They should just redo the vote. Didn’t they talk about doing a revote in the future?
I think this is a good idea.
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It absolutely is tied to playstyle.
One gun Im willing to agree that has terrible damage when firing AP only round is the 75mm QQF Mk.V. That gun indeed is atrocious.
Anything else, like the Comets 77mm QQF Mk.II or 17pndr, are good guns.
I dont know what exactly you do with your aim that you struggle, but youre definetively doing something wrong.
Dont fire WW2 APDS at sloped armor or overlaping plates.
Not once Ive had enemy crewmember eat all of my spall from AP round.
If you find yourself in situation where it is neccesary to aim with AP for weakspots, in that same situation you would have to aim with APHE as well.
Newsflash, Panther UFP can bounce 76mm M1 firing M61 APHE shell, or 85mm ZIS-S-53 firing BR-365 APHE shell as well. 17 pndr using Mk.8 shot isnt special in that regard.
if anything, 17pndr firing Mk.8 shot has actually better chance to get through the what you call “bouncy/buggy turret” than M61 shell because it has more penetration.
Higher pen also allows Firefly to engage from further distances; unlike 76mm or 85mm equipped vehicles that have to either flank, or close the distance.
If Firefly can naturally meet King Tiger with production turret that sounds more like sim rotation issue rather than issue with how APHE/AP works.
If both 20pndr AP and french 100mm OdR can absolutely sodomize Tiger II with production turret in one shot, so can the 32pndr.
Sounds more like BR placement/model accuracy issue rather than issue with how APHE/AP works.
A) APHE firing guns usually have some other tradeoffs that might not be apparent on the first sight
B) AP rounds are perfectly capable of taking out tanks in one shot.
Because APCR is dogwater and always has been for the entiriety of Warthunders existence. 90mm Pattons have to play around switching between HEAT-FS (being able to pen) and APHE (being able to oneshot). You can very easily get caught “with your pants down” by having wrong shell loaded at the wrong time.
Stop repeating this obvious lie lol. French 7.7 lineup is mostly AP (with few exceptions such as light tanks having HEAT-FS) and it seems to do fine. Whats your explanation for that?
APHE wont evaporate anything if it doesnt hit and/or cant pen in the first place.
Seeing as Im starting to see pattern of UK players just using WW2 APDS over AP as their main ammo choice, Im starting to suspect it might not be due to AP being supposedly bad.
And 10/10 of my kills against the Tiger II frontally were me just snapshoting their turret face and ammoracking them instantly.
Not all tanks have coupolas.
From side, both are likely oneshots. From front, Firefly will take at least two, but can engage Panther from further and has bigger chance to pen its turret without encountering that snails signature spaghetti code.
im perfectly fine, thanks for asking. I had absolutely great time playing 7.7 UK and I plan to return to it once I finish spading Sea Meteor.
Overall, this all sounds you just dont know how to properly use british tanks. Id advise you to watch some tutorials, maybe branch out a little outside of UK tanks (you know what they say about grass being greener on the other side).
If you want to test things to confirm your theory, im also down for that.
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This. Un-capped AP is beyond miserable. Specifically the US developed AP that could handle slopes just fine but this is the complete opposite in game. Capped shells are just always better.
Honestly, if APHE was actually implemented properly I’m confident 95% of the issues with Yak-9K/TIS-MA/UT would evaporate promptly.
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Yeah. I believe we have all seen the video of the Yak-9K oneshotting a battleship…
Need I say more?
I just want shatter removed from APDS. If APHE doesn’t fail to fuse or have realistic performance why are we adding drawbacks to other shell types?
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Exactly, it was possibly by chance or to reduce costs initially, but then they realized that the Full AP rounds performed better at a 60º angle. For example, this is clearly seen in the simple fact that both the M41 and the M103 used APBC rounds as their primary ammunition, and didn’t have any APHE rounds. In fact, I find the M103’s penetration at 60º somewhat deficient, since it’s a gun that was designed to penetrate IS-3s and T-54s.
