There are(were) games where the tank like the Tiger for example is a treat for a limited time. Such As Company of Heroes which others have mentioned. Works like CAS in many respects, you need the points, yes, it’s OP but you have to reach it first.
I think the issue is for me and others like me is that many of WT’s problems were solved in other games 20 or even 30 years ago and it is frustrating to see the obvious being ignored. The maps are a fine example of this.
High SP cost isn’t a solution either. All you’ve done is take a shit sandwich served to me every day, and instead only served me a shit sandwich on Tuesdays. It’s still bad for the game, just bad for less time on the clock. Whenever that tank is spawned, though, it’s making the game less fun than when it isn’t, for everyone. So there’s no point / that doesn’t help anything.
Additionally, “power boosts as a reward for doing well” is poisonous to a fun game for a totally separate additional reason, which is that the most fun games are CLOSE, CLUTCH games. When you give power spikes to people already winning, you make games more often NOT-CLOSE, SWINGY curbstomps. Which are less fun. If anything, you should give power spikes to people LOSING, not to people already winning. A great example is red turtle shells in super mario kart: useless if you’re in 1st place already.
Heavy tanks are balanced currently because they can face other heavies 1.0 BRs away that make them challenging.
Without that factor, and only facing medium tanks that they deal with easier they become more powerful.
It was an example of how points can be balanced, and indeed we already do have something like that in ground RB with spawn points.
As I said - it would make for a different WT, but immediately brushing it off as impossible is just a failure to consider possibilities.
Yes indeed - well said.
There is no heavy tank I can think of that struggles against heavy tanks 1.0 BR below it. No idea what you’re talking about. The KV-1E for example–a constantly complained about “OP” tank–is 1 BR below the KW IC, which has 50% more pen that it needs to roflpen the KV-1E (while being nearly immune to the 1E itself), same for the M6A1, also roflpens it. Etc.
Not that that matters for situationally aware, decent players, since again, they can and should just not spawn heavy tanks in full uptiers at all.
Facing something 1.0 higher makes everything challenging, and is NOT the point at all!
Heavies face mediums at the same BR and even light tanks at the same BR that can kill them - that “equalization” is what makes them challenging - they do not get to be heavy vs technology of the era where being heavy was a battlefield advantage.
Yeah and it’s terrible game design in Ground RB too, what’s your point? For the exact same reasons I already went over. You didn’t actually respond to any of the reasons why it’s bad. Again, those reasons are:
Shit sandwiches only on Tuesdays, instead of every day, are still worse than nothing. i.e. Something needs to actually make the game more fun WHILE it’s in play, to be worth having it in play ANY amount of time, while an unfun thing has no place in a video game even 5% of the time. And
Giving power spikes to people already winning makes games less close, but close games are more fun.
The whole game is a shit sandwich and it’s a heavily defended and supported shit sandwich. I guess people like shit. :)
The game as a whole is very fun, I don’t know what you mean. Or at least certain BRs and modes are very fun, which I can choose to play exclusively → the game overall therefore for me is fun. People not having fun aren’t hanging around on this forum playing dozens of battles a week.
(For example I and almost all other tanker mains can and do avoid the modes that have CAS mains in them, so despite the fact that CAS is terrible game design, we can have fun anyway and stick around)
It can be fun but I heavily tailor it as best as I can and also turn a serious blind eye to much of it. Catch me in the mood to suspend disbelief and I will agree with you. If not, then all I see is 60s tanks vs 40s tanks on a modern map, Chinese vs Swedish. Utter crap if we are honest.
4 BRs of separation [decompression] for matchmaking also offers more control over similar but different vehicles than 3 BRs of separation does.
There is zero reason to reduce the BR range of matchmaking from 4 to 3, especially when most of the current 35 BRs aren’t compressed.
