bug reporting shouldnt have mods involved at all. should go straight to the devs
More or less.
Someone needs to filter all the faulty reports, which are like 80-90%.
My new reports are usually looked at pretty quickly while my old reports are untouched for almost a year.
The issue is Gaijins policy.
“Changes to values based on historical properties require historical sources”.
Which of course can’t be provided when they don’t exist or are classified, or are even faulty.
The VK. 3002 (M) is quoted with 35t which should be impossible. A Panthers turret with turret ring weighs roughly 5t. Even 35t for just the hull seems rather optimistic.
So it’s reasonable to assume that the actual tank (hull + turret) weighs somewhat in the +40t range, since 10t don’t simply vanish by reducing a few cm of armor.
Just as an example of logic vs. available sources.
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Except for the fact the turret & hull do not have the steel of production Panther.
You could even estimate how much mass was lost based on external armor thickness difference alone.
M4 Sherman went from 33.7 tons to over 44 tons with very little armor additions.
KillaKiwi is giving a 40t value specifically because of a calculation that was done on the old forum about how much less the armor on the VK 30.02 (M) would weight.
Sorry? What Sherman? Even the M4A3E2 weights less than 40 tons and it has substantially more armor than the M4A3 (76).
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What are you talking about? o_O
Not having the steel of production Panther? What is that suppose to mean?
So VK should have mild steel because it was just a prototype and have like 20-25% less armor? xD
Please fill me in, which Sherman weighs 33.7t and increased to 44t by adding a bit of armor :P
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The only one I can think of is the M4A3 HVSS that was modified to have a T26 turret and weighted about 46 tons. Except according to what I’ve read from other people, that one also had additional weights because it was meant to test HVSS.
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Well, in this case I actually decided to look up how much a Panther turret weighs. Since it was suggested that 35t only refers to the actual hull of the VK, which in my opinion makes perfect sense.
The Panzer V was supposed to be a 30t tank but the MAN model was way overweight.
So they probably did what Germans like to do, they just wrote the weight of the hull and make it seem like it’s the weight of the entire tank in order to get the contract.
After fitting the turret and adding a bit more armor the production Panther had a whooping 44t.
Way more than the original requirement.
So by either removing a bit of armor weight from the Panther D or just adding a turret to the “supposed” 35t VK, we end up with something that is still in the 40t range.
With all the combat components added, it would easily be 42t at the minimum.
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I have created a bug report about the turret traverse of the M41A1 that points out the inconsistency in the old bug report and utilizes some sources with a 36º/s maximum turret traverse to hopefully sort out this issue.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/LtAEWcdCylxD
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Hello, just an off-topic. M109A1 and M109 share the same weight in game, is it an error?
Also the M109A1 in game has fixed reload time like other auto-reload vehicle. Is it also a bug since M109A1still used semi-auto reload mechanism and the reload time should be based on crew skill.
I’m sorry but I really have no information on that. And this isn’t really the topic to discuss it. You should probably make a new topic in this section of the forum asking about those characteristics.
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Yeah that’s fair honestly. Just doing his job I guess. The devs are just really odd with their decision making, or just straight up ignore some parts of reports. All we can really do is keep trying I suppose.
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It is ridiculous. The ground devs are impossible to convince.
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There similar problem with M551 turret rotation speed back 4+ years ago.
I made a bug report using source from part of book “Sheridan: A History of the American Light Tank, Volume 2 [R.P. Hunnicutt]”
It got fix later.
In the same Source it also has M41A1 turret rotation (max) speed at 10 seconds/360 degrees
Here link to my old bug report.
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Sorry I was wrong I was looking at the M551 report.
Bulldog was fixed in Feb this year. If it’s still not right please log a new report.
It was correct as per the manual at 24degree/s
360/15=24
The problem is that if you actually look at the manual, it specifically states that those 24º/s are not the maximum turret traverse.
The original creator of the bug report has already asked Gaijin to revoke the change due to that. I myself have done a bug report pointing this inconsistency out and providing additional sources with 36º/s only for it to be denied under the pretense of “there are multiple sources and Gaijin has decided to continue to use the manual” even though I spend half of that bug report pointing out that the manual does not even state the maximum turret traverse.
It is very clear that Gaijin does not want to actually fix it.
Literally reads “Maximum time”
Time and speed are invertly proportional.
Something that takes “maximum time”… is because it is going it’s slowest possible speed.
That is exactly the problem. It’s the reason why the original poster of said bug report has even forwarded a requestion for Gaijin to revoke the change. It is the reason why I made a bug report providing extra sources for 36º/s while pointing out that the technical manual does not state maximum turret traverse speed.
Well you’re going to struggle with this, I’d imagine it’s getting lost in translation. I can see your 36degree report was denied as conflicting sources, so they’ve gone off the maximum time number from the manual. I see what you mean that it infers the slowest speed of traversal is 24degree/s
I spent half of my own bug report pointing out that the sources don’t conflict at all.
It’s just that the technical manual should not even be brought up in this specific scenario because it does not state the maximum turret traverse in the first place.