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Indeed. Also remove shatter from HVAP. I want my coax 20mm of amx-30 to allow me to kill BMPs and BTRs again.
I sincerely hope Gaijin will come to their senses and at least nerf APHE for smaller calibers, like those found on many AAs. Been playing AMX-30 DCA and the amount of nasty kills that are a result of the APHE’s overperformance is through the roof.
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Frankly speaking, I do not understant people who affirms that the way AP are designed in game are ok and that it’s only a matter of skill issue (better aiming). When there is people that have no need to aim properly and people that have to, there is, without any doubt, a game design problem. The proof is self-evident: I’m a poor ground player but at the same mid BR with Italy and UK my performances are very different. Expecially in arcade, when if you do not one shot your enemy, you are dead.
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The one round I want to see some love is HVAP.
It’s a joke of a round. The 20mm cox of the AMX-30 is much worse than the 14.5mm the Soviets get.
I shared this video in another topic, but it really sums up HVAP
I had more luck killing light targets with the leclerc .50 coax than the amx 30 20mm lately.
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The other thing your video shows is the broken nature of APHE.
Two of your shots hit the rear of the tank yet magically the orb of death cheats physics and kills the entire crew. Against the M18 in particular your round detonated in his engine bay and if anything you should’ve been in trouble.
Exactly this. One of the defences I’ve seen for the broken state of APHE is that if it were changed it’d be much harder for some tanks to penetrate or one shot its opposition…
I wonder how they’d feel playing AP only tanks that at times can only penetrate through the turret to kill at most 2 crew at a time. Don’t forget that if you fire that second shot off too soon you’ll do no damage and before you get the third shot off they’ve replaced their crew and sent an APHE your way nuking the entire crew in one possibly terribly placed shot.
I think I’ve got video footage somewhere of me being killed in an open top vehicle when an APHE round hits a part of my armour, flies behind the tank and then explodes sending all of the shrapnel magically backwards of course killing my entire crew. It’s indefensible at this point. If we have to aim with AP then you should have to aim with APHE.
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I got better videos for that. Check my Flakpanzer 341 videos on my YouTube.
Nothing is safe from APHE. And the broken nature of APHE isn’t in question.
I should have been in trouble, anyway, if their T34 had his brain powered on, lol.
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I don’t have footage of it but I remember killing an open top AA by sending an APHE through a crewmember that somehow detonates the fuse and kills the entire crew. Absolute cinema
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AP usually offers increased base penetration over APHE (not always, but often) and later vehicles utilizing AP offer some kind of advantage (stabs or APDS for UK, autoloaders for France).
Ive played 4 nations at 7.7 so far - Ger, US, UK and France. Planning to move to USSR once i get tired of autoloders.
If you compare my perfomance across those nations, you will find that I have best perfomance on UK and France, ie. AP nations, not germany and US, ie. APHE nations.
Solid AP in the game need to be remade, especially the American made solid APBC. The ammunition designed specifically for inclined armor is so poor in the game, while Soviet made APHEBC ammunition can penetrate and detonate the entire compartment at a strange angle. The official response is mostly that the depth of ammunition penetration is calculated uniformly by a formula, and everyone is “fair”. Yes, because of the special nature of American made AP, gaijin cannot restore them, but they cleverly provide a very high bounce rate for American made APs to prevent them from penetrating Soviet tanks known for their large angle inclined armor
This maybe proves that you are better then me at aiming but the game design problem persists. Many times, after reviewing the camera kill, I noticed that I was killed in one shot by Russian or German (aphe users) no matter where the shot went while not the same with my uk shots. Frankly I find the aphe performance (or the ap non performance) indefensible.
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Not the point I was going for
Not the point I was going for either. You are hyperfocusing at post-pen damage. Thats only part of what makes up vehicle kit.
Point I was going for that even if both UK and french 7.7 lineups are (mostly) AP, im doing better in them than in german and US 7.7 which have access to APHE; its due to UK having stabs and france having nonsensical reload rate.