Mainstream FnF slinger helicopters are overachieving on Heli PVE and in need for gamemode improvements

Game Discussion Arcade Battle
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With the latest update rolled out, now there are more and more mainstream fire-and-forget missile helicopters flooding in Heli PVE, and with the gamemode itself doesn’t change since forever it makes players grinding helis 9.0 and beyond struggled too much or even not getting useful action points aside from base bombing.

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1st useful action and every single FnF helicopters licked all ground unit objectives (the Mi-24V only base bombing)

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final scores before end of session

  • a BR separation is truly needed for helicopters 11.7/12.0 and above so it doesn’t interfere lower BR helis in rank 6.

  • Apart from BR separation, give them more challenging SPAA like ZA-35 from Canyon map or even reintroduce Roland that Heli PVE used to have before.

  • Add more ground units and phase out the M40 artilleries in enemy defense objective past those BR and in place with tanks same as enemy assault objective.

  • In case point above can’t be done on adding more ground units, make the ticket bleed slower so more objectives can be spawn.

  • Per discussion from past topics, reduce player count for higher BR helis, This isn’t Rank 5 or 9.3 SIM and below where limited type of helicopters can shoot ATGMs and need cooperation to eliminate SPAA for non ATGM carrier helicopters and without Rocket CCIP.

  • AND PLEASE, UNIFORM HELI BR FROM GRB TO SIM AND ARCADE TOO WHY ARE THEY CAPPED AT 11.0 WHEN GROUND ARCADE AND SIM BR ALREADY RAISED? (for reference, Heli PVE didn’t use GRB BR)

I’m personally discover Heli PVE to have fun playing helicopters because I don’t grind much or none on Ground and more of Air player main (I maxxed out USSR Air, UK and US at least get to Rank 8 a few and Japan currently at Rank 6. In comparison, I only get to Rank 4 on USSR Ground at the moment and none on other factions)

This wasn’t an issue when Spike carriers around because before all of AGM-179, CM-502KG and LMUR added, they’re rarely to be spotted around and generally not many people grind for Tigers, A129 or AH-60. I used to see Battle Hawks when I grind Mi-24V months ago and since then it has been rare sight to see one, same goes to French Tiger HAD.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t hate FnF helicopters and I wish to get one in future, but with current state of Heli PVE, it is stunting my grind, and for others that has yet to reach it.

Extra note: I do aware several suggestion on introducing helis into Air SB, but I’m not sure about it, plus not keen on PvP side of things, I’m just tired with concept of PvP in every single gamemodes.

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I think current pve’s br brasket divided like this -9.3, 9.7+. I think this is the main problem.
So my solution is adding another br brasket. 9.7-10.7 then 11.0+ for new fnf heli’s

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Heli PVE is unbearably slow for everything.

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Given how abandoned these game modes are by the Devs, they will probably just ban F&F helis from joining and call it “fixed”. Just like they did with the ARH carriers in air assault mode.

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That is what I’m suggesting for, also them using outdated arcade and sim BR for heli is confusing while ground vehicles BR are all changed across all 3 gamemodes

tbh they should’ve done this way back when Spike ER helicopters were added, it’s too late

not really, once you get helicopters above 9.7 most matches can even end within 3rd useful action or 30 minutes given everyone have Shturms, TOW-2, Atakas and Hellfire B

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seems fair, if you already have FnF why would you play PvE when the new FnF requires no skill at all to get kills on RB meaning faster grind, more sl and more rp

Gaijin just lazy fix

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the issue is: how do you plan on unlocking the F&Fs if you are locked out of PvE? It’s gunna take you a while to do it in 13.0 GRB with the stock loadout of 4 Hellfires and 38 hydras.
Gaijin also didn’t ban ARH planes by preventing planes with ARHs entering the match, they just straight up capped it at a max 12.7 BR regardless of loadout, so 13.0 SARH planes are banned while the F-14A can still enter, or you can just use F-16As or Su-24s with Mavs or Kh-29s to delete entire waves. so yeah… real fair for the 6.7+ props an sub-sonic jets that get thrown into the same matchmaker.

