So how is the Mirage 2000 not a new aircraft?
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Who said it was not a new aircraft though?
Of course, it’s a new aircraft, but shares the same design heritage from previous iteration before it.
Now, if you want to go back almost 100 years ago when jet powered combat aircraft were in its infancy and say the P38 is nothing like the F-35 Lightning II JSF today. I guess you have me there…
However, the F-35 still has the same design philosophies that can be traced back to the first Lightning. The P38 was designed for what we today would call “multirole capability”. It assumed Fighter role, Fighter bomber, & served as reconnaissance aircraft.
It is fitting that Lockheed Martin would call the F-35 the Lightning II.
Hope that helps, my bad. did not mean to be abrasive. I thought you were someone else.
I’m not sure what is as of late but I feel like the magic 2 had better flare resistance before irccm. The irccm feels non existent on the missile.
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The Only similarities between the Mirage III and The Mirage 2000 is they they have “mirage” in the name, and that they use the same tail-less delta design.
Externally they may look similar, but the mirage 2000 is a complete redesign from the ground up using computer software to generate a much more streamlined, and aerodynamically improved airframe and wings.
Internally they are a completely different design of aircraft, with all new fuselage, cockpit, intakes, wings, tail, fuel system, electronics, hydraulics syetm etc etc etc. Its so much more complicated than a 1950s aircraft upgraded to gen 4/1980s technology.
There are practically no comminality of parts between the two aircraft, infact the Mirage 2000 shares more in common with the Mirage F1 than the Mirage III.
Its like saying a dog is closely related to a cat because it has 4 legs.
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They have the same tailless design that mirage is literally known for and is practically trademarked is a lot more closely related than a dog to cat.
But hey, whatever helps you sleep at night right?
Lol can you imagine walking into Dassault and asking them if the mirage 2000 is related to the original delta design of the Mirage and they say “nah, bro it’s completely different and has nothing to do with the other. It’s like comparing a cat to a dog.”
Yes
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Practically? You got a source for that? Can you prove there are zero parts that all three of these aircraft share?
Yeah the F1 is a newer Mirage than the III. Technology speaking, of course.
thats like being surprised that a Porsche 911 from 2008 is going to have more in common with a Porsche 911 from 2003 than a Porsche from 1977.
But guess what? They are still Porsche 911s that originate from a single design. No?
Why is this even an argument? It’s akin to saying the F-22 is related to the F-15 because they share the same ‘F-’ designation…
It’s quite clear that the Mirage name is just a cool name for a fighter produced by the same company. That’s why it’s used for the Mirage III, Mirage F1 (non delta) and also the Mirage 2000.
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So you are conceding that the designs are related to each other ?
Bro please stop you are derailing this thread, just read the title, it’s not about history of the mirages or dassault
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Because it’s in the mirage topic and Dassault history is fun to talk about.
Anyway my bad bro. You should let the people know who reached out to me initially and the game master they were derailing because history was not in the title of the topic. Thanks.
You may see it as just some name that a company thought was “cool”.
But I see Dassault’s Mirage more than that. I see a legendary base platform with a legendary record with more peer air to air kills than both the F-4E and Mig21 SMT & MF. I see a platform that was greatly feared around the world and most coveted by warring middle eastern countries. Some countries going to insanely great lengths to steal plans for the Mirage (Soviet Union included).
I see a platform that was feared by Iranian F-14A crews more than any Russian fighters because of the range and accuracy of the Super 530 during the Iran/Iraq war. (No one cared about the Mig-23, it was cannon fodder).
I see an original platform that the greatest supersonic jet ace pilot of all time still to this day regards the Mirage III as the most special fighter that he has ever flown, even after flying the Nesher, Kfir, F-15 & F-16.
The Mirage has done insanely better on the export market than the F-4 and Mig23 and stayed far more relevant as well.
I guarantee all of you without a shadow of a doubt that Dassault will proudly without hesitation tell you the Mirage 2000 is a direct descendant from their original legendary Mirage III
If you really want to sit there and tell me these two aircraft have nothing in common whatsoever besides being manufactured by the same company and it is only by magical coincidence they share the same design pattern and base model name… I guess there is nothing in the world that can ever convince you otherwise… I still respect your opinion. Can you respect mine?
What about an official statement from Dassault? Will that suffice?
the problem isn’t that you have an opinion,… it’s that your basically tells us that it’s the one that matters,…
can’t see differences in both patterns? i see a lot more differences than you expect us to see/want to yourself.
the whole argument you have is saying that all Mirage are basically the same design,…
Key features doesn’t makes same aircrafts.
and within those key features of each 3 aircrafts → massives changes aswell.
and as the name of “key feature” indicates, it basically impact EVERYTHING ELSE.
so we have 3 Different aircrafts, considered by of the same Family, for Marketing purposes.
they have nothing apart basic technology bricks that are done way differently in the detail.
at this point, calling an F-102"Delta-Dagger"-> “Mirage-102” or an F-106"Delta Dart"-> “Mirage-106” would have the same effect, they both shares Tailless Delta of 60° and both are made as an interceptor.
EDIT: why not adding that F-16XL to the line of the US Mirage Family, too?!
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Bel you guys asked me to justify my claims and desired to examine these claims in detail. Even GJ staff was interested in why I come to these conclusions.
I only offered it based on my understanding and dedicated research into Dassault and the Mirage platform since its inception.
We all concluded that the Mirage is amazing and “related” or “based on” does not mean “the same” & that is where the misunderstanding took place. I removed my “based on” wording for you.
This morning more people would like to chime in as they do not believe they are even related at all.
That is totally cool, & I will happily discuss that with them and give them the attention and respect I would give anyone else and have a full discussion in hopes we can all learn some more about the design. Who knows they may teach me something.
But no one should get offended if I do not agree and believes that the Mirage 2000 is related to the original legendary, combat proven Mirage III.
I am replying in detail to each and every one of you who request it out of respect for them and there of course is some guy (Mig23) who supposedly has me blocked but yet still cannot stop following me around and referring to every single word I say in hopes to destabilize every productive discussion I am in. It’s very creepy.
We’re still pretending he isn’t just avoiding the fact that he thought the Mirage series were all related and based off one-another lol… that convo was so old it happened before I even blocked him… yet here he is… still derailing y’alls thread.
this is exactly why i think this discussion HERE, should stop.
Create a new thread if you prefer to continue publicly, or go PM,… but just stop derailling,…
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I will stop for you Bel.
But if someone comes in and likes to discuss more about the history of the Mirage 2000 and tries to directly ping me, please do me the favor and tell them they are off topic, its derailing.
Please tell them to make a Mirage history topic, I am not the one who asked, they did. I do not have to make any topic. That includes our Game Master too, ok?
If staff or anyone else wishes to discuss the history of the Mirage 2000 with me here and ask me questions and examine my opinion. You must tell them they are derailing and to make a topic that says “history.” Tell them to make a topic and invite me.
Ily cheers. ttyl.
back on Mirage-2000 subjects of why it’s sucking: do you think it matters to redo your own Bug report about IRCCM of Magic-2?
i mean they say it’s fix when the reality is that made it halfway,…
Smin already said that all the magic 2 bug reports were already acknowledged and under the hands of the devs around a month ago (or during the December update I don’t really remember when) in this thread, the one of the M4K or the one on the magic 2. Honestly I don’t remember which one lol, but I definitely saw it