Upgrades over the Tornado Gr1 (and not including things the Gr1 can also get)
Mk103 Engines (Well… technically, the GR1 did… but wont ever get fixed)
FLIR
Litening III (hopefully and not the TIALD again)
Brimstones
ePaveways (GPS bombs)
Storm Shadow
TERMA (MAWS)
ASRAAM (Was its main weapon, but the GR1 did use Aim-9M so probably will get that instead)
HMS (IRL only A2G, but in war thunder, you never know)
BOL (Technically, so should the GR1 but the GR4 is more likely to have it)
The intro of the 10.3 GRB Tornados, makes me wonder if they are setting the stage for them to be added. At 11.3/11.7 they would be barely usable, but at 10.3? Could be quite effective.
considering existing game logic it won;t be a problem.
the time you launch it, iog information is loaded, it can guided it until the seeker get in lock range.
the problem is, Brimstones in plane is still too op, so how to nerf it to a suitable degree to be in game.
even a pure laser guided missile with enough range is too op.
like the KH-38ML in SU-25SM3. It didn’t perform well because sm3’s TGP has no lateral sight, if it has, it can launch in 20km(seeker has only 12km range but IOG enables it to be launched in farther distance) and fly laterally while keep guiding the missile, Brimstones is same, and not to mention it’s microwave seeker.
Both ALARM and BL755/JP233 could just be added to the Tornado Gr1. ALARM might be effective, it might not, CBUs would be worthless at top tier on the Tornado (or most aircraft to be honest) due to the height they need to be dropped at.
Adding the GR4 to add a weapon system that wouldnt be usable, is kind of wierd, esepcially as the Gr4s main reason for being was to allow the GR1 to better use guided weapons and not unguided weapons like CBUs.
Su-25SM3 can fire off 4x KH-38s well beyond the range of any SPAA in game with ease. Brimstones would have less range and far less firepower than the KH-38, I reckon you will need to fully enter range of the Pantsir before you can fire. The smaller warhead will probably mean like Hellfire, 2-3 missiles per target to get a kill. (and thats not including defending against things like Su-27SMs with 12x AAMs in a Tornado IDS)
it’s more a pantsir problem not KH-38 problem, it has 40lm range doesn’t mean it can be launched in that range in game, it’s a self-destruct count down. 38MT’s seeker only allows about 12km lock on vehicle(though still out of most spaa except pantsir). 38ML can be launched in 20km, but no lateral sight means it will fly directly into SPAA’s range.
meanwhile, Brimstones, have iog and laser guide, mmV is easy to model but we temporarily ignore it like you said. Western TGP allows it to do this ↓
and recent HEAT warhead polish, which added a new spall model for HEAT larger than 152mm(AGM-65, Hellfire and AKD-10), allow these missile to kill in one shot easily if pen, but pen is not a problem for Hellfire(Brimstones has same warhead as Iremember)
About the Speed:
I’m not sure about Brimstone’s speed so I tested Hellfire, 8km needs 35s to reach frrom a hovering heli, means 228m/s in average. KH-38 needs 25s to reach 12km from a SU-25, means 480m/s in average. If a plane can give it 300m/s start speed, it should be able to get a 400+m/s speed in average, I think faster enough.
I think they’ll add the more modern version of the F-15E, like the 2003 version. I think they want to add more planes with JDAMs and/or glide bombs/missiles. I feel like the very early F-15E wouldn’t really fit that theme.
spall is mainly determined by how much penetration left after pen the armor, so as long as it keeps the 1200mm penetration, with new heavy warhead spall model, it can easily kill by 1 shot.
you can see how powerful the new spall model is.
AGM-114K
I still routinely find myself needing to hit targets with 2 (sometimes more) Hellfires to get a kill. Im expecting Brimstones to be the same The issue is that they aim for centre mass, not weakspots like they should. Also with the heavier ERA at top tier and the introduction of more APS, they’ll only be even more mitigated at top tier.
Also… Aircraft dont only exist for GRB. There are air modes too, Brimstones would be fun in ASB and the main reason I want them
(though considering how bad britain’s ground vehicles are at the moment, a very strong CAS is needed to compensate and its unlikely the GR4 will get ASRAAM, so not a lot it will do vs an F-16C or F-15C or Gripen or Su-27SM)
not sure about AGM-114, but from what I see, AGM-65, which aim for centre mass, can get at least 2 kill out of 3 shot in average, I think Brimstone can do better.
but you still get kills with a single missile, so saying that it will take 2 or 3 on average is missleading, you can probably get 7-9 kill out a load of 12, as not all targets in war thunder are mbts
They may mitigate Brimstones by not mounting them on the wing pylons. This was rarely done IRL, so not wholey unrealistic. So that drops the count down from 18 missiles to 12.
If they are the dual mode seeker variant and have a hard requirement for a Tpod, then that reduces the count from 12 down to 9.
Are you saying a Tonrado IDS with 9x Brimstones is more OP at top tier than something like an F-16C with 6x AGM-65s?
Even with the full 12, the likelyhood of getting all 12 off is remote without repeated passes. Which icnrease the likelyhood of CAP that will kill you. We wont know till we see them in game, but im personally expecting ot just ripple fire off 2x missiles per target, perticularly MBTs (which are the most common at top tier) and maybe if I see an IFV or something, just fire 1. Though even then, Ive seen a few survive a hellfire before. Something like a Pantsir though, would give Britain its first aircraft that mtight actually hard coutner it. By giving us something that can overwhelm it with missiles that it can just shoot down. Especially if ALARM was also added to surpress its radar (if ALARMs can even target it that is)