War Thunder is also the least compressed matchmaking tank game as is; of course there are still problems scattered around the 35 BRs that need addressing, it’s just not most, especially after 2 or 3 BRs of decompression in the last 11 months.
zero reason
The reason is more of your outcome in the game being determined by your own agency and your own skill, and less determined by RNG (of MM). Having agency is more fun than rolling dice. There’s a reason Chess is a lot more popular than backgammon.
LOL! No, skill is involved period. There are few tanks you cannot kill in a fully downtiered tank.
T-44 might not be able to do anything against Maus, and thus is compressed, but with M26 & T26E5 I can deal with Maus, especially easy using T26E5.
The only reason not to make it +/- ZERO BR, is queue times and variety. But there’s plenty of variety still at 0.7, and with 4x more players than a few years ago, there’s plenty of queue time for a 2/7 pool decrease (but not a 6/7 pool decrease)
T44 vs Maus
What does this example have anything at all to do with the whole conversation? This would be solved by +/- 0.7 BR Matchmaking, so… … wat
T26E5 I can deal with Maus
And you just wouldn’t have to, even though you can, with +/- 0.7 BR Matchmaking. You have plenty of other things that can deal with you and vice versa to play with, but we’ve removed the BS situation like with the T-44, so the game is overall better. So what? Nothing of importance lost, and something of significance gained (the removal of that BS scenario)
I should be able to, I don’t want a boring game, which is what you’re suggesting.
A boring anti-arcade game with no variety.
Too much decompression is worse than too much compression.
One you make the game boring, the other causes some stress at worst and stress is better than boredom.
Right now, less than 10 of the BRs are compressed.
This suggestion would make over 20 BRs too decompressed & thus imbalanced.
It’s 1 AM and I’m basically half-asleep…
Reading you two’s argument made me deeply confused, until I read your usernames and realized you’re not the same user xD
How is the game “more boring” by you spending your time in a T26E5 dealing with IS-3s, instead of spending that same time in an T26E5 dealing with Mauses?
You’re slightly less arbitrarily dis-favored by nothing but RNG, so your relative skill shines more. That makes it MORE fun, not more boring. I honestly have no idea what you’re going on about or how you think this makes sense. It’s not like there’s just an empty field where the Maus used to be and no gameplay at all… There’s other enemies instead, but ones more appropriate to you and less RNG advantaged.
Meanwhile we removed the T44 situation where no amount of skill mattered, as you already admitted, which was wildly unfun…
IS-3s can’t pen the T26E5 easily.
And no, matchmaking isn’t “RNG”, its even predictable; It’s so predictable I play some vehicles I exclusively get downtiers in, and some I exclusively get uptiers in.
Compression can be fixed, and is easier to fix than to rebalance the entire game around a worse matchmaking separation of 3 when we already have a superior separation of 4.
IS-3s can’t pen the T26E5 easily.
Lolwat
Even if true, what EXACTLY is your better solution to that that wouldn’t apply equally well to 0.7?
No, you don’t
If you did, that would obviously be even worse than RNG. [Fair fights] >> [RNG advantaged fights] >> [hard-coded permanently arbitrary advantaged fights]
Decompression can be fixed
yes such as by going from 1.0 to 0.7 which is literally decompression. it is logically identical to making the highest BR 17 and spreading everything out. Neither is even 1% easier or harder than the other, since they’re logically/mathematically identical and both trivial. So I mean sure, if you reallllly want to do it the identical but differently flavored way, that’s fine by me. I get the same result. Whatever.
when we already have a superior separation of 4.
So you want MORE compression then, if you think it’s superior. WHY you’d want that, you’ve neglected to give a single reason for thus far.
Decompress the compressed BRs, simple easy. Only requires analyzing the BR range once.
Changing the matchmaker requires analyzing the BR range, evaluating which vehicles need moved around after the change, and far more awareness after implementation. Far more work for worse results.
And no, going from 1.0 to 0.7 isn’t decompression, it’s COMPRESSING the matchmaker to fake-decompression that causes more issues.
If you call decompression compression, & compression decompression, that only proves me correct.