Though I don’t think its likely to have gone anywhere, I recently stumbled onto a unique option to perhaps provide a better ~10.0 ish BR SAM for the tree! ( other than the VAMTAC RR with Martlet/Starstreak )
It seems that in 2016 SAAB tested mounting RBS 70NG (BOLIDE but improved) to the roof of the Komodo 4x4.
Could be an interesting option with slightly longer range than the starstreak and the multi-purpose warhead.
With Indo Defence 2024 just a couple of months away, there’s a high likelihood that more tanks will be unveiled there, such as this one
P8 Tank made by PT. SSE
30mm Remote Controlled Gun in an unmanned turret, supposedly can also be fitted with a MLRS SAM system
Stanag level 2
Hybrid engine
amphibious
speed of 105km/h
3 crew on hull
7.5 tons
day sight, thermals, LRF
yesterday/today There were some leaked images circulating of the hull being pretty much done, but i cant share those images for obvious reasons. If you want to see it you can search on reddit if the post is still up
Its likely that the actual tank will be unveiled in Indo Defence 2024 so we’ll just have to wait and see
further reading: P8 Tank
But the BTR-ZD is a specific variant and was meant for use on the vehicle itself though,
for the K-61 I dont recall there was any mention that the cannon can be used whilst on the vehicle as its primarily serve as its transport but I could be wrong
I think for rank I it’s should exist several Japanese vehicles like the Ha-Go, Te-ke, and Chi-Ha Kai, plus maybe even tankettes as per KNIL forces stationed before the Japanese Occupation like the Mormon Herrington MTLS the one with a 37mm of it. In Rank II we could add several armoured car like the Humber and Marmon Herrington.
Its gonna be long but bear with me
I dont know if the Ha-Go was ever used but from the few references that exist, the Te-Ke’s 37mm was switched with the 7.7mm when it was used by the Indonesian army in one example captured by the dutch in 1947. Of course other regions could’ve captured and operated the 37mm but I dont think there was any mention of them (i could be wrong)
video here
for the Chi-ha it seems to be the 57mm variant not the Kai that was captured in Surabaya in 1945 because it has the smaller turret. Most likely the reason why the gun doesnt look right is because i presume it mustve been removed at some point and was replaced with a dummy barrel in its place.
story
For the MTLS with the 2x 37mm, I dont recall it was ever used in Indonesia since they’re mostly sent to Suriname, only a handful CTMS with the singular 37mm was sent to Indonesia and an even smaller number were captured by the Japanese, which then couldve been transfered to the Indonesians, but again not a whole lot of references in Indonesian use.
further reading
additionally Indonesia uses the Mk3 variant of the Marmon–Herrington armoured car with only the machine guns turret. The Indonesians captured them from the Japanese who captured it from the Dutch. Was mentioned on the “Sejarah Kavaleri Korps Marinir” book by the Lieutenant colonel of the marines
now for the Humber, its actually a somewhat unique variant called the Humfox, the same that the Dutch operated. Where its the Canadian Fox armored car hull mounted with the Humber MK4 37mm.
Humfox Mk1 Forum suggestion
they’re classified as “stuart” tanks by the Indonesians because it uses the same cannon. This one singular tank is on display at the pusdikpal (Equipment Education Centre) in Bandung.
Source
Again, i could be wrong for some of these
Don’t forget that Indonesia has the BTR-4M so, another way to introduce another Ukrainian vehicle
I’m in love with this vehicle
The suggestion now has a dedicated sub-tree image, courtesy of @NFrost51. The descriptions and additions of vehicles will be updated soon. Below in the spoiler is a copy of the tree layout.
Edit: For some reason the image doesn’t like “Spoilers”. Check out the suggestion to see the full-size. Bonus vehicle images below:
Additional Note:
excellent work like always Yontzee, i’m a fan of your suggestions all of them very interesting indeed
Thanks man! I really appreciate it. I’m trying to go back through my old suggestions and clean them up. If you see any that are incorrect or missing information, feel free to drop a comment on it. Also stay tuned for my new ones that are pending:
The Indonesian BTR-4M looks a lot like the BTR-4MV1. Do you know about the Indonesian variant’s protection?
They’re Ceramic Armor panels with the option to use ERA/NERA filler. Idk the specifics for the armor, but it’s rated to STANAG 4569 Level 5 (rated against 25mm AP rounds). If it doesn’t have the filler, they could be layered “Akustic” composite paneling inserts. They’re light enough to be able to retain the BTR-4M’s amphibious capabilities from my understanding but I’m not sure if they have used it that way.
The BTR-4M definitely lacks many of the modern features of the BTR-4MV1 however, they do share the same addon armor (just not the same amount of it), remote combat module, etc. The big difference is the BTR-4MV1 fully meets NATO standards.
