Something like this
Not really, all you need to do is roll and use flares, IRIS-T won’t be able to kill you, nether will 9x, At least from front aspect, still need to test from rear aspect
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There are CAS counters currently in the game.
CAS does not need to be made OP again.
SPAA is not a counter to SPAA, either.
& Pantsir SM SV is not OP, CAS was, now CAS is balanced with the exception of AH-64Es & Mi-28NM, so things are fine.
More SPAA will be added to further counter CAS, but SPAA doesn’t need countered.
SM is op
simply because there is NOTHING comparable in any tree and it can be almost impossible to kill for a plane
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I’ve never tried to flare a 9X or IRIS-T.
But following the data’s of the game, and a quick analyse :
| AIM-120C-7 | AMRAAM-ER | I-Derby ER | I-Derby SR | HQ-11 | CAMM | CAMM-ER | Aster 30 | SAM-4 | 9M317MA | IRIS-T SLM | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Guidance | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | ARH+IOG+DL | IR+IOG+GNSS+DL |
| Seeker beam (° — wider = easier chaff) | 15° | 15° | 15° | 15° | 7° | 7° | 7° | 7° | 3.5° | 3.5° | n/a (5° FOV) |
| Sidelobe rejection (dB — less negative = easier chaff) | -30 | -30 | -30 | -30 | -29 | -29 | -29 | -30 | -45 | -45 | n/a (flares, not chaff) |
| PN multiplier (lower = easier to out-turn/notch) | 4 (lowest) | 6 | 6 | 6 | 6 | 6 | 6 | 8 | 6 | 10 (highest) | 6 |
| Max G | 35 | 40 | 40 | 40 | 40 | 50 | 50 | 50 | 36 | 30 | 40 |
| Max break-lock time (s) | 100 | 150 | 100 | 100 | 70 | 90 | 90 | 210 | 161.5 | 120 | 100 |
| Notch vulnerability | Same across all — Doppler gate 5 m/s, angular-speed rejection 30°/s | Not applicable (IR seeker) | |||||||||
| Flare/IRCCM resistance | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | n/a | FOV+shutoff IRCCM, 0.25° rejection FOV, 0.001 threshold — decent flare resistance |
Easiest → hardest to avoid:
- AIM-120C-7 / SLAMRAAM — widest beam + weakest sidelobe rejection + lowest PN (4). Easiest all-around: chaff and notch both work well.
- AMRAAM-ER, I-Derby ER, I-Derby SR — same chaff vulnerability as above, slightly better PN/G.
- HQ-11, CAMM, CAMM-ER — narrower beam, moderate chaff resistance; CAMM/CAMM-ER’s 50G makes maneuver evasion harder.
- Aster 30 — same beam class, but highest PN (8), tied-highest G (50), and a huge 210s break-lock window — a successful chaff/notch break barely helps here.
- SAM-4 (Type 03) — narrow beam, strong -45 dB sidelobe rejection, chaff much weaker against it.
- 9M317MA — hardest overall: same excellent chaff resistance as the SAM-4, plus the highest PN multiplier in the set.
And IRIS-T still have the second place in term of k/d.
Knowing an IRSI-T is on you is the hardest part about doging an IRSI-T missile. Spamming flares haphazardly still works against them, just a little harder for the planes with fewer countermeasures like the f16. Planes with maw do alot better against them than planes without.
Neither of those are traits that can make it OP.
It’s OP against non-F&F helicopters, that’s for certain.
It’s powerful against AH-64E & Mi-28NM, but that’s not OP.
OP would be can frag with no danger, which the Pantsir SM SV cannot do.
It can frag, but it’s in danger.
If a Pantsir & aircraft trade, that’s a slight net negative to the CAS side in spawn point endurance, but it doesn’t make it OP in doing so.
Trades are what ADATS does against Mig-27K when both players are of equal skill, that doesn’t make the ADATS OP against Mig-27K, despite the ADATS being “almost impossible to kill” for the average CAS user. & yes, I’m aware that ADATS isn’t 11.3, despite my desire for it to be.
So yeah, when CAS was OP, it was unfraggable by SPAA, flat out.
Pantsir SM SV is unfraggable by G Lynx.
Pantsir SM SV is unfraggable by JH-7As.
But Pantsir SM SV is fraggable by a whole host of jets “at” its BR… it’s just hard, just as it’s hard for a Pantsir SM SV player to destroy a honed CAS pilot in one of those jets.
Edit:
That and if Pantsir SM SV fear can keep my team mates from spawning CAS so we can win more matches, then it being incorrectly seen as “OP” is a net positive to NATO teams.
Gaijin should just model RCS for munitions.
That way Pantsir SM can’t unrealistically engage 20 bombs untouched.
(like every other NATO SPAA)
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Technically the HARMS are the counter, make him turn off his radar and spam him with ir munitions.
But talking about balance, the ussr still have the best spaa and also get HARMS so…
It can
There’s very little that can reasonably kill a good SM-SV player.
1 of those, is on its team (prefired vikhrs)
Not really
SM-SV is insanely capable of dealing with literally any aircraft without fear of losing
It’s straight up not fair to fight
I have used it, I have tried facing it, it’s batshit insane
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The tracking radar uses K-band
Which no ARM can see.
He can also just shoot down the ARM
Also, smoke grenades
DW, Alvis will now tell you that you are objectively wrong because he has played a game while there was a pantsir on his team.
Regarding the IRIS-T being the worst I am wrong, I should have specified that it’s against Helicopters. Then again, I have had mayor issue shooting down stuff like KH38s and the likes even at ranges of more than 10kms.
IRIS-T just sucks against helis, all top tier non-SACLOS AAs do
And yeah, it has some difficulty shooting down munitions as well, idk what gaijin did, but they didn’t cook with the IRIS-T
None of the SPAAs cook, except the Pantsir, which even then gets very easily overwhelmed.
CAS and Helis are super easy to spawn right off the bat and that doesn’t help any of the SPAAS cases at all.
Only pantsir S1 could kinda get overwhelmed due to the firing delay between missiles
SM-SV has the option to just shoot everything down without re-arming as well as actually having the mobility to get into cover or roleplaying as a squid and smoking up to hide (It can then shoot anything through said smoke)
The only harm that can (against a somewhat aware sm) actually get through is on the Malaysian S30. Shocker.
ARM, not HARM
HARM is the AGM-88
ARM is the missile type
It can, if there are 12.0 & less CAS facing it.
However, if someone uses Su-30, AH-64E, F-15E/I, Typhoon, Rafale, etc it’s a draw if they’re of equal skill.
They will either frag each other or dodge each other as they’d be running on the same levels of caution.
Mb, brain no workie rn :c
?
Have you used either of these vehicles against each other?
Rafale gets hammers shot out of the sky because they’re too slow
or smoked
Su-30 will just have its missiles also shot out of the sky or smoked
ARMs are useless since the pantsir can just turn off search radar for a second and evade it
Euro is the only one that can reasonably fight the pantsir
but the amount of skill required is really high since you have to both know where it is, fire off enough missiles, evade the pantsir’s missile and then pray the pantsir doesn’t just smoke in time
AH-64E just gets railed by mach 5 SAM missile before it can pose a reasonable threat
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