Well… that was a very different discussion
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Its a joke, hes just pretending to be racist and hes a good guy. Hes mountain general and i like his vids.
However V4 is something I highly anticipate on and its even better with Romania, which offers unique high-end vehicles to assist the modified soviet designs with western upgrades Czechia and Poland does. I still prefer looking into more Italian options and leaving HUAF independent into V4.
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But Hungary has already very clearly been given to Italy by Gaijin. And I get the impression that the V4 idea is not looking very likely anymore, not like Gaijin ever has made an alliance tech tree. Also it would make no sense to make a Visegrad 4 tech tree and then add Romania (not a member) to it as a 5th country…
I’m genuinely surprised nobody mentioned the L-39’s that Hungary operated in the Hungarian Air TT suggestion since they can very easily be added
But the Red Top is much better than the K-5 (MiG-19PM) and K-13 (MiG-21PF). The K-13 is just a worse AIM-9B and the K-5 is well… the first air-to-air missile the Soviets made. It’s terrible.
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It’s possible but like Germany they only operated the L-39ZO, which had no cannon and no means to fit one.
They can function because both can use unguided bombs. And yeah they can’t carry many of those but at the same time they are very fast compared to most of the other bombers (especially BR1150 since it’s a turbo prop.) I could agree that it will be a better Idea to move the Sf2 to the strike fighter line since it can carry rokets such as HVAR but at the same time it can be used as a bomber.
Like the only thing at the br that hungary could offer, a soviet Tu2.
Mb326 is not just a “random single trainer”, we are talking about a family with more than 10 versions that are far better than the strikemaster and most of the Italian community has been waithing soo long for it, indeed this family and the 339 family is one of the most wanted family of aircraft of the Italian tt. (the MB236 is intended to cover from rank V to rank VI and the 339 from rank VI to rank VII).
Again, same for the MB236. A family with more than 10 units. As for the flight performances, it is not very fast, but it has incredible turn rate and it can also use Electronical war sistem that would basically make it immune to every single missile at a br like 10.7. It can carry advanced AGM such as the AGM65D and it can also use the Magic 2 and Aim9L/I1 AA missiles.
Because my friend, it seem that You just did one google research on those aircraft and immediatly come back here to answer. I’ve been doing tons of research on those units for months or perhaps even years, I know what they are capable of.
Because I do not want any veichle that was not used or made by Italy. But this is just my opinion, and since I respect Your opinion to add this subtree to the game, I ask You to respect mine. Indeed, as I said before, This subtree will come sooner or later, I accepted this fact, but at the same time I do not like or approve it.
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Idk, they just seem like strange and very unconventional additions. I’m just saying that we don’t see aircraft like these in the main trees in the game currently. Anyway, you obviously know more than me about these aircraft, but my point will just be that unless these are found to fit well into the game and are better additions than the Hungarian strikers and bombers that I’ve included, at the same BR, then we don’t need to go replacing one or the other, when we can have both represented in game. And yes, I agree that the S-2F would make much more sense as a striker rather than be put into a heavy bomber line.
That’s why I said also because both are copy-pastes. The difference being that the B-24D was a single aircraft landing at the wrong airfield and the Tu-2s were actually given to Hungary in numbers and used by the HUAF.
Again, same things, you know more about these, but they still seem like strange and very unconventional additions and we don’t really see many aircraft like these in-game currently, so I just think they don’t fit too well with the sorts of aircraft Gaijin prefers to add, for example they prefer to fill bomber and striker lines with purpose-built military bomber aircraft or frontline strike aircraft, rather than advanced trainers with rank V flight performance but rank VII ordnance and weapons, or maritime patrol aircraft, submarine warfare aircraft, or even anti-insurgency aircraft. They just seem a bit out of place compared to the aircraft in my suggestion, and on top of that they would be very difficult to balance and successfully implement; I mean super slow rank V flight performance with immunity to missiles, and rank VII-VIII missiles and ordnance? How would you balance that? But again, unless these are found to fit well into the game and are better additions than the Hungarian strikers and bombers that I’ve included, at the same BR, then we don’t need to go replacing one or the other, when we can have both represented in game.
Ok, I see why you disapprove of my subtree - you have the “purist” mentality, but that’s an unreasonable way to look at WT tech trees; none of them are “pure”, and Gaijin and most players have no intention of making them “pure”. Subtrees are present in several trees (UK, Sweden, Italy, possibly Japan next), and even where they aren’t, you still see even smaller nations being tagged onto bigger tech trees (e.g. Argentina for Germany, Australia + New Zealand + Poland (and commonwealth in general) for the UK, Czechoslovakia for the USSR, Romania for Italy, any Nordic country for Sweden, etc.). Basically no tech tree is entirely “pure”. Anyway, how does it hurt you to have “impure” tech trees with vehicles from more countries? They are just options that nobody forces you to play. You can still never touch a non-Italian vehicle, and have fun with pure Italian-only lineups, while allowing others to play vehicles from other nations, I don’t see how it “hurts” you.
Exactly the same reasons I just outlined when discussing @Il_Signor_Regio’s ideas to replace the Hungarian strikers and bombers in the Italian lines with Italian trainer jets that are too slow but have too modern and advanced weapons. I just don’t see them being very good fits, and I suppose Gaijin doesn’t either, which is why we have barely any trainer aircraft in-game. See, at least I’m consistent with my views, no matter the country.
