works as intended:

Shooting at 2.7 km using HEI-T shells with the default belt.

Shooting at 2.7 km using APDS shells with the default belt.

As you can see, everything works fine. You can see how long it takes for HEI-T shells to reach the target (fortunately, it’s standing still). You can also see how big of a correction I have to make when using the default belt to hit the enemy even at 2.7 km with APDS shells. From what I remember, the correction used to be much smaller with manual aiming, and the tracers were also much more visible back then. Nowadays I probably wouldn’t even try aiming like that in battles.

The thing is, this default belt doesn’t make any sense in the current configuration.

1 Like
1699

You didn’t understand the problem, you can’t adjust range beyond 3km in RB with default belt.

They attached to the issues - one of them

ps. tested some more its 2.3 km+ distance where bugged behavior appearing in AB, on 2.3km- atleast one of the shell types in the default belt land on target.

1700

Because HEI-T shells have a maximum range of 3 km in War Thunder. You can still aim beyond that with APDS shells, using the default belt:

Shooting at 3.2 km using APDS shells with the default belt in Naval Realistic.

Oh, I see. We can’t see attached files in bug reports - only you and the moderators can.

Anyway, it works fine for me. I can easily hit the target with HEI-T shells at 2.1 km:
Shooting at 2.1 km using HEI-T shells with the default belt

BTW, we’re getting way off-topic here. If you have more questions, you can always PM me. For me, everything seems to be working fine - and by ‘fine,’ I mean the shells behave as they should. It’s just that the HEI-T/APDS belt combination doesn’t make any sense.

1 Like
1701

Now move to 2.3, aiming on moving target also breakes on that point like on this video

btw. There never been “topic” here.

1702

I won’t even try aiming at a moving target 2.3 km away, because as I mentioned before, these HEI-T shells are too draggy and it wouldn’t work anyway. Maybe the new automatic aiming system has to make such crazy corrections that it actually stops working - I don’t know. Even with the previous system, these shells were too slow for distances like that. You would want to use APDS shells when shooting at anything moving over 2 km away anyway. And with this automatic system, I can’t easily aim with APDS shells when using the default belt, so I can’t even test it.

HEI-T shells work fine against a stationary vessel at 2.3 km, though:
Shooting at 2.3 km using HEI-T shells with the default belt.

Just forget trying to shoot at moving targets beyond 2 km with HEI-T shells.

EDIT: Ok, I checked it (my curiosity got the better of me), and it seems the automatic aiming system just turns off when the correction it needs to make exceeds a certain distance. Maybe it realizes the target is basically impossible to hit with these shells, so it stops controlling the guns automatically. The problem is, you also can’t aim manually like in the previous system, because for some reason my camera keeps jumping up and down whenever my mouse isn’t directly on or close to the target. It didn’t behave like this before, so I guess it’s now impossible to try manually hitting the target in this situation. I can’t even try hitting the target with APDS shells (still with the default belt of course) because my camera keeps moving like crazy. This new aiming system and the fact that you can’t control your guns manually is so annoying - I’m really glad I stopped playing Naval.

2 Likes
1703

You still here encouraging spam? Not surprised.
Imagine heeding ones own advice:

Lies.
The topic is clear as day:
image
Your continued misleading of people in these forums is also not surprising.
But it is an eye sore.
If only you played the game as much as you played the forums (45 battles last week slow down!),
Things would be different for sure.
No wonder NAB is dead.

1705

the tracers from your shells are also client side and are inaccurate :)
gets really silly when you play speedboats and see your tracers trail behind enemies while still somehow hitting them

clearly not enough premium packs tovsrisch))) have a tirpitz for mere 90 american roubles)))

2 Likes
1706

It’s not enough that I have to put up with constant uptiers and losing streaks that sometime last for weeks. Now I get more uneven BR matches, sometimes a few in a day… and I don’t play that much anymore. Full load of enemies with highest BR while our team has NONE or just 1. One team top BR heavy while my team lowest BR in match heavy. Nothing makes sense in this game anymore. I lost count of how many matches one bloodthirsty team wiped out mine made out of sheep and window lickers. I also lost count of how many times I was alone in the middle of the game near two cap zones while my team kept spawning with destroyers in the cruiser spawn in the far corner of the map. I also lost count how many times I killed as many or more enemies than my entire team. How about times when my shells do no damage while I get obliterated by some lower BR enemy? Something does not add up here.

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5 Likes
1707

I’m running on premium time fumes. 2 more days left from the 10 I got from the last BP. My premium time has run out in June or so. Not buying any more and doing very little just to get by with the last and this BP. The 10 from this BP will probably activate for the next Naval event. After the Holidays, with the next BP, there is a very little chance that I will do it. If they add submarines, that will be yet another reason for me to stop playing. Not interested in this when teams are small as they are now. If you have 4 players on each team and 2-3 start with submarines, good luck facing enemies all by yourself. It will take them years to figure out what to do with some “proper” gameplay. No more being a Guinea pig and paying for it.