Small correction, for the PT-76M it uses the triple muzzle brake which i recall cannot fire APFSDS (but will be able to fire falarick in the future), and for the scorpion (including the anoa version) it was never equipped with darts, its mostly just HEAT and HE, but yes the others do carry APFSDS
Yeah I forgot variants like the Mk. 3, etc. can’t use it
+1 as sub tech tree , but there is problem that i think of
maybe thats the problem that i think rn. and for vehicle suggestion
Likely Japan, considering the planned SEA subtree
But it might also be added to a future combined Korean tree.
They had LVT(A)-4, which I believe this suggestion is referencing.
Indonesia actually has a lot of unique vehicles, especially for their ground forces.
The subtree overview also shows the overwhelming majority of domestic vehicles, while even others are often modified or otherwise new to the game.
I can see that being possible, but only for those later used by Indonesia. The Netherlands themselves already have a place in game, so vehicles purely used by them wouldn’t go anywhere else.
I believe this one is already mentioned as the PT-76(M)
i think they mentioned the nimda / israeli upgrade one and they done already in the '90 not the 2020 upgrade variant which offered by Ukraine. link for the 2020 upgrade Україна буде модернізувати ПТ-76 для Індонезії: унікальні фото та подробиці | Defense Express . the problem with this upgrade is still not been seen around yet.
dumb me, thats why i mention armaments history is really grey for me. i think i will looking the source
The British (and then the Dutch) Landed around 21 shermans in preparation for the attack on Surabaya, and 3 tanks were reported to have been destroyed by the Indonesians with captured IJAF cannons/weaponry, and another 1 was reported to suffer heavy damage. These tanks are of many versions, but atleast 3 were known, M4A1 and M4A3 with the 75mm cannon, and the M4A3(105). From footages of the tank, some were early variants and some were the later ones with reworked front glacis.
Brief history
After the national revolution and the round table conference, the former netherlands’ KNIL and Veldpolitie members were to be reintegrated with the TNI under one banner, the APRIS. Due to the formation of the joint armed forces thing, the Dutch/KNIL transfered most of its military equipment to APRIS under the agreement that former KNIL members would be allowed to join the newly formed state.
now to the Shermans itself, the KNIL transfered them to the KKO/Indonesian Marine Corps at around 17th of August 1961, with 9 units being given that they (the KNIL) had been using previously, so we can presume that theyre of the same 3 variants. But the one with actual photographs used by the KKOs are the M4A3s with what looks like a 75mm cannon, thats why its the one being suggested and not the others
5 can be seen in this image
it’s unknown how long the Sherman was used for, as the lack of spare part, high operational cost and wasteful engine, as well as its age made the tank inefficient. Retrofit programs were also not conducted due to the limited amount of them. So what most likely happened is that they were salvaged and turned to scrap. The only Sherman left in Indonesia is the one singular T14E1 ARV in Bandung
this could be interesting discussion about sherman in ID, so what i found in
https://www.shermantank.nl/history%20of%20the%20shermantank%20in%20Holland.htm
and quick description, the sherman that they give to ID is M4A3 (105) variant which ex from dutch marine brigade, 15 unit’s station in ID during '47 period they bring from US directly from “lend” program , after marine brigade disband they give ID 9 tank and brought back 6 to NL, there’s also others m4a3 in NL inventory but thats M4A3E8 variant and retrieve after '50.
in another dutch website Pantser.net
that the sherman they got is M4A3E8 105 from us " lend " program but they didnt mention m4a3 105
and it seems we got DD variant if im not wrong, and that will make m4a3 (105) DD ?, but in the photo didnt show the DD part.
but if this real m4a3 75 we need too look the gun mantlet. in this case is not possible because driver and machine gunner/radioman hatch blocking the view , the only thing clue is on
if im not wrong
the way I understand it is that 21 tanks were first deployed by the British in the Battle of Surabaya in 1945, if i recall that was when the first Shermans of all variants arrived in Indonesia, then after the British pulled out of the war, the those sherman variants that were left in Indonesia was then transfered to the Dutch, so it could be the 75mm or 105mm
for the one in the image, without the gun shield its hard to tell especially with the gun aimed upwards like that, but now im leaning towards the 150 since the gun mount seems to protrude a bit more than the 75mm mantlet, but im no sherman expert so im not exactly sure either
Additionally for the PT-76(M), Ive put the Indonesian flag because its from the 2020 upgrade by PT. Lumindo Artha Sejati (PT. LAS) rather than the PT-76-2000 Nimda one. Indonesia did use both version, but the 2020 local version is the one i propose which is virtually identical upgrade to the 90s onebut with the changing of the tracks to a to a new rubber T157 tracks made by Chaiseri defence, a Thai company
the PT. LAS version is the one that will be upgraded with the LCTS90, although AFAIK there hasnt been any news of the upgrade since 2020, most likely due to the current situation over there