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Again, I put the first 3 points just so FnF helis still have place in Heli PvE (and again for those who didn’t grind ground and want to enjoy helicopters without playing Ground exclusively), and not interrupt lower Rank 6 helicopters. Plus it’s an overkill for FnF missiles just to shoot AT M40 artillery units which is unarmored and easily wiped out with basic rockets and gun. 11.7-12.0 GRB helicopters already have missiles that could shoot further than 4km hence why should their SPAA replaced to ZA-35 or Rolands and more armored units for enemy defense objective

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Helicopter grind in general is really unfriendly at all BRs.
You’re sacrificing a lot of time just to get unlucky on the AI target spawns and teammates having way better equipment than you.
Let’s not forget that, unlike in air or ground, rewards aren’t tied to time played/active, but to actual contribution ( PvE kills also count for way less than PvP ones).
Just shows how much the devs neglect heli grind and how intentional the nerfs to progression were made to be.

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Imagine having to grind German helicopters this way and getting in the Bo-105. Stuck with FnF helicopters and Ka-5xs, no guns, no rockets, no bombs, can’t bomb bases, just 6 supercrappy HOT missiles that by the time they arrive on a target teammates have of course finished everything and are killing a convoy 15 Km away.

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I end up hoping people will leave so my Wasp can get something done. While I don’t have the experiences your talking about, I do think more needs to be going on (more spawns, more bases, more pads, convoys staying longer)

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I think 12.0+ would be better for FnF heli’s

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Honestly even then I would argue the difference in capability with having and not having fire and forget missiles on the same helicopter is still concerning. While I do think that a higher br bracket for these helicopters would be too small of a br bracket I do think it is right direction and personally maybe isolating them to their own br bracket would be better (not all of them but most of them), but I think more would need to be done ironically for these helicopters, personally maybe give them a small amount of their fire and forget missiles stock like how it is now with top tier jets with radar guided missiles (preferably though not like how they do stock atgm’s such as on the Apache where you have to waste a hardpoint to carry 4 atgm’s rather than if you could just carry 4 on 1 hardpoint stock) so they aren’t as horrifically outmatched. Also I think it’s worth remembering that 12.0 does not exist for heli pve since its arcade, and you also have to consider if some other helicopters should be included if you want to then go about it in arcade br’s since the MH-60 DAP since it is a lower br than the AH-1Z and AH-64D in RB but it has a comparable level of air to ground weapon capacity, so do you leave it in a lower br bracket because its a lower br in rb or do you put it with helicopters still with similar armament?

I will say though I think the problem we are seeing now wasn’t unforeseeable, it could have easily happened when the AH-60 was added but why it did become realized is probably due to the limited number of people playing it and also how most people tend to move back to other modes once they are done with their helicopters in heli pve so ironically I think maybe with time with how slow the mode is, I think things may return to something more normal eventually, but I don’t think it is any excuse to argue nothing should be done where things stand.

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It was more so a suggestion that FnF helis shouldn’t meet non FnF helis in the battle as to prevent non FnF helis from basically doing nothing

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Fair, I think in general even without the fnf helicopters I think heli pve has been overdue for a third br bracket, and while these fire and forget missile armed helicopters are an undeniable issue, in particular I don’t think the Eurocopter UHT and HAC deserve to be forced into a separate br bracket as they have the oldest fnf missiles on any heli which are very outmatched by all other fnf missiles on helicopters at the moment, I don’t think anything short of the addition of the twin pars launchers being added would make it any more fair for them to be put up in br with everything else, and even with the twin arm launchers I think given the limited range of the missiles I think it would be up to debate if it improves them enough to make them worth putting with the likes of the Z-10ME and AH-64E.

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I afraid it may took too long, since these FnF people will keep grind on Heli PvE until they get what they want, right now Z-10ME keep filling the sessions just because they want to get BA-11 missile even though they’ve unlocked CM-502KG. And another note that you don’t get FnF JAGM until after unlocking the laser version. I only seen Guardian Apache once and yet even the guy unlocked IR JAGM and stole kills, not bothered to J out and respawn multiple times to just to get closer to assault/defense spawns.

We may also need a mechanism if player intentionally J out without damage multiple times mid air, give them extortionate amount of respawn SL so they be discouraged to do so, or kick them after 2 or 3 attempts

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It was bad before with the Spike slingers now it’s just silly

I’ve been using the Z-10ME myself and I know I only need about 300-400 scoreboard points/10 mins to get decent rewards, but that doesn’t mean everyone else does and I’ve seen others overfarm to >2000 score in 20 mins leaving next to nothing for anyone else.

I’d say that counts as griefing
It’s also self-sabotage, j-ing out every 5 mins cuts into your rewards and these helos are in excess of 12,000SL to respawn