1 Like
1708

Do you even saw replay from enemy perspective he got you right in to ammo stowage. Primauguet is interwar ship almost without any armor - so very fragile. What you expected?

There is no destroyer spawn on South Kvarken encounter map.

Maybe cause you don’t understand clearly why that happening and how damage system works?

1709

That’s probably from these loadouts that have different shells with different velocities. The faster ones will hit the target while the slower ones fall behind later. Everything in this game is FUBAR now. As a result I get less income and it’s harder to complete specific tasks. Even half a year later, when they started screwing up everything in this wave, the tasks are still way too grindy for the rewards that we are getting. At this point, the BP should be free (you can still pay to get the extra levels). The rewards are just not worth the effort.

1 Like
1712

how do you even play this game mode, I spawn in a destroyer and get killed in spawn by a cruiser in his own spawn point. what am I supposed to do? this was Arcade and every time I spawned in the same guy killed me in spawn from his spawn. Just like the rest of the game gaijin is only concerned about pumping out vehicle models and not actually making a game.

2 Likes
1713

I’m going to be blunt: if you’re 11km+ away from most cruisers, you shouldn’t have any difficulty evading the average player’s fire in arcade.

Problem is, most people like to face tank instead of duck, dodging and weaving. I get it; the tracers are sometimes hard to see. There’s a simple fix: the exhaust from your smokestacks makes shells [very] easy to see so you can use it to your advantage to see if incoming fire is directed at you.

Evasion is a mixture of turning, abusing your ship’s listing characteristics and throttle control. Granted, the best solution is to not take fire ever but that’s not realistically possible.

Edit

‘what do you mean listing characteristics?’

When a ship turns, it lists a certain degree. We’ll use HMS Dido as an example; when she hard turns at full speed, she lists almost 45 degrees. This exposes her underside, allowing for a potentially easy ammo detonation. [However], if I hard turn in the opposite direction to force a list towards where I’m about to turn, the game keeps that list well into where I’m actually turning, so shell fire will hit the deck (which likes to send shells to the void for some reason in Dido)

1714

Soyuz remains to be literally the reason why I stopped playing Naval…

And it seems Gaijin will NEVER address it at this point.

5 Likes
1715

I was dodging but multiple people were shooting at me and I couldn’t get to any cover as well as not actually seeing the guy who was shooting at me and hitting me as he was obscured by an island. even still why do we want people to be exchanging shots at spawn? some maps are so bad that the put the destroyer spawn opposite the cruiser spawn. Overall I really dislike the game mode and gameplay doesn’t flow especially on some maps.

1 Like
1716

I do agree the spawn points being both direct Line of Sight and within range of each other is ridiculous. This is part of what made pre-Leviathans Scharnhorst so dominant in the first place aside from the now fairly rare within 10km spawn at 6.0+

The mechanics aren’t the current issue, the maps are either lazy (open water with no terrain and a death circle cap), heavily in favor of one side or just lack any sort of cover for ships period.

Palau Islands, which is the newest map actually has some thought put into it… Except the spawns are directly within LoS.

3 Likes
1717

it’s common that everyone targets the weakest ship in the enemy fleet - so as destroyer in a cruiser match one is the primary target. As long kills give more mission points as accumulated damage (or kills count for BP tasks) this will ever happen. It shouldn’t be possible to shoot from spawn to spawn - but this also happens on most maps even in the coastal areas (e.g. north sea). I would prefer a mechanic in which the precision of shots depend on the number of salvos already fired at the target and not a perfect targetting from the start. This would also help the coastals which are battered in their spawn by bluewater ships.

1718

Have in mind that the maps were designed for the old targeting system which still exist in Realistic.

Being in direct line of site is not that much of a probem when you actually need to target your shots.
In fact it is realistic an engament would start when LOS is established and given you are in guns effective range you have confidence will score hits.

Naval battles are usually on open water, having an island to hide behind is GJ idea of “how to” but this is not realistic.

Mechanics actually is the problem but they are more concern on “fixing” the repair system than for example realizing that capture the flag is no ones priority.

1 Like
1719

There’s a point where the pursuit of realism needs to be thrown out the window. Open water maps is one of those points. I also don’t want to hear ‘but warthunder is realistic’ when it quite frankly isn’t.

Flag caps are also often exposed and it’s usually suicide to capture a point unless you know the enemy can’t kill you. Mechanically, naval is [mostly] fine with some exceptions - ticket bleed being one of them.

2 Likes
1720

Yes we have debated about this many times in this 1500 long post but there are certain aspects that make the core of a game.
I do not expect the realism of '‘Sea Power : Naval Combat"’ but we have drifted completely away to the point it feels we play CS.
You now have the ability to jump + duck and use GJ own Cronus Zen to shoot with precision, this fundamentally changed the rules we are playing but game mechanics and maps remained the same.