Again more problems with trainer aircraft being used as frontline combat aircraft.
Ok, fine, whether they are terrible or not, I included them because at least they are new variants that aren’t in the game yet. Surely people would appreciate a new but weak variant rather than an existing copy-paste variant?
That doesn’t mean they can’t be added, they fit gaijin implementation rules.
Gamewise it make zero difference. And also, since we are talking about the bomber line, the B24D can cover this role better since it’s a strategic bomber (aka more suited for Air battles), while the Tu2 is more an assault bomber (therefore more suited for ground battles).
this will probably be the best compromise for both, but If You see how gaijin works, they will just implement one of the two and say “You have this and nothing similar will be added.”
A10,su25 and AMX exist.
Also You consider only the aircraft speed, while omitting most of the other factors. Indeed, the only point were the Su22 is superior are speed and unguided bomb lodout. For make a compromise, gaijin could implement the Su22 as the top of the bomber line (since it’s faster and has more bombs for arb) while the various MB339 could be implemented in the attacker line (since they are slower, but with better flight performance and superior precision guided munitions).
My main problem is that , I know how GJ works, If they have a coiche between adding a copy paste and a new 3d models, they will go for the first option. If It will be possible to have both at the same time then no problems, but knowing gj that would not happen.
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Blockquote And then you mention that you can already get the MiG-29 in two nations already, when you just used a MiG-29 as your justification for why a Romanian subtree should replace my Hungarian one…
the romanian Mig 29 spider is somehow more unique that the hungerian one, that would be just a poor reskin of the Germen Mig 29.
The Mig21 lancer is unique because it can mount Python-3 missels.
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Please sort out your grammar, it’s hurting my eyes now.
Israeli modified Soviet plane is your idea of a way better addition than anything Hungary offers? Even better than actually indigenous Hungarian aircraft?
Oh wow! That’s incredible! It can mount different missiles! So you think mounting different missiles makes an aircraft unique…
…but then you say that Hungarian-modified CR.32s, CR.42s, and Re.2000s with different engines, guns, armour, propellers, fuel tanks, etc. are just “literally already in the Italian tree” and that they are copy-pastes that are not unique at all.
Foreign plane modified by Romania = super unique addition, better than any Hungarian plane
Foreign plane modified by Hungary = literally unmodified boring copy-paste crap
Huge hypocrite.
You are quite ignorant. Romenia had his own PZL variants like P.11f , the P.24 and P.43. You are proposing some biplane reconnaissance aircraft wm16 with a max speed of 215 km\h ( no way that this will be added) and the a fourth cr32. A better pick for the hungerian tech tree would be the PZL 11 and the Avia 534
Clearly you didn’t even read my information on the WM-16B. The A variant was reconnaissance, but the B variant that I am suggesting is a light bomber. I clearly stated that it has a max speed of 300 km/h, so maybe put on your glasses when you try to read numbers. It can pretty easily be added and is a typical 1.0-1.3 light biplane bomber.
Ironic when you know nothing about the aircraft you talk about.
Wow! Polish aircraft that were modified by Romania… tell me, how exactly are these more indigenous and unique than the Hungarian-designed WM-16B and WM-21? How are Romanian-modified Polish aircraft more unique and relevant to Italy than Hungarian-modified Italian aircraft?
How on Earth would these one-off captured Polish and Czech aircraft be better for Hungary than Hungarian and Hungarian-modified Italian aircraft???
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don’t take it personally
The MÁVAG Héja II is besically a just a rearmed Re2000. Nothing speciall here. This plane was outdated when introduced and was used mostly for traning. The IAR 80 is far more interesing plane for some one who is not obsessed with the hungerian tech tree.
You know that we already have the SM79B an Italian Bomber that was modified by the Romanians. Your argument also works for the Romanians, to some degree
Don’t take it personally
The MiG-21 lancer is basically just a rearmed MiG-21. Nothing special here.
You have some interesting double standards.
(BTW, the MÁVAG Héja II has much more modifications than just different, Hungarian guns, it has a new Hungarian engine for starters, new propellers and armour, more fuel tanks, etc.)
Says the guy who hates Hungarian aircraft and is obsessed with Romanian aircraft. And like sure, a plane we already have in-game that nobody plays, but an even worse version with a weak French engine and shitty Belgian light machine guns is so damn interesting. That’s why nobody plays the more interesting version with German cannons that we have in-game. You’re full of crap.
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For someone who not is obsessed with the HU air tree I would assume that fighter planes are more enjoyable than some slow bi plane recone bombers.
Romenia could also add the IAR 39 instead of the WM -16/21
Dude,
You said Hungarian modified Italian aircraft are just boring copy-paste that nobody wants.
Then you said Romanian modified Polish aircraft are actually way more interesting and fit better into the Italian tree (they don’t).
Now you are saying the Romanian modified Italian bomber is so great.
Clearly you just have double standards and will criticise anything Hungarian, while promoting equivalent Romanian stuff…
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That’s why in my suggestion I included both.
I have Hungarian modified Italian fighters.
I have indigenous Hungarian light bomber biplanes.
Now you come here saying “that Hungarian stuff is all trash, look at my better Romanian stuff”
You are suggesting Romanian modified Polish fighters (inferior addition)
You are suggesting an indigenous Romanian light bomber biplane (equivalent addition)
Tell me how your equivalent and inferior additions are so much better and more unique?
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